jrcrilly
Refractor wienie again
Reged: 04/30/03
Posts: 22469
Loc: NE Ohio
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Quote:
Great job Harley, lots of good information there regardless of what some may say.
Yes - please keep the reports coming!
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John C
Urban Observatory
Tele Vue Pronto
A&M/Astreya 76mm F/6 APO
TMB/LOMO 80mm F/7.5 APO
Tak FSQ-106N F/5 APO
Meade 152ED F/9 "APO"
152mm F/10 achromat
Tak CN-212 8" F/12 classical Cass/ F/4 Newt
Teeter 20" F/3.8 truss Newt w/ServoCat
LXD750, EM-200, CI-700
ST-10XME
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Chris/Scott/Mark/John - Appreciate the positive feedback - I hope the post contains some useful info.
Pollux - thanks for the info - and if you ever get access to a Fringe Killer, I would love to see an update to your excellent photo comparison on the filters.
I was surprised (and I admit a little amused) at the yahoo response to the link. It looks like my post, and several followups, were removed and my posting priveldge revoked.
I was tried and found guitly on 2 counts -
>mentioning the word "dob" in a refractor group in a positive light
and
>"conspiring to turn an achro into an APO".
But your honor, I never mentioned the word "Chromacor".
At the risk of repeating myself, I would just like to reiterate that Cloudy Nights is a tremendous resource to amateur astronomers. The level of knowledge that many of the members have accumulated, as well as the respectful way that everyone interacts, make me grateful to be part of the community.
Regards,
Harley
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C6-RGT
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celestial_search
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 11/18/04
Posts: 2285
Loc: Iowa, USA
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Nice review. My friend bought one a month ago. We hope to view through both our scopes when the weather clears. I'll alert him to this post. I found the section about alignment matches my experience to a tee.
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Frank
C-11 XLT
8" f/6 Newt on GEM
Tak FS-102II
SV 80L Triplet APO
Orion Mak 127mm
EQ-6 Mount on pier in backyard observatory
CG-5 AS (GOTO)
Surveyor's tripod/Hercules single-arm alt-az mount
SBIG ST-5C CCD and Canon Digital Rebel XT
Oberwerk 15X70s and Pentax 10X21s
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Donnie
sage
Reged: 03/15/04
Posts: 271
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Congratulations Hiker. I had one of those scopes a few years ago. You will get a lot of great views and use from that scope.
As far as the Yahoo groups thing. Four or five years ago, they were the only game in town. They used to be called e-groups. Then Yahoo took over. NOw there are a lot better choices on the net. CN is a good example.
I find Yahoo groupos to be the most non-user friendly groups around. Not just because of the people that frequent them. Cause there are some nice people to be found on them. The way the messages are stored and retrieved. None of the groups are easy to search. Very hard to find useful information that is more than a few days old.
The people are another thing. I am a member of about 8 groups, most are non-astro related. I do 3d animation on the side for several local production studios. I use those groups to help stay current within the field. Software discussion.
I dont know what it is about Astronomy. Most people I meet online and offline are really great. But for some reason most people are unwilling to think that someone could choose differently from them and enjoy it. A great amount of ownership pride comes into play in Astronomy.
Take my 127ED. I am very pleased with it. I think it was a bargain at $1100. At the same time I know full well that it is not a "premium" refractor. Mechanics or optical wise. I know that limitation and I accept it. Yet if I go to most any major Astronomy forum and describe the wonderful views it gives, well, people immediately say stuff like "You dont know what a good scope is", or you are just a noob. The Yahoo groups seem to be the worst about this. A very elitest attitude exists on most all of them. I love being called a noob by someone who just got in the hobby a year ago and bought all "premium" equipment. After more than 20 years at this hobby I really get a kick out of it. Im not an expert by any means. But the thing that I learned early on is to enjoy and make the most of the equipment you have on hand. Sure we would all love to own the "best" equipment.
The only Yahoo group that I have consistently been a member of over the years is the SCT users group which is run by Rod Mollise. It is Catadioptric focused, but people are allowed to say what they want. Within reason. Obviously profanity is not something that is condoned. But if a user finds a problem with a scope, they are encouraged to post about it. Sometime a solution can be found, if everyone knows the problem. Rod is a good example of a good group owner.
