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Arthur Dent
Galactic Hitch-Hiker
Reged: 10/23/08
Posts: 1184
Loc: South Yorkshire, UK
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HI Guys 'n' Gals
I have posted a slightly different question to this on the celestron forum (for what will become obvious in a sec).
I currently have a Celestron NexStar 130 SLT and TBH it is too big (curently occupying a large part of my lounge). I'm looking at both Meade ETX (the 90PE, 105 and 125PE) and Celestron NexStar 4SE & 5SE.
My current scope is rather annoying. The SkyAlign procedure is tedious - especially since I have to input the local time every time I use the scope (I am not sure if this is normal behaviour or not). After you have set up a Meade ETX with your locale, does it keep track of the local time or do you have to do the same as the NexStar software and input that EVERY time you set up?
The second question is about the relative merits of Meade ETX and Celestron NexStar SE's. I know this is the Meade ETX forum, but in people's opinion, which is better for general observation of Sun, Moon, Solar System and a few deep sky objects such as Andromeda Galaxy and Orion Nebula? I'd also like to try some astrophotography with my Canon EOS 400D.
I'm looking at the ETX 90PE or NexStar 4SE (mainly due to cost) but could probably stretch to an ETX 125PE or a NexStar 5SE. I really want a scope that is quick to set up (the ETX's seem to score here) and have excellent quality optics and be suitable for planetary and some deep sky imaging (nothing exotic). Could you offer any advice as to which would probably suit my needs best?
As I am in the UK and not in the States, any prices/deals available would have to be applicable to the UK.
Cheers in advance,
Art
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If I like it, the wife says that we can't afford it!
=======================================================
Meade ETX105 (a nice "Grab & Go" scope) & Celestron NexStar 6SE with Bob's Knobs.
Various EP's from 6mm to 26mm, Baader Hyperion 8-24mm Zoom, a 2x Barlow, 2" diagonal and 7Ah PowerTank.
MRF and Antares 8x50 RACI finder scope - both for the 6SE's OTA, whilst the ETX gets a plain RDF.
Canon EOS 400D DSLR (un-modded) and SPC900 webcam. Finally climbing the AP Learning Curve!
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ProfMMC
sage
Reged: 09/13/07
Posts: 289
Loc: London UK
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I have both an ETX-125 and an SE8 - so can't quite do you comparision but can say something useful.
The meades with LNT will keep the time, but to be honest entering the time is not a big deal.
I would not bother with anything less than the ETX-125, or the SE6, and out of the two I would buy the SE6. The SE4 and 5 come with a smaller more flimsy mount.
The Celestron is much more portable since you can break down into 3 parts: forks, mount, and tube. The mount and tube can be transported in their shipping boxes. The Meade is a pain to transport without buying an expensive case. I bust the plastic surround on the LNT on my first field trip as I could not find a nice way of packing it.
You can also put a small 66 - 80mm refractor in the SE mount which is nice.
If you want to do astrophotography don't buy either. In the long run imaging eventually leads to GEM, so you are better off getting the SE6 on a CG5-GT.
Not sure if any of the above will help you.
--------------------
Orion Optics UK 350mm F4.7 Dob (dismantled)
Celestron 8SE f10 Meade 5000ED 127mm ETX125 OTA f15
Revelation ED 80mm f6.8 Meade 5000ED 80mm f6
WO ZS66mm f5.9 WO ZS70mm f6
EQ6 Pro CG5
DSI I + II Shoestring GPUSB EQMOD
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StarWars
Postmaster
Reged: 11/26/03
Posts: 13810
Loc: CyberSpace
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When you power off the Celestron SE or Meade ETX AT the time and date is lost..However the Meade ETX PE will retain the time and date in the LNT module.
The SkyAlign option basically is a three star alignment procedure. Two star and solar system align is also available in the SkyAlign computer.
The ETX PE can use Auto Align LNT (page 17) or Two-Star Easy Align (page 36).
Both of these alignment procedures use different Telescope Home Positions!
The ETX AT use the Two-Star Easy Align (page 18/19).
According to SE reviews the Celestron SE5/6 image resolution quality is soft most likely from the large center obstruction.
--------------------
Sony Digital Media player..
