imhotep
Vendor - Optical Supports
   
Reged: 02/14/07
Posts: 1477
Loc: Lutz, FL
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When I got home today there was a package waiting for me     




Barring any unexpected hiccups I should have the sonotube OTA finished tomorrow evening. If time allows I'll go ahead and have a pseudo-first light right away, or possibly the day after if weather permits. Failing that it'll be early next week sometime.
She's getting there!
-------------------- Curt
www.opticalsupports.com
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Strgazr27
Vendor - Deep Space Mods and Composites
  
Reged: 10/04/04
Posts: 6984
Loc: StonyHill Observatory
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Curt,
Now that is BEAUTIFUL!! Congrats! I spoke to Bob today and he starts my mirror next week hopefully. She's going to be a killer scope when your done.
-------------------- Bobby
StonyHill Observatory
Skywatcher EQ6 Pro (On it's way)
AT 130 F/6 Prototype
Royce 10" f/4 Astrograph (Under Construction)
Self Modded 40D
70-200 F2.8 L IS
SSAG
YAHOO TMB 130SS Group
Astronomy Technologies Yahoo Group
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Mike I. Jones
Carpal Tunnel
   
Reged: 07/02/06
Posts: 1667
Loc: Fort Worth TX
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Nice mirror, great looking cell, Curt! Can't wait to hear about first light. We're gonna have to start calling you Preston! Mike
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imhotep
Vendor - Optical Supports
   
Reged: 02/14/07
Posts: 1477
Loc: Lutz, FL
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I'm still fascinated by the conical design. The thin rim all the way around seems impossible somehow, yet these mirrors hold their figure just as well as flat blanks.
Well, it did what new optics always do and brought me some cloudy/rainy weather. Looks like pseudo-first light will be Sunday March 22 at the earliest.
In the meantime I'm struggling a bit with this Protostar spider and secondary holder. The shaft on the secondary holder has a VERY snug fit into the spider, so snug that it takes a lot of effort to rotate it. This is hard to describe, but imagine having to use so much force that when it finally budges it shoots past the point you needed. It basically clicks or pops from one orientation to the next. So far it hasn't been bad enough that I'm risking damage or anything like that, but it's bad enough that I had a lot of trouble trying to get it aligned to the focuser using my sighttube as a guide. Bryan Greer may have some insight for me on this. It may be that I need to sand or trim down the OD of that shaft just slightly to get the adjustability I need.
-------------------- Curt
www.opticalsupports.com
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Strgazr27
Vendor - Deep Space Mods and Composites
  
Reged: 10/04/04
Posts: 6984
Loc: StonyHill Observatory
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PICTURES !!
-------------------- Bobby
StonyHill Observatory
Skywatcher EQ6 Pro (On it's way)
AT 130 F/6 Prototype
Royce 10" f/4 Astrograph (Under Construction)
Self Modded 40D
70-200 F2.8 L IS
SSAG
YAHOO TMB 130SS Group
Astronomy Technologies Yahoo Group
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Chris Curran
scholastic sledgehammer
   
Reged: 06/14/05
Posts: 827
Loc: Brandon, FL
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Quote:
I'm still fascinated by the conical design.
Yea, everything about that conical design is brilliant. That single bolt in the back simply rocks...
Quote:
The shaft on the secondary holder has a VERY snug fit into the spider, so snug that it takes a lot of effort to rotate it.
That's odd. Stupid question: you did loosen the nut on that bolt before adjusting it, right? Assuming you did, it might be easier to bore out that hole a bit on your lathe...
-------------------- cheers & beers,
Chris
Homepage | Over 40?
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dawsonian2000
scholastic sledgehammer
   
