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Equipment Discussions >> Binoculars

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Mark9473
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Reged: 07/21/05

Loc: 51°N 4°E
First light Nobilem 15x60
      #3286496 - 08/21/09 07:42 PM

The sky cleared and so I was out tonight with my new Docter Nobilem 15x60.

As the first stars started to show in twilight, the Nobilem's first light was on brilliant white Vega, and I liked what I saw, a lot, but I didn't linger there for long as Vega was almost exactly overhead and therefore not in the most comfortable viewing location. Altair was much better placed and that's where I spent the next few minutes.

In these early minutes I had my Orion MiniGiant 15x63 along with me, and comparing the two views quickly showed a superior overall light transmission in the Nobilem. Despite having a slight exit pupil disadvantage (4 mm vs 4.2 mm), the Nobilem showed a noticeably brighter sky background and more vivid sky colour.

First DSO seen was M11. This was still in twilight, with the Sun just over 7° below the horizon. M11 was nothing but a smudge with a star right next to it. But it was visible directly, whereas in the Orion I needed averted viewing and then still only saw it intermittently. I'd say this amounts to a contrast advantage for the Nobilems.

45 minutes later the view on M11 was much nicer, showing its typical glow-with-some-stars appearance. By this time the Sun was already 14° below the horizon and the first glimpses of the Milky Way were becoming visible. The sky was promising to be a bit better than usual at my site, and I gave up comparing with the Orions, deciding to just sit back and enjoy the new toy. For some time I just scanned around the sky, picking up a few targets here and there - M27, M71, Coathanger, etc. Had a nice good-bye view of M17 the Swan Nebula, which will soon be gone from view.

I got a great hand-held view of the beautiful double star Albireo. Hand-holding really is a breeze for me with these 15x60. Something about the ratio of weight / size / form factor / balance makes them just right for hand-holding for short periods of time or for scanning around the sky, which is exactly my viewing style on most nights. For comparison I went back inside to get my 10x50, which for many people is a benchmark of what they can just hold steady enough. I half expected the 15x60 to be as steady as the 10x50, but that was a bit foolish of course. But there really wasn't that much difference.

Bright stars focus tightly without significant flaring or spiking, and fainter ones are just points. Away from the center it degrades a bit quicker than I had hoped, and at the edge bright stars look like seagulls. In normal viewing when the target is centered, the overal impression is of a pleasing, natural, quality view leading right up to the edges without gross defects distracting the attention (unless perhaps when there's a really bright star at the edge), and bordered by a sharp black edge.

Focus is decisive and stays put. No need to fiddle with it once they're focussed. The focus wheel and right eyepiece diopter setting are both sufficiently stiff that they won't get knocked off their intended position.

High haze and clouds are rolling in, so that's all for tonight.


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ronharper
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Reged: 02/14/06

Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #3286902 - 08/22/09 12:24 AM

Sounds like a very positive first night out. I hope you'll eventually wow us with a double star obs. I give you a one time permit to brace the binocular. This is an unusual binocular, and I think a lot of us would like to know more about it. Thanks for sharing first light. And happy 30 2/3th year observing!
Ron


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Man in a Tub
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Reged: 10/28/08

Loc: Fogpatch, CA
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: ronharper]
      #3287056 - 08/22/09 04:17 AM

Quote:

Sounds like a very positive first night out. I hope you'll eventually wow us with a double star obs. I give you a one time permit to brace the binocular. This is an unusual binocular, and I think a lot of us would like to know more about it. Thanks for sharing first light. And happy 30 2/3th year observing!
Ron




Hi Ron, I take you mean some mind-boggling splitting as is your wont, not just easy, ole Albireo?

Yes, this is an unusual binocular. It'll probably keep me from ever putting my Oberwerk 15x60 back into my signature. (I still use it along with the other binoculars in my signature.)

Too bad, the sky flaked out on you, Mark. I'm looking forward to more observing reports with this binocular. Your reports are always a spot-on, great read.

Beneath the leaden fog...Whoops! Scratch that! I just looked out the bathroom window. I think I see some stars! Geez!



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Mark9473
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Reged: 07/21/05

Loc: 51°N 4°E
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: Man in a Tub]
      #3287084 - 08/22/09 05:21 AM

Thanks guys. Ron, I have a list of 15 selected double stars printed out, and for sure I will put the Nobilems on a tripod for that work. But it also requires the sky and my eyes to cooperate

Todd, I think your Oberwerk 15x60 are just as uncommon. Don't be shy about them.


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Man in a Tub
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Reged: 10/28/08

Loc: Fogpatch, CA
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #3287086 - 08/22/09 05:25 AM

OK...

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Mark9473
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Reged: 07/21/05

Loc: 51°N 4°E
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: Man in a Tub]
      #3287103 - 08/22/09 06:03 AM

Here's a few more facts and figures:

IPD range is 53 to 74 mm. There is no IPD scale, but there are three markings corresponding to 60, 66 and 71 mm. For most uses it will probably be sufficient to eye-ball where in between these markings they need to be set.

The closest focussing distance, for my eyes, is just over 7 m. Slightly shorter than the specified 7.4 m.

On the stars last night, I measured the TFOV at 4.1 to 4.15°, making for a 62° AFOV. Nice.

Objective caps are tethered and so far function very well. There's a single very loosely-fitting eyepiece cap that's meant to slide down on the neck strap - nothing unexpected in a binocular targeted at the hunting market. I found that when attaching it to the neck strap at one side only, it works OK for me so I decided to leave it on.

