stars_in_my_eyes
sage
Reged: 03/24/08
Posts: 453
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As light pollution continues to increase and observing time becomes more valuable because of busier schedules, I would expect a trend towards mobile observatories that one could just "grab and go" when the opportunity to view occurred.
So why are there so few MOBILE observatories?
I see mobility in an observatory as a natural progression as much as the trend for more portable scopes to use when the opportunity to view strikes.
Thanks for your thoughts on this subject.
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ColoHank
sage
Reged: 06/07/07
Posts: 209
Loc: western Colorado
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Please define "mobile observatory." By my definition, I already have one, as does everybody who has a scope of relatively modest size and weight. Do you mean something far more substantial, like a trailer or truck with an integral pier, mount and large scope?
-------------------- ---------------------
Questar 3.5 standard - pyrex and BB coatings
Powerguide II
12mm, 16mm, 24mm and 32mm Brandons
modified Bogen 3030 w/ homebuilt wedge
other odds and ends...
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"Nothing exists but atoms and empty space. Everything else is opinion."
Titus Lucretius Carus 99-55 B.C.
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rodney
domed in NJ
   
Reged: 03/08/05
Posts: 463
Loc: Asbury, NJ
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I feel the poster is talking about actual mobile observatories. Something on a trailer that can be transported to any site and any time. A grab and scope is not an observatory, it is an instrument. In that case the observing location becomes the observatory, not very mobile there. There is a gentleman out on the West coast that has a very nice mobile observatory. Merlin, he will no doubt see this post and respond after awhile.
Clear skies,
-------------------- My Explora Dome construction is here:
http://www.freewebs.com/rodbo1967/observatoryconstruction.htm
Rodney
13 Truss
C8-NGT
Orion 80mm/F11
Extremely happy owner of an Explora Dome home observatory
and a list of goodies to big for this sig
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stars_in_my_eyes
sage
Reged: 03/24/08
Posts: 453
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Quote:
I feel the poster is talking about actual mobile observatories. Something on a trailer that can be transported to any site and any time. A grab and scope is not an observatory, it is an instrument. In that case the observing location becomes the observatory, not very mobile there. There is a gentleman out on the West coast that has a very nice mobile observatory. Merlin, he will no doubt see this post and respond after awhile.
Clear skies,
Yes...I do mean an observatory that can be relocated to another site.
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csa/montana
Astro Ambassador
   
Reged: 05/14/05
Posts: 28658
Loc: montana
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If you mean trailers set up for scopes, there's the ongoing thread in Equip that you have posted in; is this what you mean?
If this is what you mean, I would guess, setting the trailer up (if a person isn't so inclined), having a vehicle able to tow it, & then a place at one's residence to store it would be the drawbacks.
-------------------- Carol
AstroTech 16" Dob (Thanks ASTRONOMICS!)
AstroTech 66ED / Vixen 80MF/AstroTech Voyager
Masuyama's 7.5, 15, 25W, 35mm,
Tak LE 5mm B/TMB 3.2
7mm Pentax XL, 10mm Pentax XW
14mm Meade 4000 UWA
22mm Pan, 35mm Pan
DreamCatcher Dobservatory, #2
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stars_in_my_eyes
sage
Reged: 03/24/08
Posts: 453
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Quote:
If you mean trailers set up for scopes, there's the ongoing thread in Equip that you have posted in; is this what you mean?
If this is what you mean, I would guess, setting the trailer up (if a person isn't so inclined), having a vehicle able to tow it, & then a place at one's residence to store it would be the drawbacks.
No...I mean an acutal observatory that one would easily transport to a viewing site and view from.
The Pier Tech offering comes to mind...
http://www.pier-tech.com/star_traveler_mobile_observatory.htm
A mobile approach would seem to be a natural progression.
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Rusty
Postmaster
   
