strdst
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 03/23/08
Posts: 830
Loc: Oregon USA
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I'm a refractor kind of guy, but this Criterion has me feeling a little dizzy. When I was 12 or 13 and realized, like a lot of us here, a 3" or 4" Unitron was never going to happen (never say never), I briefly turned my attention to the Criterion 6" Dynascope. A Newtonian reflector of all things. Of course at the rate I was acquiring wealth the RV-6 was also out of the question. I scotch taped the ad from a Sky&Telescope to a gallon wine bottle (no, I didn't drink the wine first), seeded it with a few coins, and kept it in my room. By the end of that summer I had a few more coins, but still about $198 shy of the $199.99 I needed. O K so I learned you can't culture money like sourdough... or can you? So 45 summers, and a few wine bottles (from wine I did drink), later I now actually have the 199.99! And there is an RV-6 for sale.
I'm sure a few of you have looked at the listing. I've been keeping a high bid presence, and have had some contact with the seller. Any observations or opinions about what you see in the listing. The seller seems to be quite precise (owns a machine shop... go figure) And has prepared a great visual presentation.
Besides having to look into the wrong end, is there something else I should know about the RV-6? The seller looked inside the drive motor cover at my request and found 182 imprinted there. I had read the manufacture date was (penciled) in there... true? Does 182 mean anything? Can anyone guess at a vintage? Does it look complete to those of you in the know? I suppose this will head north of the original selling price before the auction ends. I just want to be sure I'm getting the one used for that 1960 advertisement photo shoot, or at least one close to it.
I think it's been pretty well documented that the optics were pretty sweet in these instruments. Were some years better than others? Is there a good way to determine whether the mirror needs re-coating from across country? What is the best method to see a scratch in the mirror or coating? The seller mentioned in the eBAY copy about seeing one, but after blowing off the dust with solvent (his words), he can no longer see it. Should I ask what the solvent was? Please post away, I need your help 
other Keith
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Bonco
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 04/17/06
Posts: 2297
Loc: Florida
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Lots of questions but here is a short answer. The RV6 was good in its time and is a good value today, if you're careful not to buy junk and willing to do some restoring. I wouldn't worry about vintage, because basically it was the same scope with minor changes over the years. The optics typically were very good to superior.
Plan on recoating and decide before you buy if you can afford this. The original scope was not perfect but a bargain in its day. The mount is just adequate and the drive while functional has lots of slop in the drive train.
Good luck on your venture.
Cheers, Bill
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RV6
Meade 2045
6 inch f/4 RFT R. Fagin Optics
TV Genesis
2.4 inch Lafayette Equitorial
3 inch Polarex/Unitron Equitorial
10 inch Zhumell
PST 40mm Solar scope
4 inch F/15 Antares
2.4 inch Unitron Equitorial
Tasco 10K 80mm/1200mm
Towa 339 Restored
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Jim Rosenstock
Post Laureate
Reged: 07/14/05
Posts: 3711
Loc: MD, south of the DC Nebula
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Bill pretty much nailed it. It's a great scope if you like that kind of thing. Should be a fun project, maybe take you back to your youth, huh?
The RV-6 currently on the Bay (selling out of Brattleboro Vermont) has an older-style mount (around the time of the Apollo program, they added "moon lander feet" to the mount) so this one appears to be pre-1968 or so...
The chances of this scope having an excellent primary mirror are quite good.
Most everything else about these scopes was a bit quirky, but quite usable.
Frankly, it would be a lot less bother to get a new, lightweight 6" f/8 Chinese Dob....but your're not that kind of guy, are you? 
So, get out there and start mowing lawns, young man....you have a telescope to buy! 
Cheers,
Jim
p.s. there's a great Yahoo Dynascope group that will be quite helpful with all your restoration questions, parts swapping, upgrade ideas, etc. Also, there were quite a few of these made; they turn up fairly frequently, so no need to go overboard with any one opportunity. Since they were made in Connecticut, more tend to show up on the east coast (just as many more Caves turn up on the Left Coast...) Make sure he packs it well for its cross-country trip!
