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Observing >> Deep Sky Observing

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Lard Greystoke
super member


Reged: 07/27/08
Posts: 199
Loc: Ohio
2 Weeks of Peace and Quiet
      #2571495 - 08/10/08 03:17 AM

With waxing moon it will be 2 long weeks before I head out again no matter how clear the skies are. However:

Whenever I do deep-sky observing it involves:
1) 80 minute drive each way;
2) 70 pounds of telescope into and out of house and car;
3) when I get home at 3 AM mister Dog is ready for his walk.

This being the case, there is something to be said for a bit of rest. Wonder if anyone else has similar mixed feelings about the lunar layoff.

--------------------
Lard Greystoke

10" Odyssey Compact

"With Tantor, the elephant, he made friends. How? Ask me not."


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VanJan
super member


Reged: 07/09/08
Posts: 116
Re: 2 Weeks of Peace and Quiet new [Re: Lard Greystoke]
      #2571637 - 08/10/08 07:38 AM

"Lunar layoff" is a wonderfully descriptive phrase! And, yes, a break from the routine (in partcular, your routine, Whew!, you have my admiration) can be reinvigorating so that the question of "Why am I putting myself through all this?" never enters the mind under a dark, moonless sky.

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Nick Lloyd
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 10/24/06
Posts: 1641
Loc: cincinnati
Re: 2 Weeks of Peace and Quiet new [Re: VanJan]
      #2572003 - 08/10/08 12:01 PM

The lunar layoff allows me nights to schedule other things... dinner with friends, gigs (I play music), and evenings with the girl. Everyone that knows me understands that I'm not available between 3rd quarter and 4-day old moon.

--------------------
"The best scope is the one you use." -rcg




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AlanK
super member


Reged: 01/26/07
Posts: 130
Loc: Auckland, New Zealand
Re: 2 Weeks of Peace and Quiet new [Re: Lard Greystoke]
      #2572683 - 08/10/08 05:42 PM

The lunar layoff is a time to catch up on lost sleep and also plan for the next moon free period and most importantly stay with the Wife! I guess it would also be physically and mentally exhausting if there was no Moon. If this whole forum site was for deep sky observing only then maybe it could be called Cloudyormoonlitnights.com

--------------------
Clear skies!

12.5 inch f5.4 reflector
18 inch f4.5 Obsession #1637
Auckland NZ
6,116 deep sky objects incl 4,268 ngcs

If it's up there, I'll look for it!


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John Fitzgerald
In Focus
*****

Reged: 01/04/04
Posts: 1253
Loc: AR
Re: 2 Weeks of Peace and Quiet new [Re: AlanK]
      #2573021 - 08/10/08 08:17 PM

Same here. 50 mile drive each way, spend one or two nights in the cabin. Pack up the scope, lock up the obs, and wait until next LQ moon. Some months I get two observing trips, depending on the moon and weather.

--------------------
?
Observing since 1966
Messier Cert #898


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Fiske
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 03/14/04
Posts: 2057
Loc: Missouri / United States
Re: 2 Weeks of Peace and Quiet new [Re: John Fitzgerald]
      #2573827 - 08/11/08 08:09 AM

Lard:

Thanks for this post! The last Orion catalog that arrived on my doorstep has a cover that states "Vacation in your own backyard." I was disappointed to find the catalog itself doesn't deliver with any sort of article or serious treatment of the subject.

I do about 80% of my observing from my backyard in midtown Kansas City. I like to observe from dark sky sites, don't get me wrong, but I get the impression many observers only want to view from dark sites which is a very different orientation from my own.

It would be wonderful to have dark skies over my house, but not at the expense of daily commute times of an hour or more each way to say nothing of the gas prices. And the truth is that after living for 20 years in midtown KC, my wife and I love it here. We don't want to live anywhere else. Even with the light pollution, there is still plenty for a DSO fan to see.

How many times do you have to pack everything up and truck off to a dark site only to get clouded out?

How many nights are you really willing to keep your wife up to 3:00 AM, worried about you falling asleep at the wheel on the way home?

How many days do you want to stumble into the office, bleary-eyed, 30 minutes late?

And talk about dew problems??? Dew is almost never an issue in my backyard. If I see any at all, my first thought is thank goodness I'm not out in the country. I and my gear would be soaked!

It's nice to have a glass of vino with Elly, chat about our day, fix dinner together, watch something on the telly, and THEN do an hour or two (or, maybe four) of observing.

The moon isn't setting until 1:00 AM? If I'm really determined to see something, I go to bed a little earlier and get up after the moon has set for a quick observing session.

I forgot some piece of gear? Gee, let me go back into the house for it.

Serious call of nature? (A good time not to be totally immersed in nature!)

Midnight snack?? It's nice to have the fridge 30 feet away.

No horny teens, gun toting vigilanties (yup, I've encountered them), curious (usually friendly) spot light wielding sherriffs deputies, etc., etc.

