Showstoppah
member
Reged: 08/27/08
Posts: 24
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Hi folks im new to the forums so Hi!!! I was just wondering if there were any other pushto/goto dobs out there besides the Orion ones. Thanks in advance!
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Showstoppah
member
Reged: 08/27/08
Posts: 24
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Sorry I meant to post this in the beginner forums
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rmollise
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 07/06/07
Posts: 1662
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Quote:
Hi folks im new to the forums so Hi!!! I was just wondering if there were any other pushto/goto dobs out there besides the Orion ones. Thanks in advance!
Any Dob can become a "push-to" with the simple addition of a digital setting circle system like the Sky Commander or Argo Navis and a pair of encoders and the appropriate mounting hardware.
Me? I put a set of Sky Commanders on my ol' 12-inch Dobbie, and have used her more than ever before since I did.
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Uncle Rod
Watch for Rod's New Book:
Choosing and Using a New CAT--coming in December!
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Mike B
Starstruck
Reged: 04/06/05
Posts: 4460
Loc: shake, rattle, & roll, CA
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Hi Showstoppah- welcome to CN! 
Quote:
any other pushto/goto dobs out there besides the Orion ones.
AFAIK, not ready to go outta the box. Like Rod says, ya gotta tinker a bit to add 'em. And they're typically a bit pricier than Orion's Intelliscope.
AS long as Orion is clearing their "old" Intellidobs out at discount prices, they are THE rig to get! But if you wanna go another Dob route, you can buy & install your own DSCs.
The wildcard in this mix is buying "used"- but i'm kinda partial to that, seein' as how i did it myself!  And my 15-incher came already outfitted with the 'SkyCommander' DSCs Rod spoke of- i use 'em ALL the time! A very handy tool, indeed.
BTW, these are all "push-to" systems. "Go-To" is another animal, costing much more of an investment, and i'm sure taking a lot more savy to install! But unless yer hooked on "gee-whiz" effects, a push-to Dob will get there as fast or faster than a Go-To, and burn a LOT less juice on the way.
 mike b
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Just for giggles- Next time when the money comes out the ATM, scream "I Won!, I Won!"
* * 15" F4.55 Starsplitter Dob * *
 Pacheco State Park
 Fremont Peak
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Showstoppah
member
Reged: 08/27/08
Posts: 24
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Thanks alot for the replies guys its appreciated 
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Brooklyn
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 07/24/08
Posts: 870
Loc: Central New Jersey
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Well consider the advantages a fully goto system has to a push to or electronically assisted push to like the orion Dob intelliscope with object locator.
If you do not have a fully goto scope which tracks the movement of the objects, you will have to constantly move the scope by hand to keep it in the eyepiece, especially at higher powers. This is most annoying because you will never be able to keep the object dead center for any longer period of time.
On a fully goto scope, the object you have selected will be in the center of the eyepiece. It will keep the object in the center on axis, where the optical performance is always the best. With a push to scope, you wont be keeping the object at perfect center reliably.
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Meade 8.25"(209.55mm) LX-90 EMC (SCT)
Albert Einstein =>
“Intellectual growth should commence at birth and cease only at death.”
“If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.”
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sixela
Postmaster
Reged: 12/23/04
Posts: 9499
Loc: Boechout, Belgium
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Quote:
If you do not have a fully goto scope which tracks the movement of the objects, you will have to constantly move the scope by hand to keep it in the eyepiece,
Not necessarily. I know many people with an Intelliscope Dob and an equatorial platform, usually a Round Table Platform (and the combination is frequently cheaper, more portable and more stable than a 10" Newt on an EQ6 with the GoTo hand controller -- let alone any combination of a GoTo GEM and a 12" Newt).
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400mm f/4.46 David Lukehurst truss Dobsonian on Tom Osypowski equatorial platform
Orion Starblast (114mm f/4 reflector, Alt/Az)
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Mike B
Starstruck
Reged: 04/06/05
Posts: 4460
Loc: shake, rattle, & roll, CA
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Quote:
I know many people with an Intelliscope Dob and an equatorial platform...
... or in mine's case, a Dob-Driver II.
DSCs + tracking mechanism = significant cost savings over a bonafide "Go-To".
This is in NO way to detract from the obvious appeal that a well-designed Go-To system offers... one where you can grab the scope & push to wherever you want, and tracking automatically resumes wherever you let it stop... and a few button-pushes will send it off in a new direction. Man, that is sweet stuff!
Yet for me, i'd sink what precious funds i had avaiable into aperture, *quality* optics, & quality mechanicals before i'd "splurge" on "Go-To". But that's *my* economics, *my* nickel. YMMV.
Quote:
This is most annoying because you will never be able to keep the object dead center for any longer period of time.
What i find kinda funny- in *my* case- is that having a fully functional Dob-Driver onboard, something i really thot to be highly important when i first got the scope, in actuality i frequently prefer to simply nudge & view. But i s'pose that's as much a testament to the Dob's good mechanicals- that its so easy to do that its even an attractive option!
 mike b
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Just for giggles- Next time when the money comes out the ATM, scream "I Won!, I Won!"