The tripod mount is really something peculiar on these Nobilems. I'll try and post a picture later. It's a two piece adapter, with the first piece screwing onto the binocular housing - it can be left in place permanently (luckily, because it's not so easy to attach). The other part then clips onto that.
In actual use, this works very well - faster than a normal tripod adapter that screws into the central hinge.

With the caps, neck strap and first part of the tripod mount all attached, they weigh 1680 g. They balance very well.

Coatings have a dark green or purple cast depending on the angle. They are so dark it's difficult to see how far the objectives are recessed from the front of the barrels.

I sat outside in bright sunlight, looking at tree branches against a bright sky. Couldn't find any chromatic aberration in the center of the FOV, and only some slight amount in the outer 1/3rd (by radius).


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Mark9473
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Reged: 07/21/05

Loc: 51°N 4°E
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #3288094 - 08/22/09 06:48 PM

Here's a few doubles for you Ron (and anybody else who's interested). To avoid confusion, this was with the Nobilem 15x60 tripod mounted:
STF 2276 AB (6.9") elongated
Gamma ARI (7.4") very elongated
STF 2718 AB (8.5") two stars touching
Gamma DEL (9.1") split about half of the time
STF 2848 (10.8") nice clean split, still very tight


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RichD
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 11/08/07

Loc: Derbyshire, UK
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #3288248 - 08/22/09 08:35 PM

Pics please!

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ronharper
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Reged: 02/14/06

Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: RichD]
      #3288489 - 08/22/09 11:39 PM

Woo hoo Gamma Del! I don't see it split half the time even in 16x70, but at least I can tell it's double. I also elongate Gamma Ari at 16x70, but I have split it sas two perfect beads by stopping my 16x70 down to 32mm, complete perversion I know but it was between me and a consenting binocular.That was about the teenyest thing I've ever seen. I'll have to to dope out the STFs. May I suggest Mizar?

Tub Dude, dig that at splitting doubles, Mark is likely the best on the forum. Also this is a thousand buck Porro!
Ron


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daniel_h
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Reged: 03/08/08

Loc: VIC, Australia
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: ronharper]
      #3288655 - 08/23/09 02:34 AM

yes, where are the pics - & the comparison with the zeiss 15x60 of old
I hope you enjoy them for years to come


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Mark9473
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Reged: 07/21/05

Loc: 51°N 4°E
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: daniel_h]
      #3288746 - 08/23/09 05:47 AM Attachment (237 downloads)

Here are the Nobilems ready to go.

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Mark9473
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Reged: 07/21/05

Loc: 51°N 4°E
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #3288749 - 08/23/09 05:48 AM Attachment (163 downloads)

Close-up of the tripod adapter.

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Mark9473
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Reged: 07/21/05

Loc: 51°N 4°E
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #3288750 - 08/23/09 05:48 AM Attachment (185 downloads)

Objective end.

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Mark9473
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Reged: 07/21/05

Loc: 51°N 4°E
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #3288752 - 08/23/09 05:49 AM Attachment (176 downloads)

Eyepiece end.

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Mark9473
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Reged: 07/21/05

Loc: 51°N 4°E
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #3288754 - 08/23/09 05:50 AM Attachment (150 downloads)

Exit pupil.

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Mark9473
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Reged: 07/21/05

Loc: 51°N 4°E
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #3288755 - 08/23/09 05:50 AM Attachment (162 downloads)

IPD scale and diopter setting.
Notice also the silver dot on the focussing ring and the reference line on the hinge. One can quickly set approximate infinity focus in this way.


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Mark9473
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Reged: 07/21/05

Loc: 51°N 4°E
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #3288757 - 08/23/09 05:54 AM

Daniel, if you send me a Zeiss 15x60 I'll be more than happy to carry out an extensive comparison!
I can already tell you, however, that the Zeiss 15x60 BGAT is renowned for its excellent edge sharpeness, whereas this is one of the weaker points (perhaps the only one) of the Nobilem.


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RichD
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 11/08/07

Loc: Derbyshire, UK
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #3289982 - 08/23/09 08:30 PM



Veeeerrrrrrryyyyy nice.


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Jeroen
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Reged: 08/20/06

Loc: Belgium
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #3291275 - 08/24/09 01:45 PM

Mark,

Congratulations with your new binocular !

Jeroen


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Mark9473
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Reged: 07/21/05

Loc: 51°N 4°E
Re: First light Nobilem 15x60 new [Re: Jeroen]
      #3293860 - 08/25/09 06:47 PM

Thanks Jeroen, I'm really enjoying this new binocular - as I'm sure you're still enjoying your Zeiss 15x60.

Ron, thanks for the tip on trying for Mizar. Boy is this a tough one because of the very bright mag 2 primary (I'm going to try this during twilight one day, that should make it easier). It took the most careful focussing and setting of IPD and precision positioning of my eyes before I managed to split it (just barely), and then only part of the time. My usual viewing method of leaning the tripod towards me on two legs, is just not sufficiently stable for this kind of work. But it was a great view in the end, and Mother Nature came along and celebrated with me by sending a meteor streaking across (and out of) the FOV.

On another note, two things continue to surprise me about the 15x60 Nobilem:

First is the great contrast and light transmission. I was out tonight under a sky that was just a touch above LM 5, with the Milky Way just barely a glimpse. Yet the Nobilem showed me a very promising view of the North America Nebula, and the eastern section of the Veil Nebula just immediately popped into view. Can't wait to get these out under a really dark sky.

The second surprise is what a clean focus I get on Jupiter. It's a clean bright ball of light, and if it wasn't as bright I'd even consider looking for the cloud bands. The moons are quite impressive to see and can be spotted even when they're within a few arcminutes of the planet.


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