MX 460 earbuds
Celestron 2x Barlow Lens
Orion Collimation Eyepiece
Rigel Quick Finder
Assorted Bino's 
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Arthur Dent
Galactic Hitch-Hiker
Reged: 10/23/08
Posts: 1184
Loc: South Yorkshire, UK
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Thanks Prof and StarWars for your responses.
I am puzzled by some of the replies however.
Prof says "If you want to do astrophotography don't buy either. In the long run imaging eventually leads to GEM, so you are better off getting the SE6 on a CG5-GT"
I'm not sure what you mean by "don't buy either". I'm also puzzled by reference to the SE6. Do you mean the NexStar 6 SE?? The CG5-GT is Celestron's computerised heavy-duty Equitorial mount isn't it? If you meant the NexStar 6 SE scope, is this available as an OTA only, if so, I can then get the CG5-GT tripod assembly as funds permit. Finally Prof, could you explain what you meant by "In the long run imaging eventually leads to GEM" as I don't know what this means!
StarWars. You have said "However the Meade ETX PE will retain the time and date in the LNT module." Does the ETX PE come with an LNT module or do you have to purchase one at extra cost. I don't know what an LNT module is!
Thanks in advance guys,
A rather puzzled Art 
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If I like it, the wife says that we can't afford it!
=======================================================
Meade ETX105 (a nice "Grab & Go" scope) & Celestron NexStar 6SE with Bob's Knobs.
Various EP's from 6mm to 26mm, Baader Hyperion 8-24mm Zoom, a 2x Barlow, 2" diagonal and 7Ah PowerTank.
MRF and Antares 8x50 RACI finder scope - both for the 6SE's OTA, whilst the ETX gets a plain RDF.
Canon EOS 400D DSLR (un-modded) and SPC900 webcam. Finally climbing the AP Learning Curve!
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AlexDJ30
sage
Reged: 09/02/08
Posts: 276
Loc: Monterrey, Mexico
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Arthur if you goal on the long run is to do Astrophotography and specially DSO's but ETX and Celestron SE are not up to the task 100% fully, both scopes were made for visuall use, you can do Planet Photography in both easy but DSO's (aka nebulaes, star clusters, galaxies) thats another league of it own and the tracking of both mounts are not so good for that (you need to do Polar Aligment) and make smaller exposure photos (30 secs at most), with a Gem (Lxd-75, celestron ASGT or equivalent Gem mount) can have much better tracking and better imagening capabilities than the ETX and SE mounts, the cons is that the Gem is fairly bigger and heavier (the good thing is that you can disamble it in parts for easy carrying), the good thing is that you can use any OTA on it (interchangable).
So if you want something to use fast and only for visual, some casual planetary Phtoography then ETX or SE would be perfect. You want DSO, then the etx or se would not be to the task.
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Equipment:
- ETX 125 AT
- C6 ASGT
- WO 66mm SD
- 2.5X ED Barlow, 8-24mm Zoom Eyepice
- Canon EOS Rebel XSi
- Celestron Nextimagen
- Orion Starshoot CCD cam
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Lee Jay
sage
Reged: 02/27/08
Posts: 463
Loc: Westminster, CO
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I had a 130SLT before I got my 125 PE. No contest. The Meade has far better optics, a far more stable mount, and is much more flexible, being able to be setup as alt-az or equatorial with the built-in wedge. I also like the ability to release both clutches (something you can't do with the Nexstar's) and use it as either a spotting scope or camera lens like this:
http://photos.imageevent.com/sipphoto/samplepictures/20D28316.jpg
100% crop:
http://photos.imageevent.com/sipphoto/samplepictures/20D28316-2.jpg
I find it extremely portable, especially with the hardcase I have. Basically, the scope, mount, EPs and accessories all go in the hard case, and it comes with a softcase for the tripod. Setup time is 5 minutes, and it will run for well over 10 hours on a single charge of 8 NiMH AAs.
That said, I'm thinking of selling mine (interested?), but not for any deficiencies in this scope itself, and the replacement will be over twice the cost and less portable. I'm struggling with this because I just love my little ETX!
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Arthur Dent
Galactic Hitch-Hiker
Reged: 10/23/08
Posts: 1184
Loc: South Yorkshire, UK
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Hi Lee,
I might be interested if you were in the UK but I guess that Westminster, Co means Westminster, Connecticut and as such you would be in the US?