I see that your report on the Yahoo group was not viewed positively. Thats the other side of the groups. If you post something that is not 100% positive about a scope a lot of times it gets censored. People simply dont want to hear about inadequacies of their respective choice. I am quite the opposite.
I like to have all the information I can before making a purchase. Being on a budget I know that every scope I purchase will have its share of compromises. Your report would have been very helpful when I bought one of these scopes a few years ago.
Obviously, every scope is a compromise in some area. But being on a budget this is even more obvious. I am glad you posted the review. Hopefully others contemplating a purchase decision will find it useful.
Thanks for sharing with the group. Im sure many will find it invaluable reading.
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Donnie
Scopeless for a while now, too busy anyway.
About to change that!!
Wonderful wife.
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Chris G
Post Laureate
Reged: 08/12/04
Posts: 4027
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Quote:
Chris/Scott/Mark/John - Appreciate the positive feedback - I hope the post contains some useful info.
Pollux - thanks for the info - and if you ever get access to a Fringe Killer, I would love to see an update to your excellent photo comparison on the filters.
I was surprised (and I admit a little amused) at the yahoo response to the link. It looks like my post, and several followups, were removed and my posting priveldge revoked.
I was tried and found guitly on 2 counts -
>mentioning the word "dob" in a refractor group in a positive light
and
>"conspiring to turn an achro into an APO".
But your honor, I never mentioned the word "Chromacor".
At the risk of repeating myself, I would just like to reiterate that Cloudy Nights is a tremendous resource to amateur astronomers. The level of knowledge that many of the members have accumulated, as well as the respectful way that everyone interacts, make me grateful to be part of the community.
Regards,
Harley
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C6-RGT
Ditto, my posts must be approved by the owner. Must be if you offer an opinion differing from the owner your blacklisted and your post removed.
I had posted this in response to his Ralph's (lens_doc) post where he completely disagreed with everything you said. I hate Yahoo Groups that won't allow post a disenting opinion. The owner get on their own little power trips. Small minds must be.
Here was what I had posted.
"I disagree almost completely on your write up of the C6-RGT, and the perception you seem to be trying to leave people about this scope. You make it seem like the scope needs hundreds of dollars to be a decent scope. I hate to see people make write ups like this, because the C6-RGT right out of the box is an excellent scope for the money."
Ralph I think you're coming off a little strong in your response. Overall I think this is a great write up with a lot of great information.
"You make it seem like the scope needs hundreds of dollars to be a decent scope. "
I don't agree here Ralph. The write up says;
" Accessories:
If you decide to order the scope, following are suggestions for several accessories that I found will improve the scope’s overall performance. The majority of accessories are under $100 and many are under $50. Don’t feel you have to add them all at once. Astronomy is a very enjoyable hobby that will likely keep you interested for the rest of your life. Add a few accessories each year as your budget allows. "
As he says, they are suggestions.
I think the write up is good in that it while this is a fantastic scope, it's large, heavy and has some quirks to work through. I wish I had read a write up like this when I had gotten my scope, I still would have bought it but I would have known some of issues I would have to deal with I wouldn't have had some of the initial frustration I had. How about the fact you do have to buy a power supply to use it, I can't get my truck into my back yard to use the 12V cord supplied with the scope and they don't make a 12V adapter that works with the mount, even though they listed one for it, that was a waste of money to buy when I bought the scope. With out power the mount and scope are tough to use, that information would have nice to know so that I didn't have to let my scope sit through a couple of clear nights waiting for the power supply to arrive. That's valuable information for a new buyer to have.
The accessories listed do make it a better scope and maybe Harley could have worded it as these will make your viewing more enjoyable but he did say they are suggestions.
I love my C6R-GT and while it's far from perfect it's a great scope but a newbie could be very intimidated by the mount set up and alignment and I think Harley gives some valuable tips here.
