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Alph
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 11/23/06
Loc: Melmac
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Re: CGE availability
[Re: DaveJ]
#2967924 - 03/06/09 03:11 PM
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Problems? One or two, like everybody else: cables and micro-switches - both easily corrected.
Is that it? What about PEC? I think it is really bad as compared to the G11. How about serviceability? You mentioned the micro-switches. Did you know that Celestron want you to ship the mount back to them just to replace the switches if it is under the warranty? That’s nuts! How about the supposedly superior motors that get easily damaged when the mount hits the hardstop past the Meridian because the micro-switch failed to turn off tracking?
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jrcrilly
Refractor wienie no more
Reged: 04/30/03
Loc: NE Ohio
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Re: CGE availability
[Re: Alph]
#2968101 - 03/06/09 04:45 PM
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What about PEC? I think it is really bad as compared to the G11. How about serviceability? You mentioned the micro-switches. Did you know that Celestron want you to ship the mount back to them just to replace the switches if it is under the warranty?
The PEC on my CGE worked flawlessly, and I've not seen any reports from others experiencing problems with it. Did you have a defective index switch? When I bought mine the published warranty expressly stated that they would repair defective products if shipped to the factory, so although mine never required service I was aware of the process.
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Alph
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 11/23/06
Loc: Melmac
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Re: CGE availability
[Re: jrcrilly]
#2968174 - 03/06/09 05:22 PM
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The PEC on my CGE worked flawlessly, and I've not seen any reports from others experiencing problems with it
PEC like in PE Curve
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DaveJ
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 01/07/05
Loc: NE Ohio
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Re: CGE availability
[Re: Alph]
#2968183 - 03/06/09 05:26 PM Attachment (29 downloads)
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Hi again, Alph,
Yes, I know that Celestron wanted the mount back, under warranty, to repair my RA micro-switch. I found it a whole lot less expensive and faster to go to the closest Radio Shack and pay $3 for an identical switch and put it in myself - easy if you can de-solder two wires connected to the old switch and re-solder the new switch in. Gee, I think it took me all of 30 minutes. Granted, Celestron's use of the shielded 8-conductor CAT-5e network cables to carry 9 signals (using the shield as the all-important ground) was a poor way of doing things, but there are many viable work-arounds for this and I haven't had a problem since figuring that out...that's what groups like this one, or the Yahoo! groups, are for. I'll stand by my opinion that the CGE is a wonderful mount at its price point. Perfect? No, but nothing is. I remain happy that I sold my G11 and kept the CGE. Of course, your mileage may vary.
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mclewis1
Thread Killer
Reged: 02/25/06
Loc: New Brunswick, Canada
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Re: CGE availability
[Re: Alph]
#2968640 - 03/06/09 09:46 PM
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Is that it? What about PEC? I think it is really bad as compared to the G11.
You "think"? How about all the evidence here and on Yahoo/Groups that in the past 3 years both mounts out of the box deliver on average 20s or less peak to peak. There is virtually no difference.
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How about serviceability? You mentioned the micro-switches. Did you know that Celestron want you to ship the mount back to them just to replace the switches if it is under the warranty? That’s nuts! How about the supposedly superior motors that get easily damaged when the mount hits the hardstop past the Meridian because the micro-switch failed to turn off tracking?
Yes Scott designed the G11 to be easier to service. Well I didn't buy my CGE to tinker with. The basics are easy enough to service (cables, micro switches, etc.) and I don't feel the need to "upgrade" or service my 2 year old CGE, my PE is under 15s peak to peak, smooth and easily autoguided out.
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The Gemini is much more advanced than the Nexstar.
Hardly, the Gemini is older technology, has less features and most folks who use it dislike the menu system.
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The CGE's higher capacity specs are dubious too.