Any idea (in USD or GPB) what you would be looking at (including shipping)?
AlexD
I am only interested in casual observation and possible photography of planets (Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn), the Moon, Sun (with appropriate filter) and the odd DSO - such as Andromeda (M31) or The Orion Nebula (M42). I might upgrade to more serious astrophotography later on (with a better scope and better mount).
As such, would the ETX90PE or NexStar 5SE do the job at present?
If you use a wedge and then drive on azimuth only, are these scopes OK for my intended use (including astrophotography)?
Cheers
Art
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Lee Jay
sage
Reged: 02/27/08
Posts: 463
Loc: Westminster, CO
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CO is Colorado, and I have no idea about shipping. My avatar came from this scope, as did the below image of the Moon. You won't be able to shoot M31 with this scope as that object is way, way, way too large.
http://photos.imageevent.com/sipphoto/samplepictures/Whole%20moon%20with%20extension%20final%201920%202.jpg
Driving in eq mode obviously gives you far better tracking, and it is suitable for some short-exposure (15-30s unguided) astrophotography.
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jgraham
Postmaster
Reged: 12/02/04
Posts: 6763
Loc: Dayton, Ohio
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I suspect the overall performance of the Meade and Celestron are similar. Personally, I've always liked the Meade design, but I have to admit the Celestrons are nice, just not my cup of tea.
The ETX-90 is a great little scope; lightweight, very stable, superb optics. The only problem I have with them is you run out of light before you run out of resolution. The ETX-125 is simply a wonderful scope; all the features of the 90 with enough light grasp to spend a serious evening enjoying the sky. I find the way it breaks up into the OTA/mount, and the tripod to the just the right size for quick set-up and tear-down. The LNT is also very handy. At first I considered it a bit of a gadget, but it makes set-up and alignment so easy I really like it.
As for imaging, the long focal length of the Mak design makes the ETX very well suited for lunar and planetary imaging, but deepsky imaging takes patience and a bit of luck. I actually bought mine as a visual companion to my imaging rig, so for me it's a good match. Nothing beats sitting next to my imaging scope (and LXD75 SN6) with my ETX-125PE fitted with binoviewers.
Sooo, from what I've seen of the Celestrons they're fine scopes and either one would work well as primarily visual platforms with some options for imaging, but you can't go wrong with the ETX-90 or 125 PE. Of the two, the extra aperture of the 125 is worth the cost.
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-John
================================================
Homebuilt scopes from 4.25-16.5"
Meade LXD75-N6/SN6/SC8, DSX-90, ETX-60BB, ETX-125PE, DS-2130
Orion StarBlast, BinoViewers, Coronado PST
Rebel XT/XTi, DSI Pro (I, II, & III), DSI, LPI, Electronic Eyepiece, Phillips SPC900NC
Tasco 60mm Refractors
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Arthur Dent
Galactic Hitch-Hiker
Reged: 10/23/08
Posts: 1184
Loc: South Yorkshire, UK
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Thanks for the swift response Lee and sorry for putting Westminster in the wrong state!
That's exactly the sort of image that I'm after! So the Meade 125PE will produce these sort of images - with what eyepiece? I know that this is the Meade ETX forum, but will the Celestron NexStar 5SE produce the same sort of image - or would I need the 6SE?
I can't decide whether to go Meade ETX or Celestron NexStar SE at the moment, so looking for as much help/advice as possible.
Currently I have a Celestron NexStar 130SLT and am a bit disappointed by it (and it is huge) so looking for something a bit better.
The scope is Ok, the GoTo software is just plain "clunky" IMHO.
Art
--------------------
If I like it, the wife says that we can't afford it!
=======================================================
Meade ETX105 (a nice "Grab & Go" scope) & Celestron NexStar 6SE with Bob's Knobs.
Various EP's from 6mm to 26mm, Baader Hyperion 8-24mm Zoom, a 2x Barlow, 2" diagonal and 7Ah PowerTank.
MRF and Antares 8x50 RACI finder scope - both for the 6SE's OTA, whilst the ETX gets a plain RDF.
Canon EOS 400D DSLR (un-modded) and SPC900 webcam. Finally climbing the AP Learning Curve!