"Summary:
The CR-RGT is a great scope and I’m glad I bought it. I appreciate the light gathering capacity of the 6” optics and have really enjoyed making minor enhancements to improve the usability of the scope. The mount seems very stable for visual use and the price for the mount/OTA combination is unbeatable. If you decide to purchase the C6R, have fun personalizing it to meet your needs. But most of all, take time to enjoy the skies!"
Couldn't agree with this more, well said.
Just my opinions, not that they count for anything. YMMV
Chris
Jackson, MI
Now I ask you, was my post out of line???
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"Ain't nothin' Human 'bout the Human Race"
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Donnie,
Thanks for the response. It is unfortunate the some of the yahoo groups have such a narrow perspective. By censuring information which disagrees with the moderator's viewpoint, they are really doing a disservice to the other users on the forum. Like you, I am on a budget and try to understand the positives and negatives before engaging in a major purchase.
Chris,
Thanks for copying your yahoo post - it was not available by the time I read the forum earlier today. It seems like a thoughtfully presented, polite response.
Regards,
Harley
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Refractor6
Post Laureate
Reged: 10/20/04
Posts: 3144
Loc: Vancouver B.C. , Canada
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Harley,
My Skywatcher 150 f/8 has been a ongoing{now complete} labor of love. So I much appreciated your very good write up on improvements and modifications owners can do to the scope. Sorry to hear that some others out there don't understand this point of view. With some thoughtful additions these scopes can present you with years of satisfying observing. Cloudy Nights is a great place to hear many different points of view on astro equipment and because of that something new can always be learned from this site. 
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Stan
Skywatcher 150 f/8 refractor
Antares "Prototype"127 f/6.45 refractor
Skywatcher ED80
Celestron/Vixen Premium 80
Orion 9x63+15 x63 mini giant binoculars
Edited by Refractor6 (01/16/05 09:17 PM)
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pollux
Reged: 04/01/04
Posts: 6185
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Not just learning something new.....
Knowing who's the refractor nuts is real fun.
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Rusty
Postmaster
Reged: 08/06/03
Posts: 16406
Loc: Brooker, FL
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Hmmmm....pollux, does anyone come to mind? 
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N11GPS Fastar
TOA-130S
MK66 Std
Vintage C5
Megrez II 80mm ED Triplet APO
SolarMax 40
NJP Temma II
Sirius EQ-G
ST8XE/CFW-8(LRGBHa)/AO-7/DF-2/STV Dlx/ST237a/350D (Unmodded)/Mallincam Color Hyper Plus/DSI III Color/DSI II Pro
Two not-spoiled Golden Retrievers - Maggie and Casey
Sometimes I think we're alone in the universe, and sometimes I think we're not. In either case the idea is quite staggering. - Arthur C. Clarke
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Stan,
Thanks for the kind words - glad to hear that you are enjoying the Skywatcher 150 - we are so fortunate to have excellent 6" achros available at such a reasonable price.
Regards,
Harley
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C6-RGT
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pollux
Reged: 04/01/04
Posts: 6185
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Quote:
Hmmmm....pollux, does anyone come to mind?
Rusty, you should know who I am referring
2 "s" and 2 "b"
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Scott Beith
SRF
Reged: 11/26/03
Posts: 33072
Loc: Gulfport, MS
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  Scott
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -- Edmund Burke.
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell
"The measure of a man’s greatness is not determined by what he accomplishes for himself, but by what he accomplishes for others.” -- Some Bald Guy
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pollux
Reged: 04/01/04
Posts: 6185
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I can't really mention who they are. I only can "hint" or I will get sued for leaking out trade secrets  
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Rusty
Postmaster
Reged: 08/06/03
Posts: 16406
Loc: Brooker, FL
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Ah, pollux, you're right on..we know who they (/you) are (and we have complete dossiers on them, as well as constant surveillance...)  
