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Starobserver
member
Reged: 06/04/09
Posts: 20
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Hi,
I am looking for maps or a staratlas that shows stellar associations, like for example the OB associations. Does anybody know if there are maps, lists, atlasses or anything else around where you can find some information on these large stellar groupings
-------------------- Clear Skies!
Math
Starobserver
http://www.backyard-astro.com/blog
http://www.starobserver.eu
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stevecoe
"Astronomical Tourist"
   
Reged: 04/24/04
Posts: 2645
Loc: Arizona, USA
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I know that I included several associations and moving groups within the SAC database. It can be downloaded at the address below, go to "Things to Observe". Just search for the word "association" or "moving group", something like that. I think that several of them have Collinder designations. They are fun in binoculars.
www.saguaroastro.org
Hope that helps; Steve Coe
-------------------- TeleVue 102 refractor on CGEM mount
10 inch f/4.7 Newtonian
Author "Deep Sky Observing" Springer-Verlag
Author "Nebulae and How to Observe Them" Springer
Canon Xt astrocamera with Hutech modification
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18UCinVA
super member
   
Reged: 10/24/08
Posts: 150
Loc: Virginia
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Sky Catalog 2000 Vol 2 has a good list of associations.
Skytools 2 will sometimes note that an individual star is a member of an association, but not list all the stars of one.
Np maps or atlas that I know of. Associations are not "marketed" to amateurs.
-------------------- Ray
18 UC
Celestron 32, 24, and 20mm Erfle's
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Crossen
member
Reged: 07/14/08
Posts: 87
Loc: Vienna
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You're really onto something here, because OB associations have been the most undersung of all the different types of deep-sky objects. And yet several (Orion, Sco-Cen, Lacerta OB1, Cepheus OB2, Perseus OB1) are unaided eye objects and about 3 dozen are good binocular targets. I had intended on filling this gap in the literature of amateur astronomy by zeroing in on associations in a 2nd edition of my "Binocular Astronomy", but that project has been delayed by the appearance of a bogus, unauthorized, and out-of-date 2nd edition of the book (as has been discussed in CN's "Binoculars" forum).
However, at the risk of sounding like I'm blowing my own horn, I can tell you that there is a great deal of information about stellar associations in my other book "Sky Vistas." In fact some 40 associations are discussed in detail in that book, and there is a chart showing their distribution among the spiral arms in the Sun's neighborhood of the Galaxy. About the only thing these discussions don't have that would have been in the descriptions of (in fact fewer) associations in an authorized 2nd edition of "Binoc Astro" are detailed lists of member stars.
"Sky Vistas" is kind of pricey if all you want is information on associations; but it is in a lot of college and university libraries, so perhaps you can get it through a interlibrary loan program.
Also, in the 1995 issue of "Astronomy" magazine I published an article on associations titled "Big Sky Deep Sky". It is an introduction to the astronomy of stellar associations discussing such matters as the types of stars and other objects in them, the life-history of associations, and their distribution in the Galaxy. Unfortunately the magazine cut the original second half of that aticle, which described individual associations and was intended for the observer. However, much of that practical observing information is now in "Sky Vistas."
Craig Crossen
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stevecoe
"Astronomical Tourist"
   
Reged: 04/24/04
Posts: 2645
Loc: Arizona, USA
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Craig;
Is there any chance you would be willing to re-assemble the article and post it in the "articles"s section here?
Thanks; Steve Coe
-------------------- TeleVue 102 refractor on CGEM mount
10 inch f/4.7 Newtonian
Author "Deep Sky Observing" Springer-Verlag
Author "Nebulae and How to Observe Them" Springer
Canon Xt astrocamera with Hutech modification
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peter k
super member
Reged: 02/03/07
Posts: 172
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The third edition of Dickinson and Dyer's Backyard Astronomer's Guide contains a great Milky Way atlas that shows around 50 OB associations. The atlas, produced by CN member Glenn LeDrew, covers the entire Milky Way (plus about 25 degrees on either side) in ten beautiful charts. Scale is about 7 degrees per inch, but the level of detail is quite fine. For each chart, a full page photorealistic view is accompanied by a gray on white negative view on the opposite page. In addition to OBs, many bright and dark nebulae and other DSOs are shown. It is really a beautiful and useful piece of work, and I'm surprised it hasn't been mentioned more frequently on CN.
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Crossen
member
Reged: 07/14/08
Posts: 87
Loc: Vienna
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Quote:
Craig;
Is there any chance you would be willing to re-assemble the article and post it in the "articles"s section here?
Thanks; Steve Coe
Yes. I don't have a copy of the original 1995 article with me, but it doesn't matter because I've already reworked and updated that material and so all I have to do type it out, with some adjustments. It's unlike the 1995 article in that I combine the discussion of the astrophysics of associations (and star streams) with descriptions of the nearest of them intended for the observer. As you know, my main effort as an astronomy writer is to relate the science of astronomy to what we see with the unaided eye and in the eyepiece.
Craig Crossen
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peter k
super member
Reged: 02/03/07
Posts: 172
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I recently purchased Sky Vistas, based largely on praise for the book over in the binoculars forum. I find it well worth the rather high price (I paid $80). The text provides much info on the large-scale structure of our galaxy and richest-field observing that is difficult to find elsewhere, and the illustrations are great. The book contains little by way of finder charts however. I find the Milky Way atlas I mentioned above to be an excellent complement to Sky Vistas.
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stevecoe
"Astronomical Tourist"
   