Reged: 07/26/06
Posts: 851
Loc: Riverview, FL, USA
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Simply beautiful, Curt! You must be bouncing off of walls at this point. Will it be ready to showcase at the next observing session? Sorry I have not been on your thread of late. Been working odd hours with only limited time for pastimes.
Mel
-------------------- Clear Skies, Forever!
The Vega Sky Center
10" (254mm) F/5.65 Homebuilt Fork Mounted Newtonian Reflector
5" (127mm) F/9.4 Homebuilt Refractor
4" (100mm) F/13 Carton Homebuit Refractor (coming soon!)
3.1" (80mm) F/6 Scopos ED APO Refractor
4.5" (114mm) F/8 Tasco 11te-5 Newtonian (under restoration)
2.4" (60mm) F/16.7 Tasco 7te-5 Refractor
2.4" (60mm) F/15 Jason Discoverer 313 Refractor
http://www.vega-sky-center.com
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gatorengineer
scholastic sledgehammer
   
Reged: 02/28/05
Posts: 910
Loc: Hellertown, PA
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Beautiful scope, if you dont mind me asking what did the local metal shop charge for the cut outs?
-------------------- 20" F5 Dob
16" Dob in pieces
Meade SN 6 F3.6 with MPCC ---
12" Doc Clay Sky Patrol MEADE SCT
12.5" F4 Newt under construction
Siebert 45mm Binoviewers
Lots of binos---
Optics Past - MN-71, Comet Catcher, 8" Stf Mak, 4" B&W triplet, 6"Schmidt newt, 12"LX200, C8, Meade LX10-10", 10" MEADE ACF, SN8, TAL150K, Orion 150MC, Jason 60mm refractor, ATM 6" F8, WO 110FLT, 92mm Off Axis Newt, Televue Genesis, Nikon 20x120 bino's, 15x110 Boarderguards, Kuhne Flaks
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imhotep
Vendor - Optical Supports
   
Reged: 02/14/07
Posts: 1477
Loc: Lutz, FL
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Quote:
That's odd. Stupid question: you did loosen the nut on that bolt before adjusting it, right? Assuming you did, it might be easier to bore out that hole a bit on your lathe...
I have yet to even install the bolt. I 'think' what's going on is friction between two coats of black paint. The shaft and the inside of the hole in the spider are both painted black and it has a slightly tacky feel to it. Machining a few mils off the inside of the hole may indeed be necessary. I still need to call Bryan about this actually. Sanding might do it though if it's the paint that's doing it. The paint would get removed, but not a big deal since it'll be inside the hole.
-------------------- Curt
www.opticalsupports.com
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imhotep
Vendor - Optical Supports
   
Reged: 02/14/07
Posts: 1477
Loc: Lutz, FL
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Quote:
Beautiful scope, if you dont mind me asking what did the local metal shop charge for the cut outs?
Thanks, and I don't mind a bit. Scroll back a ways. It's been discussed.
-------------------- Curt
www.opticalsupports.com
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Luigi
Postmaster
   
Reged: 07/03/07
Posts: 5272
Loc: MA
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Very nice work. IMO, for max rigidity and lightest weight, mounts for center-mounted mirrors should be construced with the main supporting members parallel to and passing through the optical axis of the the primary, much as you'd support a secondary, rather than plates perpendicular to the axis. Of course, with a secondary you try to minimize width of the the vanes but behind the primary it doesn't matter, and because they can be thicker, tension isn't needed to keep them straight.
-------------------- 17.5" f/5 Dob. IM-715 MCT. 120ED. Lunt 60mm Ha.
Zeiss, Leica, Fujinon, Nikon, Pentax, Bushnell bins
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imhotep
Vendor - Optical Supports
   
