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GLR GROUP
super member
Reged: 03/22/04
Posts: 187
Loc: Cugliate Fabiasco,(VA) (ITALY)
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Hi to all. In these days I'm comparing the William Optics 22x70 vs the Generalhit 22x85 (GARRETT in USA)
I send you a small report with my impressions
Terrestrial vision
The optics of 22x70 are little “soft” like the 22x85  The Chromatic abb. in the 22x70 is well contained and dark tones and shadows, that in 22x85 have a slight purple tonality, with this binoculars are “blacks” the eyepieces of 22x70 are identical to those of 22x85.
The field, in this type of observation is good for 70-75% of the field, but i prefer the vision of mine 15x85 (more FOV, more sharp, best eyepieces, best performance, less aberration)
Moon: W.O 22x70- strange but the lunar surface is more sharp in this binoculars, i’ve seen only a “slight yellow” on the edge brighter.
22x85: Obviously the lunar surface is brighter, but less sharp than in 22x70, impossible to see this, during my terrestrial observation. (probably for diurnal turbolence) Chromatic abb. on lunar board is more present than the 22x70 but is not so dramatic. perhaps 15% -20% more.
Jupiter: 22x70 , under a transparent sky, the planet don’t show haze, i have seen perfectly the NEB and SEB
in 22x85, because of increased brightness (?) i have seen a “slight halo” around the planet and to see SEB and NEB I had to use two filters Contrast Booster.
Double of Perseus.
22x70 . the image is good of 75% of the FOV, then appears angular distortion. the stars at the center of the field are very pinpoints
The field of 22x85 is similar (75%) the eyepieces are identical in both binoculars, in my opinion, also the 22x85 in the center of the field show pinpoints star of magn III- IV )
M81-M82 the 22x85 is "slightly" brighter, less than what I could expect from its largest diameter.
In summary
The 22x70 does not seem to me a real APO (such as the KOWA or Taka 22x60) good the idea of W.O. to ask to Chinese to build a 22x70 ( for me is a good SEMI APO but not APO)but I would have preferred a 25x110 doublets with the FLP Lens. ; i think that to create a real APO it's not sufficient to use the FPL-51 lens on an "Old" binoculars, I think that the Chinese should build a new binoculars, with new eyepieces and new prisms to run better wiht the airspace doublets. Moreover, in an optical scheme the benefits are given by the worst optical component and I particularly do not like the eyepieces of this series (22x85 and 28x110). My humble opinion is that I have not noticed an incredible performance to prefer the 22x70 to a 22x85. I do not know the price in America, but in Italy at same price i can buy 20x110, so, for astronomical observation I still prefer a good 20x110
Best Regards from Italy
Piergiovanni
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[url] www.binomania.it [/url] you can find many binoculars reviews!
[url] www.landscapephotography.it [/url] a tribute to italian and switzerland landscapes
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Wes James
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 04/12/06
Posts: 2423
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Piergiovanni-
Your experiences ran about the same with the W/O 22x70's as mine did. What bothered me most was the fact the stars went soft after about 80% of the FOV. Did not expect this in what should have been a premium binocular.
Thanks for your excellent report/comparison!
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Wes
Atlantic Beach, FL
Some bino’s from Miyauchi 5x32 Binon's up through Garrett 20x110 Signature's,
Some telescopes from a Stellarvue 80mm NHNG up through a couple of 8” reflectors…
And a wonderful 4.25" Delmarva Shiefspiegler!
Some good friends, made here on C/N.
Oh- several cats and a wonderful wife!
Anyone want a cat???? :-O
"When your work speaks for itself- Don't Interrupt" -Gamble Rogers
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GLR GROUP
super member
Reged: 03/22/04
Posts: 187
Loc: Cugliate Fabiasco,(VA) (ITALY)
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Quote:
Piergiovanni-
Your experiences ran about the same with the W/O 22x70's as mine did. What bothered me most was the fact the stars went soft after about 80% of the FOV. Did not expect this in what should have been a premium binocular.
Thanks for your excellent report/comparison!
Hi Wes, , thanks for your reply!
yes, in fact, I thought that the 22x70 could have better performance.
In any case, you have an excellent 20x110 which I consider one of the best binoculars available on the market today. For this reason your needs are greater than those that have lower quality binoculars.
Yesterday night i've compared the 22x70 and the 22x85 versus the classic 20x80 triplet and I must say that the difference , in this case, were considerable especially for the better mechanics and the better construction but your 20x110 is a different animal :-)
Under an excellent sky in high mountains (2000m) the nebula Velo in the 20x110 was really incredible and, moreover, is also an excellent binoculars for terrestrial observations.
Also the 15x85 is a great binoculars
An italian binoculars lover. some months ago, has spent 4000 euros to buy a docter aspecten of 80mm and, in the practical test, he was noticed that the performance of the 15x85 are better .. what can I say?
Hello
Piergiovanni
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[url] www.binomania.it [/url] you can find many binoculars reviews!