* * 15" F4.55 Starsplitter Dob * *
Pacheco State Park
Fremont Peak
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dmgriff
sage
Reged: 09/20/06
Posts: 257
Loc: 30 degrees latitude, USA
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Showstoppah,
Welcome to CN.
In addition to all the great information you have received about col/dsc/eq_tables/etc....
You may take a look at the "Poor Mans DSCs"....
easy dsc cn thread on degree circles
degree circle .pdf files
You can add some software to a pda type hand held device to use at the scope for sky map info and obtaining your alt/az settings to pushto the mount.
These threads are listed in the Best of Reflectors toward the bottom of the list of posts.
Just as an inexpensive alternative...
Good viewing,
Dave
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Joe Lalumia
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 01/24/07
Posts: 2573
Loc: Rockwall, Texas, USA
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I have a PUSHTO Orion XT10i -- works just fine.
http://www.flickr.com/boatman1
Also have an LX90 8" LNT GOTO SCT-- depends on what I feel like which one I take outside!
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LX90 8" LNT, SV Nighthawk & TelePOD, SV 80/9D & M4 mount, ETX 90, Orion XT10i, 20x80 binoculars, SV-BV3s.
"The hardest thing in the world to understand is the income tax." - Albert Einstein
Edited by Joe Lalumia (09/03/08 05:57 PM)
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mistyridge
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 10/28/05
Posts: 2269
Loc: Loomis, CA -26Mi E of Sacto.
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I have a Sky Commander on both my Dobs. In my mildly light polluted sky I can't live with out the DSCs. All I do is point to two bright stars and I am ready to go. I can view DSOs that you could never find by star hopping. I actually prefer push to after using both goto and push to.
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Mike F
Misty Ridge Observatory
Stellarvue SV115T "WOW"! What a view.
Stellarvue SV70ED
Stellarvue Nighthawk
18" f/4.5 Teeter's, Swayze mirror
12.5" f/5 Astrosky, OWL mirror
15X70 Binos
Mounts: DM-6,M-1,CG-5(ASGT)
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Achernar
Post Laureate
Reged: 02/25/06
Posts: 3725
Loc: Alabama, USA
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You can convert most Dobs into a Push To Dob with the addition of digital setting circles. JMI, Argo Narvis, Sky Commander and others make kits that ensure installation is fairly simple and trouble free. All work basically the same way, except those made by Orion which use magnetic instead of optical encoders. Ever since adding them to my 10-inch, the number of galaxies and nebulae I have observed has exploded to well over 800 Messier, NGC and IC objects. Any one of them should serve you well, they have so many objects in their internal databases that if you exhaust yours you could work for a professional astronomers. Furthermore, there are systems such as Servo Cat that would make a Dob a true GOTO telescope at a much higher price of course. Another option is to install digital setting circles on your scope and place it on a equatorial platform. Those track for an hour or so at a time, and with larger Dobs they're far more portable and cheaper than a traditional equatorial mount. In either case, these accessories make observing a lot more enjoyable when you spend more time looking at them instead of hunting for them. That is especially helpful when you're looking for objects that are barely in range of your telescope and your vision. Don't be surprised if you see all the brighter galaxies visible from your location in a couple of years.
Taras
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10-inch F/4.5 Discovery Dob
6-inch F/8 Homebuilt Dob
4 1/4-inch F/4 Homebuilt reflector
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tincup01
member
Reged: 07/29/08
Posts: 14
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I was just musing, but has anyone got a MySky or SkyScout to make a Dobsonian goto. The advantage of GPS and LNT type device is that there is no need for mechnical encoders...I see the SkyScout is being sold with a refractor in the States.
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Bill Weir
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 06/01/04
Posts: 894
Loc: Metchosin (Victoria), Canada
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Quote:
I was just musing, but has anyone got a MySky or SkyScout to make a Dobsonian goto. The advantage of GPS and LNT type device is that there is no need for mechnical encoders...I see the SkyScout is being sold with a refractor in the States.
I believe metal interferes with the workings of these devices. I'll bet there isn't very much on one of those refractors. I'll bet the OTA is PVC or something like that.
Bill
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6'' Orion SkyQuest
12.5'' f/5 Custom Truss Dob
William Optics 80mm ZenithStar II ED Doublet
f/5 25" newtonian on a giant GEM, any time I want
Observing sessions grand total for 2007, 171.
So far in 2008, 115
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Brooklyn
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 07/24/08
Posts: 870
Loc: Central New Jersey
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Well truth be told mike, so far I have only tried using regular dobs without any kinds of added electronics.
I know someone with a 12" lightbridge and when I used it at high magnifications I was very annoyed by how hard it was to keep the object in the eyepiece. Of course, this scope was not on an equatorial platform so perhaps in that case it would be easier.