And finally, I'm not necessarly the most social observer. It's fun, once in a while, to get together with observing buddies and do some astronomy and, frankly, a lot of yacking. BUT, the peace and solitude of my own backyard is conducive to concentration, detailed study of the night sky, and complete relaxation. Things I prize.

We have had a lot of rainy weekends this year. I haven't been to a dark site yet in 2008, but I have done a lot of astronomy.

--------------------

Fiske Miles
Nikon 8x42 LX / 12x50 SE Binos
Mini Borg 60ED, TV-101, AT80Ach, XT-8, C11/CI-700, 22-Inch Dob
Way too many Nagler eyepieces
http://www.fiskemiles.blogspot.com/
www.fiskemiles.com


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AlanK
super member


Reged: 01/26/07
Posts: 130
Loc: Auckland, New Zealand
Re: 2 Weeks of Peace and Quiet new [Re: Fiske]
      #2575212 - 08/11/08 07:45 PM

Whether you are happy to observe in your own backyard or not depends on your situation and also what sort of objects you are after. For myself, its mostly faint fuzzies which aren't good from my own place as I live only about 200m from a motorway. Fortunately, it only takes about 30-40 minutes to drive to my relatively dark site.

Before going out, a little research is always done by looking at satellite pictures, rainfall radars and forecasts and then combining all that with the experience of local conditions of the observing site. We can still get clouded out but are more aware of the risk and can make a better decision before burning up that expensive gas. We also lucky to have a very good facility which is on private land and not visible from the road that also has a cloud sensor, power for the scopes, somewhere to store gear and somewhere to sleep after those long dawn breaking sessions
as well as a light cooking facility.

The Wife can sleep easy and most times doesn't even know the time I came back

--------------------
Clear skies!

12.5 inch f5.4 reflector
18 inch f4.5 Obsession #1637
Auckland NZ
6,116 deep sky objects incl 4,268 ngcs

If it's up there, I'll look for it!


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Silicon Owl
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 11/25/05
Posts: 943
Loc: Waimea, Hawaii
Re: 2 Weeks of Peace and Quiet new [Re: Fiske]
      #2575516 - 08/11/08 10:11 PM

Quote:

I do about 80% of my observing from my backyard in midtown Kansas City. I like to observe from dark sky sites, don't get me wrong, but I get the impression many observers only want to view from dark sites which is a very different orientation from my own.





So very true, for all of the reasons you give! I can not do much visual astronomy from my driveway thanks to the streetlights. But a filter blows away the sodium yellow allowing me to do all of the astrophotography I want. I too have gotten in more astronomy close to home than from a dark site this year.

Andrew

--------------------
Andrew Cooper

Personal Website and CN Gallery
Handmade 18" Dob / NS11GPS / 6" RFT / 90mm APO / TV-76 ...and a twin 10m
"I have loved the stars too fondly to be fearful of the night." --Sarah Williams


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AlanK
super member


Reged: 01/26/07
Posts: 130
Loc: Auckland, New Zealand
Re: 2 Weeks of Peace and Quiet new [Re: Silicon Owl]
      #2575635 - 08/11/08 11:24 PM

Quote:



I can not do much visual astronomy from my driveway thanks to the streetlights. But a filter blows away the sodium yellow allowing me to do all of the astrophotography I want.
Andrew





Would definitely agree with that. For Deep Sky, a dark site is not so crucial for astrophotography although it still helps. I once saw a stunning photo of M83 taken with loads of detail on the spiral arms etc., The 'catch' - it was taken from the roof of a university building downtown surrounded by the city lights and skyscrappers!

--------------------
Clear skies!

12.5 inch f5.4 reflector
18 inch f4.5 Obsession #1637
Auckland NZ
6,116 deep sky objects incl 4,268 ngcs

If it's up there, I'll look for it!


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Lard Greystoke
super member


Reged: 07/27/08
Posts: 199
Loc: Ohio
Re: 2 Weeks of Peace and Quiet new [Re: AlanK]
      #2575826 - 08/12/08 02:19 AM

Quote:

Before going out, a little research is always done by looking at satellite pictures, rainfall radars and forecasts and then combining all that with the experience of local conditions of the observing site.




One big difference in the last 20 years is the Internet. I use weatherforyou and weather underground - the former has better satellite pictures, but weather underground has a "scientific forecasters discussion" which gives more detail about the raw data which typically gets left out of the 300-mile radius of the forecast, but can give important clues about your target area. Also the aviation forecast often discusses cloud layers in more detail.

--------------------
Lard Greystoke

10" Odyssey Compact

"With Tantor, the elephant, he made friends. How? Ask me not."