Reged: 08/06/03
Posts: 16406
Loc: Brooker, FL
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Snaproll has a trailer with a tilt up (for transport) Explora-dome. The only actual "park and view" one I've seen in person is John Shirley's superb build:
-------------------- N11GPS Fastar
TOA-130S
MK66 Std
Vintage C5
Megrez II 80mm ED Triplet APO
SolarMax 40
NJP Temma II
Sirius EQ-G
ST8XE/CFW-8(LRGBHa)/AO-7/DF-2/STV Dlx/ST237a/350D (Unmodded)/Mallincam Color Hyper Plus/DSI III Color/DSI II Pro
Two not-spoiled Golden Retrievers - Maggie and Casey
Sometimes I think we're alone in the universe, and sometimes I think we're not. In either case the idea is quite staggering. - Arthur C. Clarke
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Snaproll
Post Laureate
   
Reged: 02/20/04
Posts: 3492
Loc: Wisconsin
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I agree 100%. I've been in quest of a mobile observatory for a while for the very reasons you mention, going somewhere dark with all the nice touches of home. A regular trailer mounted observatory has been done by several people, but the issue I see there is stability and getting it into a site to use it. Stability from the stanpoint of isolating the pier from the trailer. I've seen some rigs where they lower jacks for the trailer itself, but to be useful for imaging, you really need to have the pier mounted on the ground. I'm not real sure that can be done well. The other issue is you have to get the trailer to the site, drive it in. Most places you drive are lighted or have lights close by. So I'm not so sure a true trailer observatory is all that practical.
I had an Exploradome that traveled on a tilt trailer. The concept is great, taking a fully equipped observatory on the road that could be unloaded and setting up equipment in 10 minutes. It really was a sweet setup. It was nice getting somewhere and being able to set up and just leave the equipment, lock it up during the day and know it was safe. The Exploradome is fine for one person, so when I went to remote sites alone it was ok. But going to outreach events or star parties, everybody wanted to pile in and there wasn't enough room for more than one or two people and gear.
I switched to an Astrogazer and mounted my portable ED at home. There were some tradeoffs. The AG is like a tent, metal frame and fabric covered. It has a rotating dome and is larger once set up than the ED. The downside is that it is really not lockable or as weatherproof as the ED. The setup time is also longer, about an hour, then you have to load the gear. The AG is much easier to store when it is broken down and easier to trail. It's three bags would easily fit in my truck, but wouldn't leave enough room for telescope gear so I built a box for the trailer I had the ED on. The box has less wind resistance and a lower CG so it is easier to trailer.
I thought about a POD for a while but just didn't see any practical way to disassemble it, haul it and set it up alone. Short of buying an enclosed trailer I don't know how you could strap down all the pieces of plastic and not worry about losing some of them. Then there's the setup time on site. I imagine it would be about the same setup time as the AG.
Of the three "portable" choices, there's no hands down winner. The portable ED probably offered the best as an all-round portable observatory, a shutter, solid weather protection, lockable, good temperature control, fast setup. But it was like pulling a camper for my little truck. The AG just made more sense as a portable, much smaller to store, easier to trailer, sets up larger, offers everything except the lockability and has a longer setup time, those were the main tradeoffs. I guess what tipped the scales for me is the AG's ability to get into remote sites you can't really drive to and the ability to set up on uneven ground.
Some people just shake their heads when they see me setting up the gear, but once it's done, nothing beats having the comforts and protection of an observatory, a large aperture scope under a remote site perfect 10 sky.
-------------------- -Jim-
Happiness is a clear sky and a Denk II
old AP images and some new C14 Hyperstar images
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FarrOut
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 02/24/05
Posts: 786
Loc: Tampa
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Quote:
As light pollution continues to increase and observing time becomes more valuable because of busier schedules, I would expect a trend towards mobile observatories that one could just "grab and go" when the opportunity to view occurred.
So why are there so few MOBILE observatories?
I guess for the same reason very little astronomy is done on ships. Stability.
-------------------- Criterion RV6
NEXSTAR 11-GPS
NEXSTAR SLT102
Starshoot CCD
Sky Scout
A wonderful wife that let's me do this stuff
Telescopes are for after you learn astronomy.
http://www.farrout.org
http://www.marsastro.org
Astronomy is looking up!
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Chris Schroeder
Postmaster
   