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actionhac
professor emeritus
Reged: 08/09/08
Posts: 732
Loc: WA
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Hi Keith. A reflector! I think I did look at that on EB, nice photos, and I think it could be a older model with the serial plate on the OTA and mount.
Ask the seller if he could look at the numbers stamped around the drive motor, that will give you a date if it's original which it probably is.
RV-6's are great, better than the Edmund 6"f8 and you know for me to say that means it is REALLY good!
No doubt has a UPCO mirror (same as the Edmund) they hold up well over the decades but you could ask him to shine a light thru it to see if it is getting thin.
Thats a real classic, good luck.
Robert
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strdst
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 03/23/08
Posts: 830
Loc: Oregon USA
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Robert,
I know, a lot of info gets lost in my verbiage. The seller found 182 stamped inside the drive motor cover. 182(0) ? 1(9)82 ? Does one of these "dates" seem likely? Were they ever marked month and year as in 1 82 = Jan. 1982?
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actionhac
professor emeritus
Reged: 08/09/08
Posts: 732
Loc: WA
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It could be. If so that would have been one of the last RV-6's they stopped making them for good in 1982, by that date the price was $359.95.
The EB RV-6 has serial plates on the mount and OTA which makes me think it is from the mid 60's, they started skipping things like that later on, and no leveling screws on the legs pushes it out of the early 60's.
Robert
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jeffg
member
Reged: 02/13/07
Posts: 66
Loc: Irvine CA
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I agree you'll probably have to spend some time restoring it. Sending the mirror off to be recoated is the first thing I'd do, then spend that time replacing bolts that have rusted or corroded. Check the counterweight and the dec shaft for rust spots as well. The drive is probably okay if it runs, but may need new cork for the clutch. You can find that at the hardware store as well.
I've never been one for restoring to original condition, so on my RV-6 I replaced the focuser with a Crayford, and put in a RACI Orion finder. That makes it much easier to use. Here's a picture of my restored RV-6 from 1968 vintage.
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Jeff
14", 10", & 4.25" Dobs
8" Schmidt Newtonian, C-8 SC, 8" LSC
6" Cave Student Model A, 6" Dall-Kirkham, 6" RV-6
5" Refractor & 80 mm Folded Refractor
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Bonco
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 04/17/06
Posts: 2297
Loc: Florida
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Here's my 1960 vintage RV6 with Criterion camera holder. I bought it back then with paper route money.
Cheers, Bill
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RV6
Meade 2045
6 inch f/4 RFT R. Fagin Optics
TV Genesis
2.4 inch Lafayette Equitorial
3 inch Polarex/Unitron Equitorial
10 inch Zhumell
PST 40mm Solar scope
4 inch F/15 Antares
2.4 inch Unitron Equitorial
Tasco 10K 80mm/1200mm
Towa 339 Restored
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strdst
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 03/23/08
Posts: 830
Loc: Oregon USA
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Jeff, Bill, Jim, Robert
Your scopes...they're...beautiful! I don't know what is happening to me. I've never felt this way about a reflector before. I would want to keep whatever I might find original in spite of its shortcomings. It would be great to see Jupiter this summer with some magnification.
Maybe its the seeing here but 120X is about all my best 60mm's can handle, 150X for the 65mm Nippon Kogaku & my 3 76mm scopes, The highest mag. 1 1/4" eyepiece I have is 12.4mm which only produces 66X in my 102mm Tak. That's as far as I've taken it. Hmmm, 15X per inch... I know it can do more. My largest aperture scope is an orange C-8. which handles 160X (20X per inch) before the image deteriorates. Maybe instead of a new scope I should be looking for some new real estate.
Back to the RV-6. I haven't paid enough attention to these in the last few years to know the going price. I see the one on the Indy Craigslist and think $300 would be a pretty great price if shipping weren't an issue/expense. Is that about what you would expect to get if you chose to sell yours?
other Keith
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actionhac
professor emeritus
Reged: 08/09/08
Posts: 732
Loc: WA
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Keith go to the CN classified and look at the Mizar reflector for $50.00.
Could be very nice, the classic Japanese mirrors were very good, fine polish by hand.
$300.00 would be a average price for a RV-6, any less is a good deal.