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Fiske
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 03/14/04
Posts: 2057
Loc: Missouri / United States
Re: 2 Weeks of Peace and Quiet new [Re: Lard Greystoke]
      #2575982 - 08/12/08 08:03 AM

The internet makes a big difference on estimating cloud cover. My favorite site is the UCAR weather imagery site. It offers a terrific visible satellite loop applet. Even visible satellite is not 100% reliable, though. And I have been fooled more than once.

Our club has a terrific DSS. No cloud monitor yet, but that is probably already in the works. It has 32 electrical RV hookups, a dump station, restroom facilities, etc. I haven't done a drive home after observing trip in years. Since I'm not retired, that means any DSS trip is going to be on a weekend. When you limit those to cloud-free, new moon weekends, with no social commitments, the observing opportunities become vanishingly small. Maybe 6 trips a year in a good year. Urban astronomy can be done any clear night. That opens up a LOT of observing opportunities.

Of course, some of our club members go out constantly. Several times a month. Astronomy is pretty much all they think about when they're not at work, I guess. I love astronomy, but have many other interests as well so I have to balance that out. In addition, I have to admit, I like being at home. With my wife! (Who thinks astronomy is okay but is not keen on bugs, cold weather, etc., etc.)

As far as the urban environment is concerned, I live in the city, with 4.5 mag skies on a good night. That is not as bad as it gets, I know, but it is plenty bad. It is amazing what can still be seen. I have a reasonably good situation for observing, now, but that was created by cutting down several very large trees in our backyard. (Supported by my wife because she also wanted a vegetable garden.) I lot can be done to improve the observing environment by a dedicated urban astronomer, but other issues just have to be endured or worked around. The big scope can never be set up in front of my house, on the southern exposure. It is simply a magnet for all sorts of people, some of whom you don't want to attract! That means I have to time many observations carefully for the period when an object is between the remaining trees on the East and West side of our backyard. Or, I can use a smaller scope that can be moved to the front yard after dark. Stuff like that. Smaller scopes have a lot of advantages for urban observers, not the least being they can easily be moved during an observing session.

Street lights can be a problem. We have one in front of our house (on the southern exposure). I am building a set of pvc and black plastic screens to block it when I want to observe in the front. A friend of mine has figured out how to turn off the light across from his driveway. Not sure how he does it. He has never gotten in trouble with Officer Friendly for the act, though that would worry me. I have heard of other people using laser pointers to irradiate the light sensor on the top of street lights to turn them off during an observing session. Screens seem a more reasonable approach.

I have sometimes wondered whether CloudyNights should have an Urban Observing forum, but the subject seems to be covered fairly well on the existing forums.

I do think a lot of people who might enjoy astronomy give up on it due to the logistics of DSS trips, being convinced by the general sentiment that observing from your backyard isn't worth the effort. Nothing could be further from the truth, if you ask me!

--------------------

Fiske Miles
Nikon 8x42 LX / 12x50 SE Binos
Mini Borg 60ED, TV-101, AT80Ach, XT-8, C11/CI-700, 22-Inch Dob
Way too many Nagler eyepieces
http://www.fiskemiles.blogspot.com/
www.fiskemiles.com


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Bill Weir
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 06/01/04
Posts: 892
Loc: Metchosin (Victoria), Canada
Re: 2 Weeks of Peace and Quiet new [Re: Lard Greystoke]
      #2577111 - 08/12/08 05:19 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Before going out, a little research is always done by looking at satellite pictures, rainfall radars and forecasts and then combining all that with the experience of local conditions of the observing site.




One big difference in the last 20 years is the Internet. I use weatherforyou and weather underground - the former has better satellite pictures, but weather underground has a "scientific forecasters discussion" which gives more detail about the raw data which typically gets left out of the 300-mile radius of the forecast, but can give important clues about your target area. Also the aviation forecast often discusses cloud layers in more detail.




When I want to head out to somewhere darker than my backyard, (SQM 21- 21.3) I just hit this site.
http://www.bigwavedave.ca/webcams.php
It might be a surfer site, but it tells me all that I need to know for any direction on my end of the island. Of course it only works in the daylight hours.

Bill

--------------------
6'' Orion SkyQuest
12.5'' f/5 Custom Truss Dob
William Optics 80mm ZenithStar II ED Doublet
f/5 25" newtonian on a giant GEM, any time I want

Observing sessions grand total for 2007, 171.
So far in 2008, 115


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Fiske
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 03/14/04
Posts: 2057
Loc: Missouri / United States
Re: 2 Weeks of Peace and Quiet new [Re: Bill Weir]
      #2577203 - 08/12/08 05:58 PM

Does that make you a celestial surfer??



--------------------

Fiske Miles
Nikon 8x42 LX / 12x50 SE Binos
Mini Borg 60ED, TV-101, AT80Ach, XT-8, C11/CI-700, 22-Inch Dob
Way too many Nagler eyepieces
http://www.fiskemiles.blogspot.com/
www.fiskemiles.com


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