Reged: 12/11/04
Posts: 5099
Loc: N.E. WI Sky Glow
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Quote:
Some people just shake their heads when they see me setting up the gear, but once it's done, nothing beats having the comforts and protection of an observatory, a large aperture scope under a remote site perfect 10 sky.
Right you are Jim, and everybody wants to join you when a cloud burst comes along, asking to store their gear in the AG  For what it’s worth, I think Jim has made the best argument for in field mobile observatory. The size alone makes it very remote star party friendly.
-------------------- Chris
Mallincam Color Hyper Plus
10" DSH with SC DSC, CPC 800 XLT
M102ED S.V., ZS 80FD 10th Anniv, ZS 66SD, PST
POD XL3 http://POD.SchroederCity.com
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Pier-Tech Inc.
Vendor (Pier Tech Inc)
Reged: 04/24/07
Posts: 36
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Hi Jim: Our mobile observatories do isolate the pier from the trailer floor. You can jump around the trailer floor and not move the pier/scope. The pier goes directly to ground and is 100% isolated. We have customers currently doing ccd imaging with our mobile observatories with great results. Setup takes approx 10 minutes. Let me know if you need specifics. I would be glad to explain.
-------------------- Vito Rotondi
Pier-Tech Inc.
www.pier-tech.com
630-841-6848
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astrotrf
sage
Reged: 09/30/07
Posts: 287
Loc: Rodeo, NM
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I used to have a mobile observatory. Down at one of the salvage yards by Davis-Monthan AFB, there were a few old mobile radar trailers built by some outfit called Dynalectron. I bought one and had it modified to house my 12.5" Cave Newtonian.
It worked quite well visually; I never tried astrophotography with it. There was a mechanism to allow the pier to decouple from the trailer and rest on a ground-mounted pad, though -- so it would probably have worked well.
The New Mexico Museum of Space History used to have one of these out in their parking lot; it may still be there.
I sold it when I started working on my own permanent building out in the middle of nowhere.
-------------------- Terry (astrotrf)
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astrotrf
sage
Reged: 09/30/07
Posts: 287
Loc: Rodeo, NM
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Quote:
Please define "mobile observatory." By my definition, I already have one, as does everybody who has a scope of relatively modest size and weight.
You'd have gotten on well with my wife. I had a scope in the living room and a concrete pad out back. *She* thought I already had an observatory until I started to actually build one.
-------------------- Terry (astrotrf)
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Snaproll
Post Laureate
   
Reged: 02/20/04
Posts: 3492
Loc: Wisconsin
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Quote:
Hi Jim: Our mobile observatories do isolate the pier from the trailer floor. You can jump around the trailer floor and not move the pier/scope. The pier goes directly to ground and is 100% isolated. We have customers currently doing ccd imaging with our mobile observatories with great results. Setup takes approx 10 minutes. Let me know if you need specifics. I would be glad to explain.
Hi Vito,
I would be very interested in the specs. I think I have see photos of your mobile observatory. They look very nice professionally done setup, but if I recall, the $$ very steep in the 10's of thousands, which is out of my price range. The poor man's setups that I've had are under $3500 including the trailer. Not nearly as eligant, but they got the job done.
My question about the pier isolation is how well it work work off of pavement, say on uneven or somewhat sofr ground? I don't believe it would be too difficult to isolate a pier from the trailer with a drop down arrangement, but what if the ground under it is uneven? The way I see it, you'd pretty much need a tripod arrangement then. Perhaps a pier with long horizontal lets with some type of leveling pads?
If your mobile observatory is the one I'm thinking of, it is really beautiful. I wouldn't mind demoing one for a year, or two... or three... 
I'm also curious about a rig like that, how do you transport the OTA? I would assume that would still need to be broken down and packed for travel, right?
-------------------- -Jim-
Happiness is a clear sky and a Denk II
old AP images and some new C14 Hyperstar images
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Pier-Tech Inc.
Vendor (Pier Tech Inc)
Reged: 04/24/07
Posts: 36
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Hi Jim,
yes, we use a tripod arangement that electrically extends from below the trailer and lifts the pier and scope approx 1" above the trailer floor thus isolationg the pier. Each isolation pad is independently adjustable (electrically) allowing the user to level the pier. Our customers leave the scope and mount attached during transport. We developed a shock and vibration dampner that is mounted between the pier top and the mount/telescope. the dampner allows the scope and mount to sway so very slightly during sudden stops and bumps on the road, but is rigid enough to not move during mount slewing and ccd imaging sessions.
-------------------- Vito Rotondi
Pier-Tech Inc.
www.pier-tech.com
630-841-6848
Edited by Pier-Tech Inc. (08/30/08 10:22 PM)
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Snaproll
Post Laureate
   