Reged: 04/24/04
Posts: 2645
Loc: Arizona, USA
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Craig;
Thank you in advance for providing this information. As you said, the Associations are not mentioned often and there are some that are fascinating in a wide field pair of binoculars or RFT scope.
Peter, I will look for a copy of the latest Backyard Astronomy, it sounds like a useful book. I have often recommended both Nightwatch and it.
Clear skies; Steve Coe
-------------------- TeleVue 102 refractor on CGEM mount
10 inch f/4.7 Newtonian
Author "Deep Sky Observing" Springer-Verlag
Author "Nebulae and How to Observe Them" Springer
Canon Xt astrocamera with Hutech modification
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Starobserver
member
Reged: 06/04/09
Posts: 20
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Hi All,
Thanks for all the info. I allready ordered both "Sky Vistas" and "Backyard astronomy". I will also be looking forward to Craig's article! Thanks again for all the help. I really would like to go out and observe the OB associations. I will keep you updated once I got the first results (and sketches!).
-------------------- Clear Skies!
Math
Starobserver
http://www.backyard-astro.com/blog
http://www.starobserver.eu
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auriga
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 03/02/06
Posts: 795
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Quote:
You're really onto something here, because OB associations have been the most undersung of all the different types of deep-sky objects. And yet several (Orion, Sco-Cen, Lacerta OB1, Cepheus OB2, Perseus OB1) are unaided eye objects and about 3 dozen are good binocular targets. I had intended on filling this gap in the literature of amateur astronomy by zeroing in on associations in a 2nd edition of my "Binocular Astronomy", but that project has been delayed by the appearance of a bogus, unauthorized, and out-of-date 2nd edition of the book (as has been discussed in CN's "Binoculars" forum).
However, at the risk of sounding like I'm blowing my own horn, I can tell you that there is a great deal of information about stellar associations in my other book "Sky Vistas." In fact some 40 associations are discussed in detail in that book, and there is a chart showing their distribution among the spiral arms in the Sun's neighborhood of the Galaxy. About the only thing these discussions don't have that would have been in the descriptions of (in fact fewer) associations in an authorized 2nd edition of "Binoc Astro" are detailed lists of member stars.
"Sky Vistas" is kind of pricey if all you want is information on associations; but it is in a lot of college and university libraries, so perhaps you can get it through a interlibrary loan program.
Also, in the 1995 issue of "Astronomy" magazine I published an article on associations titled "Big Sky Deep Sky". It is an introduction to the astronomy of stellar associations discussing such matters as the types of stars and other objects in them, the life-history of associations, and their distribution in the Galaxy. Unfortunately the magazine cut the original second half of that aticle, which described individual associations and was intended for the observer. However, much of that practical observing information is now in "Sky Vistas."
Craig Crossen
Hi, Craig, "Sky Vistas" is a treasure trove of information. I am delighted with my copy. Stellar associations are but one feature. The material on the structure of the Milky Way and the visual appearance and astronomical meaning of hundreds and hundreds of objects within it is of great value to the observer. Why not understand what you are looking at and how it relates to the rest of our galaxy? Great photos by co-author Gerald Rhemann as well. A unique book.
Austin Texas amateur Bill Tschumy's "Where is M13," is an almost free downloadable software program that depicts the position of many objects in relation to out galaxy, in three dimensions. It makes a great companion to "Sky Vistas."
As you suggest, stellar associations have great merit as viewing objects for binoculars and richest-field telescopes. They tend to be big and bright beautiful and easily found and astrophysically interesting. Perhaps they have been neglected by many because they are too easy to find?
Best regards, Bill Meyers
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GlennLeDrew
Pooh-Bah
   