[url] www.landscapephotography.it [/url] a tribute to italian and switzerland landscapes
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Wes James
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 04/12/06
Posts: 2423
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Hi again, Piergiovanni-
Yes, you are correct- the Garrett 20x110's are an awesome set of optics! Their main drawback is that they require a good solid mounting system (i.e., $$$'s!)- in fact, in all probablility the mount will cost more than the binoculars themselves, but if you beat that issue- the 110's are truly spectacular. I can't wait to get them out under truly dark skies sometime.
The 85mm series binoculars sounds like a really wonderful line. Hopefully someday I may get to try a pair!
BTW-
I'd also like to ad that your binocular site looks awesome. I wish that we had something like that here- or I could read Italian!  Looks like you have a wonderful site dedicated to fine binoculars. 
Wes
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pcad
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 01/17/05
Posts: 1488
Loc: Connecticut
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Thanks Pier! I respect and trust your opinions on binoculars as I'm sure others do.
I have the 15x70 and 22x70ED and like having the extra magnification and less CA on bright objects such as the moon.
Since the 22x70 was announced I've wondered how it would compare to the 22x85 if the 85 were stopped done to 70mm? It seems that the performance is already similar and decreasing the aperture may decrease the CA to the level of the 22x70.
You like the longer focal length eye pieces of the 15x85 and the 20x110. Do you also perfer the lower mag versions of the 50mm and 70mm models?
Last time I looked at the WO site the 22x70ED was listed at $999.
Thanks again for your valuble input.
Peter
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Peter
Telescopes 25 - 318 mm
Binoculars 15 - 88 mm
Microscope 50x - 1000x
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GLR GROUP
super member
Reged: 03/22/04
Posts: 187
Loc: Cugliate Fabiasco,(VA) (ITALY)
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I can't wait to get them out under truly dark skies sometime.
I hope that you'll go under dark skies as soon possible
i've seen without problem Velo Nebula with this bino and many many celestial objects.
The 85mm series binoculars sounds like a really wonderful line. Hopefully someday I may get to try a pair!
Of the 85mm line, i prefer the 15X version..for the reasons that I mentioned in the first message
BTW-
I'd also like to ad that your binocular site looks awesome. I wish that we had something like that here- or I could read Italian! Looks like you have a wonderful site dedicated to fine binoculars.
Many many thanks for this.it's a great motivation to continue to try binoculars for binomania.it
ciao
Wes
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[url] www.binomania.it [/url] you can find many binoculars reviews!
[url] www.landscapephotography.it [/url] a tribute to italian and switzerland landscapes
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hallelujah
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 07/14/06
Posts: 1639
Loc: Colorado Rocky Mt. High
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Quote:
In any case, you have an excellent 20x110 which I consider one of the best binoculars available on the market today.
Piergiovanni
When I spoke with Zach Garrett, about the possibility of purchasing a SS 28x110mm, he recommended the 20x110mm, BECAUSE I am so "picky" about optics.
So, it is very good to hear MORE comments from those who actually OWN the 20x110mm.
My preferences normally lean toward the higher magnifications.
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Pentax 12x50mm PCF WP II FMC/WP/FP
Pentax 16x60mm PCF WP FMC/WP/FP
Pentax 20x60mm PCF WP II FMC/WP/FP
Orion 12x63mm Mini Giant FMC/JAPAN
Orion 15x70mm Little Giant II FMC/JAPAN
Orion 16x80mm Giant FMC/JAPAN
Orion 20x70mm Little Giant II FMC/JAPAN
Orion 30x80mm MEGAView FMC/JAPAN
Barska 30x80mm X-Trail LW FC
Burgess Optical Series II 20x90mm FMC/WP/FP
Handel's Messiah**Hallelujah! For the LORD God Omnipotent Reigneth
Edited by hallelujah (08/12/08 02:41 PM)
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GLR GROUP
super member
Reged: 03/22/04
Posts: 187
Loc: Cugliate Fabiasco,(VA) (ITALY)
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Hi Peter, thanks you are very kind
If you want, I can try to decrease the
objectives of 85 mm to see if the chromatic aberration decreasing. . However I believe that has not been the William Optics to opt for a 70mm, but the Chinese, that has not preferred to change their production line. I have discussed with an italian importer about binoculars importation and he has confirmed to me that, currently,are the Chinese to regulate the market and that "rarely" they accept suggestions and / or proposals. I think they have the ability to build a 110 APO, but buyers should order many units.
I know that to change and personalize only the color of external binoculars must buy at least 20 binoculars, those binoculars should buy for a new line? I think a lot.
Probably william Optics has asked them to build a new binocular APO. they replied: "Ok we can only do this if you want .. in another way we have to discuss it but you have to order many copies.
Have you seen, for example, that the binoculars from 120mm of the United Optics are sold with a insufficient mount for astronomical observations.
I have seen that even bigbinoculars.com had to build a mount specific for these big binos. In Italy Generalhit has imported 3 exemplars of 120mm and has also asked for a better mount, but they replied that he had to satisfy!