So perhaps I should have rephrased that; when using a non equatorial mounted dobsonian with no goto, I find the constant need to move the telescope somewhat tiring. If you don't adjust the telescope accordingly, your object will be moving out of the eyepiece FOV. Of course, the higher magnification the faster the objects leave your eyepiece fov.
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Meade 8.25"(209.55mm) LX-90 EMC (SCT)
Albert Einstein =>
“Intellectual growth should commence at birth and cease only at death.”
“If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.”
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csa/montana
Astro Ambassador
Reged: 05/14/05
Posts: 28681
Loc: montana
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Quote:
So perhaps I should have rephrased that; when using a non equatorial mounted dobsonian with no goto, I find the constant need to move the telescope somewhat tiring. If you don't adjust the telescope accordingly, your object will be moving out of the eyepiece FOV. Of course, the higher magnification the faster the objects leave your eyepiece fov.
This doesn't bother me in the least; I find it very easy to keep an object in the FOV. I catch myself moving the tube, without even realizing it.
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Carol
AstroTech 16" Dob (Thanks ASTRONOMICS!)
AstroTech 66ED / Vixen 80MF/AstroTech Voyager
Masuyama's 7.5, 15, 25W, 35mm,
Tak LE 5mm B/TMB 3.2
7mm Pentax XL, 10mm Pentax XW
14mm Meade 4000 UWA
22mm Pan, 35mm Pan
DreamCatcher Dobservatory, #2
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TexBiker
super member
Reged: 12/18/07
Posts: 130
Loc: North Texas
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Quote:
This doesn't bother me in the least; I find it very easy to keep an object in the FOV. I catch myself moving the tube, without even realizing it.
Same here. If the alt/az bearings are properly done, it almost feels like the scope is moving itself.
I guess it could be annoying to someone who was used to relying on a go-to/tracking mount, though. I suppose it would be similar to a driver who had only used automatic transmissions being annoyed if they have to drive a manual. I grew up on stick shifts, so it doesn't bother me at all.
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Michael
Dallas, TX
Orion 127mm Mak-Cass
Orion 10" Dob
Edited by TexBiker (09/04/08 09:34 PM)
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Mike B
Starstruck
Reged: 04/06/05
Posts: 4460
Loc: shake, rattle, & roll, CA
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Quote:
I know someone with a 12" lightbridge and when I used it at high magnifications I was very annoyed by how hard it was to keep the object in the eyepiece.
Very likely a significant part of this is, as Michael says, when you're accustomed to auto-tracking, hand-tracking might seem a hassle. Add to that, its a scope (in Brooklyn's case) that he's not familiar with. Add to that, its not a "premium" Dob with their typically smoother motions.
Perhaps this LB had been "modd'd" to have better than "out-of-the-box" mechanicals? But if not, this scenario would present a pretty big change from a tracking SCT.
However, NONE of the above present insurmountable obstacles- a little time, familiarity with use, and a little tinkering... i'll be most LB-type owners grow very fond, and *comfortable* with their scope's motions in hand-tracking! Just ask Carol 
Quote:
I find it very easy to keep an object in the FOV. I catch myself moving the tube, without even realizing it.
Yet the issue of hand-tracking has, perhaps, gotten a bit of over-emphasis here... the OP's initial question revolved around Go-To vs. Push-To; A "tracking-drive" is a separate matter, and cost/complication wise, falls in between the two extremes of a basic, no-frills Dob & a fully-loaded Go-To rig. What i think i, & others, are trying to bring to the table here is that its NOT "all-or-nothing" re: "Go-To"... there *IS* a potentially happy middle-ground, defined by DSCs & a tracking-drive or "mechanism" (platform, rubber-bands, squirrels).
Heck, in an era not-so-far gone, they had some rigs driven by sandbags & pulleys! So while Go-To is surely nice, it shouldn't be permitted any intimidation factor for someone considering jumping into the Dob pond. The water's fine!
mike b
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Just for giggles- Next time when the money comes out the ATM, scream "I Won!, I Won!"
* * 15" F4.55 Starsplitter Dob * *
Pacheco State Park
Fremont Peak
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Brooklyn
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 07/24/08
Posts: 870
Loc: Central New Jersey
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I dont doubt that if I spent 1 to 3 weeks with a standard home made dob, even with the crappiest of the crappiest bearings...I would still get used to it.
Its just that to someone who doesn't use dobs regularly, it does feel like more of a hassle as you said.
I know a fellow who is actually making his own goto system on his homemade 16" dob. From what i heard it seems easily doable with parts ordered online, and saves the maker over 60% price. By the way mike...how do you make your clear sky chart constantly show 5/5 blue? I want to do that 
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tincup01
member
Reged: 07/29/08
Posts: 14
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I managed to find the perfect dark beeswax furniture polish to put on the central plastic axle of my GSO 8" dob and it became so smooth to move for minute nudges, without any of that annoying jump (stiction) it had previously, when I was watching Saturn or Jupiter at 150-180 magnification.
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