Robert
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desertrefugee
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 08/06/07
Posts: 1215
Loc: Arizona
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Keith, every classic telescope collector ought to have at least one Criterion in the herd.
(Here's mine):
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"Illimitable ocean, without bound, Without dimension, where length, breadth, and height, And time, and place are lost." - Milton
-Darrell
Reflectors - 76 to 305mm (f4.7 to f9.2)
Refractors - 50 to 120mm (f5 to f16.7)
Binoculars - 6x15 to 22x100
N. Phoenix, AZ
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trainsktg
Post Laureate
Reged: 08/23/05
Posts: 4586
Loc: Pacific Northwest
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I had both of my RV-6 mirrors recoated, one at Newport Glass and another at OWL. If I remember right, both cost less than $100 and that included insuring each mirror for $150 and shipping both ways. Worse case, if the scope is in good condition with a trashed mirror coating, I'd consider the $300 total worth the price. Good luck.
Keith (no Criterions in the herd yet  )
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He was a good little monkey and always very curious.
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strdst
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 03/23/08
Posts: 830
Loc: Oregon USA
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Quote:
Worse case, if the scope is in good condition with a trashed mirror coating, I'd consider the $300 total worth the price. Good luck
Hi Keith,
$300 total price...do you mean scope, shipping, and recoating?
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trainsktg
Post Laureate
Reged: 08/23/05
Posts: 4586
Loc: Pacific Northwest
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Yes Sir. Scope, shipping and recoating. Now, we're all assuming the mirror needs recoating. My 3" f6 (UPCO mirror)from 1970 still has the original coating which is still in excellent contition because I've kept it sealed when not in use. This eBay scope may be the same.
Keith
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He was a good little monkey and always very curious.
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strdst
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 03/23/08
Posts: 830
Loc: Oregon USA
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Well, I never got the first RV-6 on eBAY in Vermont which started this thread, nor the one on the D.C. Craigslist, but good ol' eBAY... I just now "won" one in Florida. Couldn't have been farther away and still conus! There goes my lawn mowing money! Thanks to all of you that were available to answer my questions. Can't wait to see what kind of newfangled telescope design this Newton character has come up with
other Keith
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tim53
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 12/17/04
Posts: 1440
Loc: Highland Park, CA
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I saw that one!
-Tim.
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"We`re just waiting looking skyward as the days come down.
Someone promised there`d be answers, if we stayed around."
-Orchestral Maneuvers in the Dark, "The Romance of the Telescope"
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BRisley
sage
Reged: 09/04/06
Posts: 345
Loc: SW Florida
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Well Keith, didn't know I was bidding against you. It is basically around the corner for me. Good luck with it.
Brian
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3 C-8's (2 OT 72/80 and SPC-8)
8" f5 Dob
Meade 4450 on EQ-2
Meade 4501 on EQ-2
Tasco 4.5" on EQ-2
Tasco Starguide 60GT
C-90/Cometron Sky Scanner 80 mounted tandem in a C-8 Fork
Cometron CO-62
Meade 11x80 Bino
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strdst
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 03/23/08
Posts: 830
Loc: Oregon USA
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Quote:
Well Keith, didn't know I was bidding against you. It is basically around the corner for me. Good luck with it.
Brian
Thanks Brian. Sorry, that price would have been especially sweet with no shipping fees. The way things weirdly work, the next one to come along will probably be in my neighborhood and have your name written all over it!
other Keith
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johnfdean
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 06/04/06
Posts: 1031
Loc: southern tip of Illinois
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Hi Darrel,
I owned a 4" Dynascope for over 20 years. I finally gave it to a neighborhood kid when I realized I had stopped usig it. I still wonder if he made good use of it.
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Celestron C6 f/5 by Vixen with Polaris GEM
14" Tscope dob f/4.7 with Argo Navis
80mm Nighthawk on Eq 2
Celestron C-4 f/10 GEM
Sky Scout
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actionhac
professor emeritus
Reged: 08/09/08
Posts: 732
Loc: WA
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Nice scope Keith.
I can't wait to hear what a refractor guy thinks of a reflector!
152mm X 1219mm!
Robert
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