Reged: 02/20/04
Posts: 3492
Loc: Wisconsin
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How well does it do to set up on uneven ground? What's the weight of the unit? Tire size etc? I think you had a couple different models, but say "the smallest one"?
-------------------- -Jim-
Happiness is a clear sky and a Denk II
old AP images and some new C14 Hyperstar images
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Pier-Tech Inc.
Vendor (Pier Tech Inc)
Reged: 04/24/07
Posts: 36
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Hi Jim: Because the pier isolation platform is independent of the trailer when the trailer is parked, it doesn't matter whether the trailer is on uneven ground. Also, the pier isolation platform can be leveled independently from the trailer. So the trailer can be unlevel, and the pier isolation platform can be level.
The weight of our smallest Star Traveler is 2300 lbs.
-------------------- Vito Rotondi
Pier-Tech Inc.
www.pier-tech.com
630-841-6848
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nytecam
Post Laureate
Reged: 08/20/05
Posts: 4817
Loc: London UK
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You didn't define what type of observation was to be made once the observatory was hauled to a remote site If visual then just the scope alone, maybe a large one, would surely be adequate without the need for an enlosing observatory structure. If it's for imaging then there's a quantum leap of stellar penetration of CCD over visual, which can be done from home even with light pollution, in my experience, so here's no need to shift the dome and equipment elsewhere
-------------------- Nytecam 51N 0.1W
Meade 30cm LX200+ETX-70+DS-2090+C8+Ha+CaK PSTs SBIG SGS+homebuilt spectrographs
Starlight SXVF_M9/Lodestar/Canon 300D DSLR/Fuji E550
My observatory build-ETX-70 imaging-spectro page
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Snaproll
Post Laureate
   
Reged: 02/20/04
Posts: 3492
Loc: Wisconsin
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Quote:
If it's for imaging then there's a quantum leap of stellar penetration of CCD over visual, which can be done from home even with light pollution, in my experience, so here's no need to shift the dome and equipment elsewhere
I don't know if I agree with that. My best imaging has been done from dark sites, and certainly the best visual is from dark sites. Granted you can do a lot with LPR filters when imaging but it's like using glasses to get 20/20 vision. You're probably better off just having 20/20 vision is my thought. If the sky glow background is 13th magnitude, and you're trying to image 13th magnitude galaxies, LPR filters are not going to help as much as simply clear skies.
Whether imaging or visual, having an observatory in the field is definitely a plus. Dew and wind factors are minimized. The equipment can be left set up and protected from elements better than a tarp or cover. Books, computers and charts can be used with ease on red lighted tables.
There is no question that hauling all the gear to a remote site is a lot of work, but my thought is, if you're making the effort to get to a dark site and enjoy a perfect 10 night sky, it's worth the effort because of the results, both visual as well as imaging. It's just more enjoyable having all the 'comforts of home', even if it takes longer to set up.
-------------------- -Jim-
Happiness is a clear sky and a Denk II
old AP images and some new C14 Hyperstar images
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PhilCo126
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 01/14/05
Posts: 1300
Loc: coastline of Belgium
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Belgian Amateur Astronomers are building SAM Scientific Astronomical Mobile a truck with periscope pier capable of taking 70 kilograms of equipment
-------------------- TS 152/1200 ( f 7.90 ) Achromatic Refractor
Saving/Looking for 180/1620 ( f 9 ) Refractor
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