This thing shows how the Chinese are currently regulate the market .. of course is my humble opinion
Ciao!
Piergiovanni
Piergiovanni
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[url] www.binomania.it [/url] you can find many binoculars reviews!
[url] www.landscapephotography.it [/url] a tribute to italian and switzerland landscapes
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Wes James
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 04/12/06
Posts: 2423
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Quote:
When I spoke with Zach Garrett, about the possibility of purchasing a SS 28x110mm, he recommended the 20x110mm, BECAUSE I am so "picky" about optics.
So, it is very good to hear MORE comments from those who actually OWN the 20x110mm.
My preferences lean toward the higher magnifications.
Same experience here- it also was Zach's recommendation that resulted in my purchasing the 20x110's instead of the 28x110's. And while I also would prefer the higher magnification, quality of the view will always take priority over magnification for me.
Wes
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GLR GROUP
super member
Reged: 03/22/04
Posts: 187
Loc: Cugliate Fabiasco,(VA) (ITALY)
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Idem, if you remember many months ago i 'll post this message http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showthreaded.php/Cat/0/Number/1271035/page/0/view/collapsed/sb/5/o/all/vc/1
where i give my firt impression about 28x110 compared to 20x110, then, during the 2007 I have seen in both binoculars for many hours and I finally decided that the best binoculars for me could be the 20x110
However, the 28x110 binoculars would be better for astronomical observations, the real problem is not the 28X but the different eyepieces that generate many aberrations. For this reason, if the chinese will build a new 28x110 with new eyepieces, it would be better than the 20x in astronomical “under suburban skies”. For terrestrial observation i prefer 15x-20X and a good and correct FOV
I personally use, profitably, with my 100mm angled the eyepieces that generate 30X, which I consider a magnification perfect to observing the galaxies and many deep sky objects.
Let's leave out the defect of the eyepieces and speak only about 28X magnification.
With the 28x from my house,( from my garden i perceive in the clear nights m51 with the swift audubon 8x44 820 ED!) I saw better M42, M81, m82, M101, because the sky was darker and magnification improved vision, but bringing the two binoculars in the high mountains on Swiss ALPES (at 2000m) the 20x110 showed images "incredibly" full of stars with a panoramic vision enough to allow me the classic walk in the sky. You can see the nebula star in Sagittarium!!wow, incredible!
I think that many amateur astronomers who use dobson telescopes should use this great binoculars, because with him you can move in the sky, finding celestial objects with ease, while with the dobson, often, you can observed only the galaxy, but you do not see what is around the galaxy: namely a sea of stars!
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[url] www.binomania.it [/url] you can find many binoculars reviews!
[url] www.landscapephotography.it [/url] a tribute to italian and switzerland landscapes
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KennyJ
Reged: 04/27/03
Posts: 10082
Loc: Lancashire UK
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Pier ,
It is a delight to see your recent activity on this forum !
Your English seems to be improving , too ! :-)
Kind Regards
Kenny
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Two eyes and a preference to use both
Zeiss 7 x 42 BGAT
Captain's Helmsman 7 x 50
Nikon 10 x 42 Superior E
Swift Audubon Kestrel 10 x 50
Helios 15 x 70 Observation
Strathspey 20 x 90
Televue 76 APO
Zeiss 85 Diascope
Helios 102 f5 refractor
Various eyepieces barlows tripods mounts etc.
Panasonic Lumix DMC - TZ5 digital camera
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GLR GROUP
super member
Reged: 03/22/04
Posts: 187
Loc: Cugliate Fabiasco,(VA) (ITALY)
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Quote:
Pier ,
hi Kenny!
It is a delight to see your recent activity on this forum !
Thanks!
Your English seems to be improving , too ! :-)
you know that this is not true! my English is poor 
Kind Regards
Kenny
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[url] www.binomania.it [/url] you can find many binoculars reviews!
[url] www.landscapephotography.it [/url] a tribute to italian and switzerland landscapes
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Vincent33
member
Reged: 09/18/07
Posts: 95
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Quote:
Yesterday night i've compared the 22x70 and the 22x85 versus the classic 20x80 triplet and I must say that the difference, in this case, is considerable
Ciao Piergiovanni,
I haven't understood, the 20x80 triplet is better, or viceversa? Grazie.
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GLR GROUP
super member
Reged: 03/22/04
Posts: 187
Loc: Cugliate Fabiasco,(VA) (ITALY)
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Quote:
Quote:
Yesterday night i've compared the 22x70 and the 22x85 versus the classic 20x80 triplet and I must say that the difference, in this case, is considerable
Ciao Piergiovanni,
I haven't understood, the 20x80 triplet is better, or viceversa? Grazie.
Ciao Vincent, the 20x80 triplet has lower performances, obviously.
The optic is good for the price but mechanics is insufficient. I tried two exemplares and none of them maintained the collimation, it ranged to vary the inter pupillar distance.
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[url] www.binomania.it [/url] you can find many binoculars reviews!
[url] www.landscapephotography.it [/url] a tribute to italian and switzerland landscapes
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