Reged: 06/18/08
Posts: 1282
Loc: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
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The neglect of OB associations as a class of object for amateur observation is probably more historical. For one thing, the realization of their existence is very recent in comparison with the history of the telescope. And the generally quite large angular size of associations, in addition to their generally more dispersed nature, doesn't lend them to the awfully small fields of view most often suffered in days of yore.
Today's wide angle eyepieces, RFTs and binoculars are a revolution when you consider the equipment our forebears had to work with.
-------------------- Home-made 11X50 right angle bino, 8.1 deg. FOV
Modified 26X100 bino, 3.5 deg. FOV
Home-made Mk II RA bino, using interchangeable objectives and eyepieces
My Gallery
Mediocre minds discuss people. Good minds discuss events. Great minds discuss ideas.
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Crossen
member
Reged: 07/14/08
Posts: 87
Loc: Vienna
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Yes, wide-field observing was almost unheard-of in those days. The attitude of the guidebooks was that if you weren't looking through a telescope--even if a little 60mm Tasco--you weren't doing REAL astronomy. Binoculars were marginalized with constellation-identification as something for beginners.
Before World War II binocular optics were good but binocular prices high because of the prism. After the War excellent Army surplus binoculars (as well as jeeps and transport trucks!) could be bought for a song. The first pair of binoculars I ever looked through were a pair of Army surplus 7x50s from my high school science department: they delivered a great view of the Praesepe cluster. But even though the cost of binoculars was now within range of most high-school kids like myself, the guidebook writers stayed stuck on the basic 3-inch refractor and 6-inch Newtonian reflector right through the 1970s. I think that the guidebook writers of that era simply did not know what binoculars can do. Most of them were professional astronomers who didn't have the time, among their teaching and research responsibilities, to experiment with binoculars. Since associations are something you use binoculars to explore, I guess the guidebook writers of that time never thought of them as something to write about.
Craig Crossen
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David Knisely
Postmaster
   
Reged: 04/19/04
Posts: 8280
Loc: Beatrice, Nebraska
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Quote:
The neglect of OB associations as a class of object for amateur observation is probably more historical. For one thing, the realization of their existence is very recent in comparison with the history of the telescope. And the generally quite large angular size of associations, in addition to their generally more dispersed nature, doesn't lend them to the awfully small fields of view most often suffered in days of yore.
Today's wide angle eyepieces, RFTs and binoculars are a revolution when you consider the equipment our forebears had to work with.
Then again, for those who want to go really "deep", there is the huge association (or more accurately, "star cloud") of NGC 206 in the Andromeda Galaxy. I have seen this one in my 100mm f/6 refractor, although it doesn't seem to get really easy to see until you get into the 8 to 10 inch aperture range. Clear skies to you.
-------------------- David W. Knisely
Hyde Memorial Observatory
http://www.hydeobservatory.info
Prairie Astronomy Club
http://www.prairieastronomyclub.org
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Crossen
member
Reged: 07/14/08
Posts: 87
Loc: Vienna
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Quote:
Then again, for those who want to go really "deep", there is the huge association (or more accurately, "star cloud") of NGC 206 in the Andromeda Galaxy. I have seen this one in my 100mm f/6 refractor, although it doesn't seem to get really easy to see until you get into the 8 to 10 inch aperture range. Clear skies to you.
Yes. Despite observing under extremely dark rural central Minnesota skies, I've failed to spot NGC 206 in 15x100 and 25x100 supergiant binoculars. The interior dust lane was, however, visible in both instruments.
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btschumy
Think Astronomy
   
Reged: 04/13/04
Posts: 1139
Loc: Austin, TX, USA
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Quote:
Austin Texas amateur Bill Tschumy's "Where is M13," is an almost free downloadable software program that depicts the position of many objects in relation to out galaxy, in three dimensions. It makes a great companion to "Sky Vistas."
To come full circle, it was Craig's "Binocular Astronomy" that originally got me interested in the 3-D structure of the Galaxy and where things are located.
-------------------- Bill Tschumy
Where is M13? Freeware -- Add a new dimension to your observing.
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