Jimmy2K63
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 04/26/09
Posts: 1127
Loc: Kentucky
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Seems like forever since we had a reasonably clear sky but tonite the clouds parted a bit. I went outside to sit on the deck and as my eyes adapted, thngs started to look better, so I thought I would pull out the binoculars for a bit. Scorpius is up nice and high allready and I have never had optical assistance to view Scorpius at 39 degrees (just 50). A full 10 degrees or so makes a lot of difference. M4 is an absolute gem in 15x70's. I am completely blown away that it is that good.
I ordered a telescope last night (Meade 6" SN) and thought about what role my binoculars might play dwon the road, and do I really need both? I think I got my answer tonite and it reminded me why I chose these - they stay perfectly mounted to the tripod at all times and takes 20 seconds to set them up outside and be viewing. You can see half a dozen objects in the time it takes a scope to cool down. I can't wait to compare them side by side.
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BobinKy
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 04/27/07
Posts: 1672
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Jimmy...
I am glad to see that you are getting along well with the 15x70 and the Orion mount. Yes, walking out the backdoor and being focused on an object in 20 seconds is hard to beat!
M4 is such a tantalizing sight through 15x70s--bright and at the threshold of resolving the center stars.
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Bob
38°N
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Man in a Tub
Not Retired!, But a little cranky!!!
Reged: 10/28/08
Posts: 1883
Loc: San Francisco, CA
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Phil Harrington has made the following request in his inaugural Binocular Universe column here on Cloudy Nights:
Quote:
"Even small binoculars will show M4 as a tiny, undefined smudge of grayish light just to the west of Antares. My 10x50s add in a slightly brighter core at its center. Increase magnification and aperture, and all of a sudden the core appears bisected by a brighter column of light. Large telescopes show this to be a chain of 11th-magnitude stars that just happen to line up in a straight row. I can't make it out through my 10x50s, but can through my 16x70s, as shown below, and 20x80s. I wonder what the smallest binocular is that will show this unusual feature. Give it a try for yourself and let me know how you make out."
from The Heart of the Scorpion, June 2009
I hope folks will respond.
Clear Skies!
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Todd
Brunton Eterna 15x51 ° Garrett Optical Signature Series 15x70
Nikon Action EX 12x50 ° Oberwerk 15x60 and 20x80 Standard
Orion Paragon Plus Mount and Paragon XHD Tripod
Garrett Optical Series 2000 Grip-Action Monopod
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Special Ed
Post Laureate
Reged: 05/18/03
Posts: 4232
Loc: Greenbrier Co., WV 38N, 80W
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Jimmy,
A good view to the south and a good pair of binoculars and you have it made.  Phil's fine article just focuses on the region near Antares--travel down the Scorpion's back and tail and you'll be amazed at what you'll see.
At our latitude, M4 only reaches an altitude of ~25 degrees, so it's best to wait for it to be near the meridian if you want to try for that central bar of stars. Since it is a summer object, transparency is also a limiting factor, especially with M4's low altitude. I was unable to detect the central bar with my 15x70's last June when I made this observation. I'll have to look again if it ever clears. I'll try with my 12x36 ISB's, too. BTW, I got a look at M4 through a friend's 16" Lightbridge at the Green Bank StarQuest last July and the view was astounding , central chain and all. 
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Michael Rosolina
8" f/10 Orange Tube SCT
4.25" f/4.2 Astroscan Reflector
SVP 3.6" f/13.6 CA Reflector
40mm PST f/10
APM Germany HD 15x70 binoculars
Canon 12x36 IS II binoculars
Mark I Eyeball
My CN Gallery
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BobinKy
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 04/27/07
Posts: 1672
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Special Ed...
Very nice sketch of your 2008 observation of M4. Thank you for sharing.
...
By the way, what did you think of the Green Bank StarQuest? I have been thinking of packing up and visiting the dark skies in the Monongahela National Forest (West Virginia). I have heard the area has some of the darkest skies in the U.S. that are East of the Mississippi River. Dark Sky Finder
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Bob
38°N
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Special Ed
Post Laureate
Reged: 05/18/03
Posts: 4232
Loc: Greenbrier Co., WV 38N, 80W
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Thanks, Bob.
The GBSQ is great fun--a nice facility (the National Radio Astronomy Observatory grounds) with a large visitor center. Lots of indoor room for guest speakers (Astronaut Alan Bean this year), presentations, and vendors. Pretty dark skies, too. Here's more details: GBSQ 6 Check out their website, too.
There are some very dark sky sites in WV--the Mon is one of them. You're probably referring to Spruce Knob--the NOVAC group has a couple of outings there. Closer to KY is Calhoun State Park--it's on the Dark Sky Finder, too. I've not been there but heard some very good things about it from those who have.
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Michael Rosolina
8" f/10 Orange Tube SCT
4.25" f/4.2 Astroscan Reflector
SVP 3.6" f/13.6 CA Reflector
40mm PST f/10
APM Germany HD 15x70 binoculars
Canon 12x36 IS II binoculars
Mark I Eyeball
My CN Gallery
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BobinKy
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 04/27/07
Posts: 1672
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SpecialEd...
Thanks for the information on GBSQ 6 and the dark skies of West Virginia.
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Bob
38°N
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Jimmy2K63
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 04/26/09
Posts: 1127
Loc: Kentucky
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The seeing this evening is not comparable to last evening. I would describe it as poor. There is a ton of moisture in the air, so heavy that it's causing lighting to spread upwards. Nothing like the nearly coal black conditions of last night. I had no success in spotting the central bar of 11th mag stars. M4 was barely there, unlike last evening. Antares was awash with many colors. If your skies are any better please feel free to report your attempts.
