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George N
sage
Reged: 05/19/06
Posts: 311
Loc: Binghamton & Indian Lake NY
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Here's (http://tinyurl.com/5zcucy) an interesting article from a news paper in Athens Georgia, where they plan to turn off many street lights to save money.
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George N
Obsession 20
Optical Guidance Systems 10" F/9 R-C Cass
6" F/5 & 8" F/8 home-made Newts
MI-250 mount
SBIG STL-1301E CCD
Member, International Dark-Sky Association
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ForgottenMObject
Post Laureate
Reged: 09/11/04
Posts: 3585
Loc: Maryland, US
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About 10+ miles to the north of me stands the gates to one of the most violent cities in the nation (Baltimore), and the skyglow is visible from many miles away. When driving over some nearby hills at night, I can look north and see the horrid orange sky, glowing like some human mockery of Mordor from the Lord of the Rings.
If lights prevented crime, that infernal place would be crime-free.
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Matthew
IDA member
XT8i, 10x50 binoculars, lots of eyepieces
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Achernar
Post Laureate
Reged: 02/25/06
Posts: 3721
Loc: Alabama, USA
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That's a good way of describing a city......like East St. Louis IL. If Tolkien has been there, he could very well had based Mordor on the prison like aspects of that urban wasteland.
Taras
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10-inch F/4.5 Discovery Dob
6-inch F/8 Homebuilt Dob
4 1/4-inch F/4 Homebuilt reflector
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ForgottenMObject
Post Laureate
Reged: 09/11/04
Posts: 3585
Loc: Maryland, US
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Can you tell I am not a city sort of guy! 
The truth is: becoming a criminal doesn't grant you night-vision, nor do lights scare away criminals like sunlight repels vampires. While we certainly need some well-placed, well-chosen lights, too much light is wasteful and, if anything, lets the criminals freely scout out areas to commit crimes without looking suspicious (such as walking around in a dark area with a flashlight on.)
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Matthew
IDA member
XT8i, 10x50 binoculars, lots of eyepieces
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Achernar
Post Laureate
Reged: 02/25/06
Posts: 3721
Loc: Alabama, USA
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On the contrary, the way bright lights are used aids and abets criminals. They create shadows in which they use to ambush people, or elude police.
Taras
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10-inch F/4.5 Discovery Dob
6-inch F/8 Homebuilt Dob
4 1/4-inch F/4 Homebuilt reflector
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RussL
Music Maker
Reged: 03/18/08
Posts: 1609
Loc: Cayce, SC
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Quote:
I can look north and see the horrid orange sky, glowing like some human mockery of Mordor from the Lord of the Rings.
And here am I, abiding in Minas Tirith ever under the watchful Eye of Sauron only four miles distant. 
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--Russell
"Akita mani yo." Observe everything as you walk. (--Lakota)
Celestron Celestar 8 Standard SCT, f10
Celestron 80mm Wide View ref., f5
Criterion RV-6 Dynascope, Newt., f8, (c. 1962)
Sears Discoverer 60mm ref., f7, (c. 1973)
Celestron Ultima DX 10x50, 6.5 TFOV
Tasco 7x35 wide
Several mediocre eyepieces
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ForgottenMObject
Post Laureate
Reged: 09/11/04
Posts: 3585
Loc: Maryland, US
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Sauron's gaze is long, it seems...
Another silly thing crosses my mind: in Baltimore, they've had problems with crooks stealing the street lights (for the scrap metal value), so even if one likes excessive light, the crooks can quickly steal the lights they don't want around and reshape the lighting to better suit their criminal needs (less light in the back alleys while leaving the lights in areas where they target victims, break into places, etc.)
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Matthew
IDA member
XT8i, 10x50 binoculars, lots of eyepieces
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George N
sage
Reged: 05/19/06
Posts: 311
Loc: Binghamton & Indian Lake NY
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Quote:
....the crooks can quickly steal the lights they don't want around and reshape the lighting to better suit their criminal needs....
Wow! If those crooks are that good at planning they should have become investment bankers…… or “rural electrification” lobbyists for the power companies! 
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George N
Obsession 20
Optical Guidance Systems 10" F/9 R-C Cass
6" F/5 & 8" F/8 home-made Newts
MI-250 mount
SBIG STL-1301E CCD
Member, International Dark-Sky Association
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ForgottenMObject
Post Laureate
Reged: 09/11/04
Posts: 3585
Loc: Maryland, US
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Hahaha - maybe I exaggerate a bit, but still - if the crime is really bad, the criminals can just steal the lighting; unlike vampires, criminals are not turned to dust by bright lights!
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Matthew
IDA member
XT8i, 10x50 binoculars, lots of eyepieces
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Tonk
Post Laureate
Reged: 08/19/04
Posts: 3580
Loc: Leeds, UK, 54N
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Quote:
that good at planning they should have become investment bankers
I think my 6 year old could have done better than the current lot 
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Televue 85, GM-8/Gemini, Canon 10D
Coronado SM60/BF10, Baader Herschel Wedge
Leeds Sky Clock Ripon Sky Clock
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csa/montana
Astro Ambassador
Reged: 05/14/05
Posts: 28654
Loc: montana
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Folks, back on topic, please.
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Carol
AstroTech 16" Dob (Thanks ASTRONOMICS!)
AstroTech 66ED / Vixen 80MF/AstroTech Voyager
Masuyama's 7.5, 15, 25W, 35mm,
Tak LE 5mm B/TMB 3.2
7mm Pentax XL, 10mm Pentax XW
14mm Meade 4000 UWA
22mm Pan, 35mm Pan
DreamCatcher Dobservatory, #2
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ForgottenMObject
Post Laureate
Reged: 09/11/04
Posts: 3585
Loc: Maryland, US
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Sorry about that:
Back on topic - I wonder if utility companies will start "spreading the word" regarding the benefits of reducing unneeded lighting. Down here in Maryland, the local utility is always advertising on TV (especially during peak seasons) ways for individuals to reduce electrical consumption; they really should do the same type of thing for business and cities since they eat up at least as much power as individual homes.
Has anyone seen much of anything in this regard? A utility company saying, "Please, turn off the lights or we'll have a brown-out!" is a lot more convincing than astronomers talking about light pollution, IMHO.
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Matthew
IDA member
XT8i, 10x50 binoculars, lots of eyepieces
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csa/montana
Astro Ambassador
Reged: 05/14/05
Posts: 28654
Loc: montana
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Our power company sends out a brochure with the billing, that gives many suggestions on ways of cutting electricity in the home; coupons for the flourescent bulbs also are sent periodically.
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Carol
AstroTech 16" Dob (Thanks ASTRONOMICS!)
AstroTech 66ED / Vixen 80MF/AstroTech Voyager
Masuyama's 7.5, 15, 25W, 35mm,
Tak LE 5mm B/TMB 3.2
7mm Pentax XL, 10mm Pentax XW
14mm Meade 4000 UWA
22mm Pan, 35mm Pan
DreamCatcher Dobservatory, #2
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