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Arthur Dent
Galactic Hitch-Hiker
Reged: 10/23/08
Posts: 1184
Loc: South Yorkshire, UK
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Quote:
The ETX-90 is a great little scope; lightweight, very stable, superb optics. The only problem I have with them is you run out of light before you run out of resolution. The ETX-125 is simply a wonderful scope; all the features of the 90 with enough light grasp to spend a serious evening enjoying the sky.
Quote:
... but you can't go wrong with the ETX-90 or 125 PE. Of the two, the extra aperture of the 125 is worth the cost.
Thanks John.
This is just the kind of advice I'm after.
I visited a local telescope shop and had a good squint at an ETX90 and liked it. There was a Celestron 6SE a couple of feet away also on display and I didn't like it as much on first impression. Having used Celestron's NexStar SkyAlign over the past few weeks with my 130SLT, I find the NexStar GoTo software rather "clunky" and not too "user-friendly", mechanically the scope is fine.
Art
Edited by Arthur Dent (10/24/08 06:35 PM)
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ProfMMC
sage
Reged: 09/13/07
Posts: 289
Loc: London UK
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Sorry I sent a rushed post from work.
In my view the ETX range and the SE range are both suited to visual only. Optically I think that you can't say Meade is better than Celestron or visa-versa. Broadly they are similar, but scopes will differ because of the wide range of what gets through quality control in China. The meades are all MCT, the SE are MCT for (I think) the 4 and 5 and SCT for the 6 and 8 which complicates the comparison a bit.
For visual I think 5/6" really is as small as you want to go unless you live under really really dark skies.
I prefer the SE to the ETX simply because the mount and the OTA are two components not one. This really is a big advantage for portability and does allow you to use the mount for other small OTAs. The SE mount for the 5 is too flimsy so I would buy the SE6 over the SE5.
If you start to get into imaging you will eventually buy a GEM mount. Since Celestron sell the 6" and 8" tubes on a GEM mount I would go for 6" on a CG5-GT over the ETX if I wanted to image.
So in conclusion if you are considering ETX v SE: if you want visual only: buy the SE6, if you want to image buy the Celestron 6" on a GEM not the SE mount.
BTW you mention that you are in the UK. It is very hard to find a Celestron seller who will advise. David Hinds is the official UK importer but my visit to his showroom was very disappointing - I was servered by someone who could not answer any of my questions ...
--------------------
Orion Optics UK 350mm F4.7 Dob (dismantled)
Celestron 8SE f10 Meade 5000ED 127mm ETX125 OTA f15
Revelation ED 80mm f6.8 Meade 5000ED 80mm f6
WO ZS66mm f5.9 WO ZS70mm f6
EQ6 Pro CG5
DSI I + II Shoestring GPUSB EQMOD
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AlexDJ30
sage
Reged: 09/02/08
Posts: 276
Loc: Monterrey, Mexico
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Arthur the SE version is OK, i guess both ETX and SE are equall on tracking department, on optics that something else. Maks (aka etx) are better for planetary observation, because of his focal lenght of F/1,5 and in less degree DSO's (some dso's are quiet extended and it will not get the full view on the eyepice) , the SE version the 4SE (mak) like ETX the rest of the line (5SE. 6SE and 8SE) are SC (smitchd-cassegraine) that are all around performer (ok for planets ok for DSO's) with a focal of F/10.
The goo thing about the SE is that you can unmount the Optical tube and use another (of course just reading the weight specifaction and not to long that could hit the base) you could use the SC and if you want wider views put a small Refractor (66 to 80mm) on the SE mount, the ETX cant do that you are stuck with the Mak for everything.
Both ETX and SE are capable of planetary photography, on the DSO photography i would put the ETX has bad choice (it can be done but you would need a focal reducer, use a small CCD cam, so no rebel or Digital DSRL because of the weight) and do polar aligment. The SE because you can exchange OTA's you could use small refractor and with that you could imagine a bite better the DSO's ( les focal lennght meanse less time for photos)...
Its your choice really.
--------------------
Equipment:
- ETX 125 AT
- C6 ASGT
- WO 66mm SD
- 2.5X ED Barlow, 8-24mm Zoom Eyepice
- Canon EOS Rebel XSi
- Celestron Nextimagen
- Orion Starshoot CCD cam
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Lee Jay
sage
Reged: 02/27/08
Posts: 463
Loc: Westminster, CO
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Quote:
Thanks for the swift response Lee and sorry for putting Westminster in the wrong state!