"Dubious", sorry but the mount carries 60-65lbs just fine, just like the spec says. There are folks who've successfully run CGEs with up to 90lbs (look up some of Jerry Wise's post from a few years ago). Both mounts can be loaded up in a similar fashion as they both have bearings, shafts and motors of a similar capability. I regularly run my CGE with a well balanced 55-60lbs and it performs flawlessly.
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Some folks are using the M14 on the G11 which is much heavier than the C14
And some folks are putting 2 or 3 scopes on a CGE which in total more weigh than a C14 ... what does that prove? Just because Celestron doesn't sell that particular combination doesn't mean the CGE isn't capable of handling it. There are plenty of examples of folks who have pushed their mounts with capacities far beyond what the vendor has spec'd.
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The end to the CGE is a little or no loss to this hobby.
Well Alph, you're certainly entitled to your opinion but I'll suggest that the CGE has a) outsold the G11 (anecdotal information ... no facts) and b) will still be providing good use to hundreds or possibly thousands of users years from now ... in my books that's hardly a "loss" to this hobby.
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Bowmoreman
Clear enough skies
Reged: 09/11/06
Loc: Bolton, MA
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Re: CGE availability
[Re: mclewis1]
#2973048 - 03/09/09 02:21 AM
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Quote:
Is that it? What about PEC? I think it is really bad as compared to the G11.
You "think"? How about all the evidence here and on Yahoo/Groups that in the past 3 years both mounts out of the box deliver on average 20s or less peak to peak. There is virtually no difference.
Quote:
How about serviceability? You mentioned the micro-switches. Did you know that Celestron want you to ship the mount back to them just to replace the switches if it is under the warranty? That’s nuts! How about the supposedly superior motors that get easily damaged when the mount hits the hardstop past the Meridian because the micro-switch failed to turn off tracking?
Yes Scott designed the G11 to be easier to service. Well I didn't buy my CGE to tinker with. The basics are easy enough to service (cables, micro switches, etc.) and I don't feel the need to "upgrade" or service my 2 year old CGE, my PE is under 15s peak to peak, smooth and easily autoguided out.
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The Gemini is much more advanced than the Nexstar.
Hardly, the Gemini is older technology, has less features and most folks who use it dislike the menu system.
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The CGE's higher capacity specs are dubious too.
"Dubious", sorry but the mount carries 60-65lbs just fine, just like the spec says. There are folks who've successfully run CGEs with up to 90lbs (look up some of Jerry Wise's post from a few years ago). Both mounts can be loaded up in a similar fashion as they both have bearings, shafts and motors of a similar capability. I regularly run my CGE with a well balanced 55-60lbs and it performs flawlessly.
Quote:
Some folks are using the M14 on the G11 which is much heavier than the C14
And some folks are putting 2 or 3 scopes on a CGE which in total more weigh than a C14 ... what does that prove? Just because Celestron doesn't sell that particular combination doesn't mean the CGE isn't capable of handling it. There are plenty of examples of folks who have pushed their mounts with capacities far beyond what the vendor has spec'd.
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The end to the CGE is a little or no loss to this hobby.
Well Alph, you're certainly entitled to your opinion but I'll suggest that the CGE has a) outsold the G11 (anecdotal information ... no facts) and b) will still be providing good use to hundreds or possibly thousands of users years from now ... in my books that's hardly a "loss" to this hobby.
One word:
AMEN
clear enough skies
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Alph
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 11/23/06
Loc: Melmac
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Re: CGE availability
[Re: Bowmoreman]
#2973781 - 03/09/09 01:51 PM
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Hardly, the Gemini is older technology, has less features and most folks who use it dislike the menu system.
Something tells me that you don’t have a complete understanding what the Gemini controller/software is capable of. I agree with you though, that he Gemini controller was designed for sophisticated users.
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DaveJ
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 01/07/05
Loc: NE Ohio
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Re: CGE availability
[Re: Alph]
#2973805 - 03/09/09 02:05 PM
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Something tells me that you don’t have a complete understanding what the Gemini controller/software is capable of. I agree with you though, that he Gemini controller was designed for sophisticated users.