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N11GPS Fastar
TOA-130S
MK66 Std
Vintage C5
Megrez II 80mm ED Triplet APO
SolarMax 40
NJP Temma II
Sirius EQ-G
ST8XE/CFW-8(LRGBHa)/AO-7/DF-2/STV Dlx/ST237a/350D (Unmodded)/Mallincam Color Hyper Plus/DSI III Color/DSI II Pro
Two not-spoiled Golden Retrievers - Maggie and Casey
Sometimes I think we're alone in the universe, and sometimes I think we're not. In either case the idea is quite staggering. - Arthur C. Clarke
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pollux
Reged: 04/01/04
Posts: 6185
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Quote:
I do 3d animation on the side for several local production studios.
Really?! I like doing 3D stuff but my skill is still limited to the hobby level
Yeah, I also find the Yahoo groups and many internet forums out there (especially those dealing with nerd/geek related topics like computer, electronic, games etc) are sometimes very harsh to deal with.
Many of the posters there are just little kids who stay in front of the computer & TV screen 24/7. They really need peopling skills BADLY.
In some graphic/CG related forums I was usually being bashed by the professionals (many of them have been in the industry for long time but they hurt people like no tomorrow....maybe they hate competition?)..... 80% of them all said the same thing - my works stink
Seriously, there were a few times I was so hurt and almost put me to a point that I really don't want to do graphics/3D/multimedia stuff anymore ......because of those jerks.
Still recovering from the damage on my confidence
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Pollux,
I agree with many of your perceptions. That's why I was so pleased to find Cloudy Nights - people are consistently polite and friendly, there is a broad spectrum of experience to draw on and newcomers are genuinely welcomed.
Hang in there with the graphics - one of the keys to life is to find something you honestly enjoy doing and it sounds like you have - now if I could just get you to paint orange flames on that nice white AR6
Harley
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C6-RGT
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pollux
Reged: 04/01/04
Posts: 6185
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Quote:
now if I could just get you to paint orange flames on that nice white AR6
Harley
NOT A CHANCE!
BTW, my scope isn't AR-6 while it looks like it.
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Scott Beith
SRF
Reged: 11/26/03
Posts: 33072
Loc: Gulfport, MS
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Does anyone have photos of their C6R setups?
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Scott
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -- Edmund Burke.
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell
"The measure of a man’s greatness is not determined by what he accomplishes for himself, but by what he accomplishes for others.” -- Some Bald Guy
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Scott,
Excellent idea - it would be great to see what people have done with the scope - I'll try to borrow a camera and post a couple this w/e.
Regards,
Harley
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C6-RGT
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Donnie
sage
Reged: 03/15/04
Posts: 271
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The following is off topic, I apologise in advance.
Pollux. I have been to your website. On the contrary, your work does not stink. Well rounded portfolio you have there. It took me a long time to break into the local scene here. I would go to companies and submit demo tapes of my work. Never hear back from them.
I thought the same as you. My work just stinks. Then one day a guy I work with at my regular job mentioned to me that he knew one of the guys who is a partner in a local studio. Said he knew him real well. I explained my dilemma to him. He took my demo tape for the guy to see. I got a call right away. I stopped by the studio the next day. I get work from them probably once or twice a month.
What I found out is that when I would drop my tape off, the receptionist would always give it to the "3D" guy there. Well, as you might imagine, he really didnt want anyone else doing the work, it might cut him out of a job. Since then I have learned to ask for the production manager at studio's. If I know he has a part in the graphic production, I might even ask the receptionist to give the tape to a higher up.
I was quite surprised at how well this worked. There's a reason I was never getting calls back, no one wanted anyone else to know of my work.
Its a very competetive industry. Keep at it. If you love to do it, it will be obvious and your work will reflect that and I think it currently does.
As far as forums for 3D software, to some degree they are worse than Astro forums. If its not some guy ripping your work off, its someone ripping it by tearing it apart and overly criticising it. Criticism is fine when it is constructive. We all can learn a lot from others. But often its just an excuse for an adolescent to act their age.
Most professionals dont frequent those forums. They might look through the galleries from time to time. Most of their talent and recruiting comes from people who send them samples of their work.
I think your work is excellent. Very creative and nice attention to detail. Good job!!
Sorry everyone else for being OT.
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Donnie
Scopeless for a while now, too busy anyway.
About to change that!!
Wonderful wife.
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