That's exactly the sort of image that I'm after! So the Meade 125PE will produce these sort of images - with what eyepiece?
Those were both prime-focus - the Jupiter shot with a Phillips webcam through a TV 2x barlow, the moon shot with a Canon 20D, both through the rear camera port.
Quote:
I know that this is the Meade ETX forum, but will the Celestron NexStar 5SE produce the same sort of image - or would I need the 6SE?
I don't know but I can't imagine there is a whole lot of difference between a 5" Mak and a 5" SCT - maybe a bit.
Quote:
I can't decide whether to go Meade ETX or Celestron NexStar SE at the moment, so looking for as much help/advice as possible.
Well, like I said, the Meade mount is better for me. It's got two forks instead of one, it has a built-in wedge, and you can release it for use like a Dob, or as a camera lens or spotting scope. The Nexstar mounts can't do that. However, if those aren't important to you, I've *heard* (but not experienced myself) than the 6SE mount is stiffer than the ETX mount. I found the 4 and 5SE mounts to be horrible myself, and I just hated my 130SLT mount.
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Lee Jay
sage
Reged: 02/27/08
Posts: 463
Loc: Westminster, CO
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By the way, here's an afocal shot with a Canon S3IS through an Astrotech 40mm EP:
http://photos.imageevent.com/sipphoto/samplepictures/S3__9045.jpg
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StarWars
Postmaster
Reged: 11/26/03
Posts: 13810
Loc: CyberSpace
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Quote:
Thanks Prof and StarWars for your responses.
I am puzzled by some of the replies however.
StarWars. You have said "However the Meade ETX PE will retain the time and date in the LNT module." Does the ETX PE come with an LNT module or do you have to purchase one at extra cost. I don't know what an LNT module is!
Thanks in advance guys,
A rather puzzled Art
The ETX PE is sold with the LNT module attached to the OTA.
LNT = Level North Technology
--------------------
Sony Digital Media player..
MX 460 earbuds
Celestron 2x Barlow Lens
Orion Collimation Eyepiece
Rigel Quick Finder
Assorted Bino's
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Arthur Dent
Galactic Hitch-Hiker
Reged: 10/23/08
Posts: 1184
Loc: South Yorkshire, UK
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Thanks ever so much for your replies.
I've just realised (when I read prof's 2nd post) that GEM = German Equitorial Mount. Talk about slow for the penny to drop!
The ETX range are Maksutov-Cassegrain (AFAIK) whilst the Celestron NexStar 4SE is a Mak design but the NexStar 5SE and 6SE are Schmidt-Cassegrain. I think that the Maks suffer less from temperature changes to the corrector plate and the Schmidts take far longer to thermally stabilise but as I'm new to this I may be wrong.
I think I prefer the twin fork arrangement and the LNT of the Meade. As I understand it, the LNT whcich comes with the ETX PE scopes has an in-built clock and so keeps track of time AND date.
I know it is a small detail but I find it really annoying that the NexStar hard/software requires you to put the time and date in EVERY TIME you set up.
It is these small niggly details that spoil your enjoyment of something whether that be a car (where the electric windows are one-shot on the driver's side but not on the passenger side [Honda Jazz and Ford Fiesta]) or a telescope where you have to input the time and date every time!
If you find it irritating, you are less likely to use it (except for the cars of course where you just have to put up with their foibles)!
Thanks for the advice, I'll probably be back for more soon.
Art
--------------------
If I like it, the wife says that we can't afford it!
=======================================================
Meade ETX105 (a nice "Grab & Go" scope) & Celestron NexStar 6SE with Bob's Knobs.
Various EP's from 6mm to 26mm, Baader Hyperion 8-24mm Zoom, a 2x Barlow, 2" diagonal and 7Ah PowerTank.
MRF and Antares 8x50 RACI finder scope - both for the 6SE's OTA, whilst the ETX gets a plain RDF.
Canon EOS 400D DSLR (un-modded) and SPC900 webcam. Finally climbing the AP Learning Curve!
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rcd47
sage
Reged: 03/15/08
Posts: 259
Loc: East Texas, USA
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Quote:
Thanks ever so much for your replies.
I've just realised (when I read prof's 2nd post) that GEM = German Equitorial Mount. Talk about slow for the penny to drop!