Duh, we ain't got none of that there so-fist-ic-ation, but we know that the "C" in "PEC" means "CORRECTION" and not "CURVE"
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Lane
Post Laureate
Reged: 11/19/07
Loc: Frisco, Texas
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Re: CGE availability
[Re: DaveJ]
#2974007 - 03/09/09 03:37 PM
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Alph are you saying that people stand around in tuxedos drinking martinis while using a gemini.
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jrbarnett
Eyepiece Hooligan
Reged: 02/28/06
Loc: Petaluma, CA
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Re: CGE availability
[Re: DaveJ]
#2974176 - 03/09/09 04:47 PM
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I am looking hard at the CGE given the deep discounts available from a few of the resellers. In fact, I may just bite the bullet and get a CGE-1100 setup. $4.4k for an 11" SCT and a 65# capacity mount looks like a pretty sweet deal to me. I am also a long time fan of Nexstar. It is light years ahead of Synscan, which is exactly why the CGEM in the end will either force a deep discount on the Atlas or drive it from the market.
That being the case, Gemini is sophisticated feature rich software with an extremely accurate pointing model. Sure its nested menu structure is cumbersome and takes some practice, and aligning takes more time, but it really is good stuff. It has some very observer-savvy features like "Z search" and "Wobble" for helping detect targets at the threshold of visibility. It's good stuff.
If I could get a G-11 Gemini for $2680, it would be an easy choice (for me). I favor being able to fix my own gear easily if the manufacturer no longer supports it and I also like the clutchless axes and having manual setting circles as a back-up to the computer. But the truth is the Losmandy mounts have gotten more expensive in the face of serious competition. An odd strategy to be sure, probably reflecting real increased costs.
Nothing wrong with either mount and the CGE's new, lower price makes it especially tempting despite some of the advantages of the Losmandy G-11.
Regards,
Jim
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mclewis1
Thread Killer
Reged: 02/25/06
Loc: New Brunswick, Canada
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Re: CGE availability
[Re: Alph]
#2974361 - 03/09/09 06:12 PM
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Something tells me that you don’t have a complete understanding what the Gemini controller/software is capable of. I agree with you though, that he Gemini controller was designed for sophisticated users.
Alph,
Please don't put words in my mouth, especially when you're trying to make a less than subtle insinuation about the folks who use the Gemini based systems.
I don't own a Gemini based system so I certainly don't have "a complete understanding" (and short of Messrs. Görlich, Losmandy, Diehl, and a few others I don't think anyone does) but I have used a few and watched as other folks have used them, I've even been around a few side by side comparisons.
I've seen things I like and some things that I don't in both systems. We could probably debate features and function between the two all day long but this really isn't the "forum" to do so. The two systems while both very capable telescope control systems were designed for different requirements. With the Gemini it appears to be for a more complex user, and with lots of hardware flexibility (has to work with a variety of vendor's hardware). The Nexstar has to work on Celestron hardware only, but for a much wider user audience. I simply suggest that the more advanced system is the one that meets the requirements of all users, beginner, intermediate, as well as advanced.
Finally you have to admit the older hardware technology behind the Gemini is really starting to show it's age ... Eprom burning vs. flash for firmware upgrades, come on. So maybe you were simply referring to age when you said "The Gemini is much more advanced than the Nexstar."?
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Dan M
member
Reged: 10/11/08
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Re: CGE availability
[Re: mclewis1]
#2978996 - 03/12/09 01:52 AM
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I love my CGE also and it carries both a 12'' LX200R and Orion 110ED on it (73 lbs. total with accessories) without breaking a sweat! 
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waassaabee
Post Laureate
Reged: 11/26/07
Loc: Central California Coast
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Re: CGE availability
[Re: mclewis1]
#2979224 - 03/12/09 08:27 AM
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So maybe you were simply referring to age when you said "The Gemini is much more advanced than the Nexstar."?
 
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