Reged: 02/14/07
Posts: 1477
Loc: Lutz, FL
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Yesterday I had one of those experiences where you knew it was a good story in the making. My goal was to test focus using the newly assembled sonotube OTA. I call this…
A PRACTICAL GUIDE: How NOT to test focus with a newly assembled astrograph OTA.
Step 1. Start with a pile of equipment that requires electrical power to get anything done.
Step 2. Drive to a location with no electrical power.
Step 3. Spend a solid hour fumbling around in the dark.
Step 4. Go home, get 4 hours of sleep, and go to work the next morning.
Last night I had a window of opportunity to get this done. After much consternation and deliberation I decided to strap the sonotube to my dovetail bar and test focus on Sirius. Other options were considered, but ultimately I wanted the ability to aim and track during this process. Going into this fiasco I had four devices requiring power:
- Atlas EQ-G
- QHY8 & power supply
- Laptop
- Motorized moonlight focuser
Kevin and I have access to a semi-dark site on a friend’s farm property. There’s always been electrical power inside a nearby shed. For the past two years we’ve been going there and plugging in with no issues. Last night I slapped everything into the sonotube and drove out to meet Kevin around 10:30pm. Skies looked beautiful. I setup and plugged in.
No power.
Flipped breaker. Still no power.
ARGGHHH!!!!!!!!!
I acknowledge that driving to the dark site was totally unnecessary. We were just trying to make an event of it, that’s all. We kept trying to think of ways to power stuff off our car batteries. Every idea came up short by one little missing part or adapter. The bottom line is that I came prepared to plug in and fate had other plans.
However, we succeeded in getting a fairly collimated visual image using various EP/Barlow combinations. I defocused on Sirius through a 26mm super plossl and 2x Barlow. Diffraction rings looked ‘good’ but not perfect. We also looked at Saturn with a UO 7mm ortho. Using some a make-shift project screen we basically measured where the image plane was relative to the top of the fully racked-in drawtube. Camera or not, it’s looking very good!
Lastly we took some photos of the most retarded-looking telescope in the world. How do ya’ll like these ratchet straps?
Everyone should be jealous of my voice-command GOTO system....
"Ok....Kevin, engage the clutchezzzz......NOW"
Hopefully I can test properly in my backyard very soon. Next step is to start popping holes in the hastings tube…..
Also, more to come on that issue with the secondary holder sticking. I talked to Bryan at Protostar and he recommended I ream out the hub gradually until it turns more freely. I did so using a sharp ˝” bit in a corded drill. After four or five iterations I’m getting less sticking, but it’s still nowhere near the point of fine adjustability. I’ll work on it again for the final product, but for the sonotube testing I didn’t fuss over it any further.
-------------------- Curt
www.opticalsupports.com
Edited by imhotep (03/25/09 03:45 PM)
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Chris Curran
scholastic sledgehammer
   
Reged: 06/14/05
Posts: 827
Loc: Brandon, FL
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LOL... Love it!
Psst: try putting a little lithium on that bolt before drilling out some more...
-------------------- cheers & beers,
Chris
Homepage | Over 40?
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Mike I. Jones
Carpal Tunnel
   
Reged: 07/02/06
Posts: 1667
Loc: Fort Worth TX
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Hey Curt! How far above the racked-in focuser did the focal plane finally end up? Did it agree with the sanity-check calculations OK? Mike
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Vincent Becker
sage
Reged: 09/16/08
Posts: 209
Loc: France
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Nice first light anyway!
-------------------- Vincent Becker
10" dobsonian on EQ platform (home-made by my father)
8" string newtonian as travelscope (home-made by myself )
Orion 80ED and GSO 200/1000 on Atlas EQ-G for astro-imaging
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imhotep
Vendor - Optical Supports
   
Reged: 02/14/07
Posts: 1477
Loc: Lutz, FL
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Quote:
Hey Curt! How far above the racked-in focuser did the focal plane finally end up? Did it agree with the sanity-check calculations OK? Mike
It looked like about 1.25" - 1.5", so that's right where it should be, give or take a small bit.
-------------------- Curt
www.opticalsupports.com
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imhotep
Vendor - Optical Supports
   
Reged: 02/14/07
Posts: 1477
Loc: Lutz, FL
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The results are in...
These captures were done without the Paracorr first.