The ETX range are Maksutov-Cassegrain (AFAIK) whilst the Celestron NexStar 4SE is a Mak design but the NexStar 5SE and 6SE are Schmidt-Cassegrain. I think that the Maks suffer less from temperature changes to the corrector plate and the Schmidts take far longer to thermally stabilise but as I'm new to this I may be wrong.
I think I prefer the twin fork arrangement and the LNT of the Meade. As I understand it, the LNT whcich comes with the ETX PE scopes has an in-built clock and so keeps track of time AND date.
I know it is a small detail but I find it really annoying that the NexStar hard/software requires you to put the time and date in EVERY TIME you set up.
It is these small niggly details that spoil your enjoyment of something whether that be a car (where the electric windows are one-shot on the driver's side but not on the passenger side [Honda Jazz and Ford Fiesta]) or a telescope where you have to input the time and date every time!
If you find it irritating, you are less likely to use it (except for the cars of course where you just have to put up with their foibles)!
Thanks for the advice, I'll probably be back for more soon.
Art
If you go with the Meade, you can spend your time putting the scope in "Home Position" (different positions depending on alignment procedure) or if you go with the Celestron, you can spend your time entering the time and date instead.   I have an older Tasco Starguide with Celestron hand paddle and also a Meade ETX125PE. I understand about the small details that you speak of. They are small details for sure, but like you said...it would be more enjoyable to use if you didn't have to deal with them. If the Meade would mate with the Celestron (Meadelestron), life would be perfect...maybe.
--------------------
Randy
Edmund Astroscan
Meade ETX125PE
Skywatcher 102mm F5 & Alt/Az Mount
Orion ST80/Mini EQ1
Tasco Starguide 114/Celestron Hand Paddle
Pentax 10x50 Binoculars
Philips SPC 900NC
Stellacam EX
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rmollise
Post Laureate
Reged: 07/06/07
Posts: 4583
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Quote:
HI Guys 'n' Gals
I have posted a slightly different question to this on the celestron forum (for what will become obvious in a sec).
Some thoughts:
You are not restricted to "SkyAlign" with Celestrons, you can also do a two-star alignment similar to the ETX routine.
The PE ETXes keep track of time and date. You will have to enter position if you move the scope. Entering time/date is not a major task IMHO.
The ETX is IMHO a tad better than the 5SE optically...but it is very close.
If you want to image, forget the ETX. It is just not up to anything more than casual snapshots of the Moon and planets. The NexStar SE is not worlds better in this regard, but it is somewhat better. Truthfully, if you want to do any deep sky imaging, don't get an ETX OR an SE. Look at a Celestron on the CG5 mount as a minimum.
I would definitely choose the 5 or 125. I don't think much of the optics of the 4-inch Celestron, and the 90 is just too small to keep you interested for long.
I have (and love) the ETX 125PE, but if I had it to do over, I would probably choose the NexStar 5SE...it is a somewhat more versatile and better built scope. But, again, I am more than happy with the ETX for what I use it for (grab and go visual use).
--------------------
Uncle Rod
Rod's New Book:
Choosing and Using a New CAT
Available now!
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Arthur Dent
Galactic Hitch-Hiker
Reged: 10/23/08
Posts: 1184
Loc: South Yorkshire, UK
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Thinking about the ETX 125PE as the GoTo on the Celestron is very "clunky" IMHO.
Would love something like C8-SGT but cannot afford the £1100 (approx $2000) that this would cost in the UK (but of course, this would involve Celestron's s/ware)!
Several people have said to try 2-star alignment (I am trying 3 star alignment at the moment). Could someone give me some step-by-step guidance as to how to do 2-star alignment from power-on?
Art
--------------------
If I like it, the wife says that we can't afford it!
=======================================================
Meade ETX105 (a nice "Grab & Go" scope) & Celestron NexStar 6SE with Bob's Knobs.
Various EP's from 6mm to 26mm, Baader Hyperion 8-24mm Zoom, a 2x Barlow, 2" diagonal and 7Ah PowerTank.
MRF and Antares 8x50 RACI finder scope - both for the 6SE's OTA, whilst the ETX gets a plain RDF.
Canon EOS 400D DSLR (un-modded) and SPC900 webcam. Finally climbing the AP Learning Curve!
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