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http://astronomyguy63.blogspot.com/ (Updated 11/7/09)
LXD75 SN6-UHTC
Cave Astrola 10" f/5
Garrett 15x70/FarSight
Canon XS (1000D)
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GadgetGeek
member
Reged: 06/09/09
Posts: 13
Loc: New Jersey, USA
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I just took a peek and with a pair of 10x42 I see M4 as a faint smudge.:)
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Swarovski SLC 10x42WB(neu)
Fujinon FMTR-SX 7x50
Pentax DCF WP 10x42
Televue eyepieces
Previous equipment
Meade LX90 8"
Meade ETX-90
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russty55
member
Reged: 07/18/07
Posts: 26
Loc: New Zealand
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Hi all, M4 is nice in both my 10x50 and 15x70 bino's. Of course Scorpio is almost directly overhead this time of year here in New Zealand. I will look for the chain of stars Phil mentions. Tonight is overcast of course...........
Shame you guys can't see Omega Centauri or 47 Tucanae, both great binocular globs.
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rookie
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 01/14/06
Posts: 850
Loc: St. Petersburg, FL
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I tried over several nights with my Fujinon 16x70's and could not resolve the chain of stars within M4. I need more power or better eyes at my home. I might have better results in darker skies.
Omega Centauri is visible here in south Florida. In my 16x70's it is 3x the size of M13. The telescope is more useful showing its real size and at higher magnifications is as large as the moon. How does that compare in the southern hemisphere?
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SV
Scope: Celestron CPC8
Binoculars: Garrett GT80~45, Fujinon 16x70, Regals 10x42, Ultima 9x63, Nikon AE 8x40
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gmazza
member
Reged: 03/10/09
Posts: 99
Loc: RS, Brazil, 29S 51W
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Quote:
How does that compare in the southern hemisphere?
My last observing night M4 and Omega Centauri where at same distance of horizon (21:30H at 29°S) and placed in fairly equal light polution places (a bortle 4 sky). Unfortunately I don't have the 15X70, even in 15X85 or 10X50 Omega centauri had an apparent diameter 5 to 6 times more than M4 (at my eyes).
I looked by info on them, to check if my observation was correct, it's very curious, the citation there is of about almost the same apparent dimensions for the two (36' M4 and 36,9' OC) I think this difference I observed should be related to apparent magnitude them (7,12 M4 and 3,7 Omega Centauri).
OC was visible naked eye, unaided, it was about half the size of M4 in the 10X50.
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Oberwerk Ultra 10X50
Garrett Signature 15X85
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werewolf6977
Lord High Smasher
Reged: 12/15/03
Posts: 8416
Loc: Hanover, Ohio
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I live @ roughly 40 deg N, and I can get M4 with my 15X70's on all but the worst nights.
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Pete
6" Apogee/LXD55
Starhopper 6" Dob
Spaceprobe 130EQ
Black C8 OTA
WO Zenith Star 66 Patriot Edition
Sun Pak Pro 7500 Platinum Edition
8X42 Bushnell H2O Porro
7X35 Tasco
10X50 Nikon Actions (Type 7)
15X70 Skymasters
Dell Inspiron Dual Core 531s
"Science without Religion is lame, Religion without Science is blind" A.Einstein.
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contrailmaker
sage
Reged: 01/02/09
Posts: 251
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If you liked M4 then you should really try M22. Easy to find and brighter and bigger than M4.
cm
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rookie
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 01/14/06
Posts: 850
Loc: St. Petersburg, FL
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Quote:
My last observing night M4 and Omega Centauri where at same distance of horizon (21:30H at 29°S) and placed in fairly equal light polution places (a bortle 4 sky). Unfortunately I don't have the 15X70, even in 15X85 or 10X50 Omega centauri had an apparent diameter 5 to 6 times more than M4 (at my eyes).
I looked by info on them, to check if my observation was correct, it's very curious, the citation there is of about almost the same apparent dimensions for the two (36' M4 and 36,9' OC) I think this difference I observed should be related to apparent magnitude them (7,12 M4 and 3,7 Omega Centauri).
OC was visible naked eye, unaided, it was about half the size of M4 in the 10X50.
Your southern skies are beautiful. One day, I hope to take a trip to see them. 
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SV
Scope: Celestron CPC8
Binoculars: Garrett GT80~45, Fujinon 16x70, Regals 10x42, Ultima 9x63, Nikon AE 8x40
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Special Ed
Post Laureate
Reged: 05/18/03
Posts: 4232
Loc: Greenbrier Co., WV 38N, 80W
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Quote:
I looked by info on them, to check if my observation was correct, it's very curious, the citation there is of about almost the same apparent dimensions for the two (36' M4 and 36,9' OC) I think this difference I observed should be related to apparent magnitude them (7,12 M4 and 3,7 Omega Centauri).
You have to be careful about the size of these objects posted on the Internet. The best sites will give a photographic apparent diameter and a visual apparent diameter. OC appears much bigger than M4 visually.
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Michael Rosolina
8" f/10 Orange Tube SCT
4.25" f/4.2 Astroscan Reflector
SVP 3.6" f/13.6 CA Reflector
40mm PST f/10
APM Germany HD 15x70 binoculars
Canon 12x36 IS II binoculars
Mark I Eyeball
My CN Gallery
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gmazza
member
Reged: 03/10/09
Posts: 99
Loc: RS, Brazil, 29S 51W
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This one is very close of what I see
http://www.pbase.com/strongmanmike2002/image/55303640
Unfortunately at 15x magnification I do not resolve individual stars. OC and M22 are the two most magnificent, I could see them with 10X50 even from my severe light polluted apartment, much worse than in dark site but possible to spot them.
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Oberwerk Ultra 10X50
Garrett Signature 15X85
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