Can you guys check me on the following observation? There's a 0.125"" discrepancy between where I was expecting the focuser travel to be and where it actually was when focus was achieved. My final NEWT model shows a camera height of 1.00" with 0.25" of extra in-travel built into the spacing. I was expecting the camera to reach focus with the drawtube racked out about 0.25" from minimum. Instead it was racked out about 0.125". Then I realized I didn't account for the height of the T/2" lip, so I need to measure it again and see if that's where the missing 0.125" got eaten up. But...that value of 1.00" for the camera height is actually a little too generous. The actual back-focus for the QHY8 is 21mm, or about 0.827", so the lip on the T/2" would have to be nearly 0.5" thick to account for all the missing space and I know for a fact it isn't.
I'm also wondering if being off by 1/8" is anything to be concerned about? I would be more worried if it were off in the opposite direction because that might suggest some vignetting at the secondary mirror, would it not? But in this direction it means there's 0.125" of extra space between the primary and focal plane. Is this a big deal? I'm guessing no.
Now on to the Paracorr...
I attached an older TV PLA to the QHY8 with 35mm of extension between the rear element and the camera's top T-threads. This adds to the 21mm gap from that point to the chip and gives me the 56mm of spacing that's suggested by TV for the PLA.
The big difference is that the PLA is a completely uniform 2" tube, and the extenders are uniform as well, so there's no lip or edge to rest flush against the top of the drawtube. So I inserted the PLA into the focuser and made the back edge flush with the top edge of the drawtube (i.e. the Paracorr is now completely inside the focuser). Then I attempted to reach focus and found it with about an inch racked out.
So....I think I'm good....??? The PLA reaches focus!
I'm officially in new territory. Please point out any problems I am missing.
-------------------- Curt
www.opticalsupports.com
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imhotep
Vendor - Optical Supports
   
Reged: 02/14/07
Posts: 1477
Loc: Lutz, FL
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A couple things just hit me...
1. I'm using a much thicker tube right now than what is specified in my NEWT model.
2. The secondary isn't perfectly centered yet.
I haven't taken a tremendous amount of care in slapping the sonotube OTA together because I just wanted to test focus with it and nothing more. So I think 0.125" of gap could very easily get absorbed in the above two factors, plus there are probably others that all add together.
The thicker tube may actually be the kicker. It think this sonotube may be right at 0.125" thick 
I'll look for the focuser travel to be closer to 0.25" with the final hastings tube build.
-------------------- Curt
www.opticalsupports.com
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Chris Curran
scholastic sledgehammer
   
Reged: 06/14/05
Posts: 827
Loc: Brandon, FL
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Curt,
Yes, the thicker tube is effecting your measurements.
1) Do I read the above correctly in that you reach focus with your focuser racked mostly in (~0.125" out now). Yes?
2) Where is the bottom of that PLA once you reach focus? Is it hanging over your primary?
-------------------- cheers & beers,
Chris
Homepage | Over 40?
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dawsonian2000
scholastic sledgehammer
   
Reged: 07/26/06
Posts: 851
Loc: Riverview, FL, USA
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Yes, differences in tube thickness between your Sonotube and Hastings aluminum tube will affect where your focal plane will fall. Especially if you are placing the optics in the same position from one tube to the other. Compensations or adjustments can be done by moving the primary, but not to the point that would cause vignetting, or spillage of light aroung the minor axis of the secondary.
In any case, I believe your thinking is leading you in the right direction. So continue to use the force, my friend. You have done a great job.
-------------------- Clear Skies, Forever!
The Vega Sky Center
10" (254mm) F/5.65 Homebuilt Fork Mounted Newtonian Reflector
5" (127mm) F/9.4 Homebuilt Refractor
4" (100mm) F/13 Carton Homebuit Refractor (coming soon!)
3.1" (80mm) F/6 Scopos ED APO Refractor
4.5" (114mm) F/8 Tasco 11te-5 Newtonian (under restoration)
2.4" (60mm) F/16.7 Tasco 7te-5 Refractor
2.4" (60mm) F/15 Jason Discoverer 313 Refractor
http://www.vega-sky-center.com
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