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nunciusaustralis
super member
Reged: 09/25/09
Posts: 100
Loc: Rio de janeiro, Brazil
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Rubey coated binos are suposed to be a shame.
But by my own experience some works pretty fine.
I actually have a 20 to 75x80mm that despite being ruby coated and a zoom bino do a nice job. speacilly if u dont barbarize on zooming.
I have been able to spot many deep skies . If not amazing is pretty fair that it made it ut m80 , m71 m69 and some other fuzzies that are not all that easy.
The Bino is done by a english company and was buy for something as 50 dollars.
I think that on many articles i read a bino with such caracteristics will be banned. But the most important is to enphasises that any kind of optical aid will improve what u see. And the most importnt is the stargazing.
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Nuncius Australis
70mm celestron EQ
9x50 finderscope
15X80mm binocular
20mm e 10mm k eye pieces
2xomni barlow
www.nunciusaustralis.blogspot.com
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Simon S
sage
Reged: 01/07/07
Posts: 391
Loc: Crawley West Sussex UK
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What about the green colour cast?
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My binocular collection recent first
http://www.flickr.com/photos/binoculars/
My binoculars in Alphabetical order http://www.flickr.com/photos/binoculars/sets/72157613812824211/detail/
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KennyJ
Reged: 04/27/03
Posts: 12909
Loc: Lancashire UK
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Welcome , Nuncius !
I'm pleased you find more joy from both zoom and ruby coated binoculars than I had with the ones I tried .
The terribly narrow field of view , dull images and misalignments were the three main reasons I didn't take to the 20 - 120 x 70s. , and the ruby coatings flaked off the reverse Porro compacts I had after leaving in a hot car !
I'm more intrigued by this " English company " you imply made the one you have .
What name is on it ?
Clear Skies ,
Kenny
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If everyone is thinking the same thing , no-one is thinking - General George S.Patton
Zeiss 7 x 42 BGAT
Captain's Helmsman 7 x 50
Nikon 10 x 42 Superior E
Swift Audubon Kestrel 10 x 50
Helios 15 x 70 Observation
Strathspey 20 x 90
Televue 76 APO
Zeiss 85 Diascope
Helios 102 f5 refractor
Various eyepieces barlows tripods mounts etc.
Panasonic Lumix DMC - TZ5 digital camera
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Simon S
sage
Reged: 01/07/07
Posts: 391
Loc: Crawley West Sussex UK
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Sorry to be so negitive to your first post but zoom binoculars are inferior in almost every way to fixed binoculars. As Kenny says but in more suttle ways, you get what you pay for.
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My binocular collection recent first
http://www.flickr.com/photos/binoculars/
My binoculars in Alphabetical order http://www.flickr.com/photos/binoculars/sets/72157613812824211/detail/
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werewolf6977
Lord High Smasher
Reged: 12/15/03
Posts: 8431
Loc: Hanover, Ohio
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Wait til Bill C chimes in.
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Pete
6" Apogee/LXD55
Starhopper 6" Dob
Spaceprobe 130EQ
Black C8 OTA
WO Zenith Star 66 Patriot Edition
Sun Pak Pro 7500 Platinum Edition
8X42 Bushnell H2O Porro
7X35 Tasco
10X50 Nikon Actions (Type 7)
15X70 Skymasters
Dell Inspiron Dual Core 531s
"Science without Religion is lame, Religion without Science is blind" A.Einstein.
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ronharper
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 02/14/06
Posts: 1276
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Nuncius,
I hear you. Most of the time the game we play is a "race between binoculars". We make a big deal of small differences. It is fun to criticize things. We strive to own the best. But your post reminds me of the basic miracles of aided vision, and of the larger universe.
You obviously realize that what you are saying will seem unusual here. Ruby coated zooms are the binoculars we "love to hate". But, if a ruby coated zoom is only collimated and in good working order, well, you are going to see a LOT with 20x80! I doubt I would notice the green cast on dim sky objects. I own a Fujinon 16x70 that cost over ten times what your binocular cost, but I bet you are seeing at least as much as me, because your binocular is bigger. The best thing of all is, you know the sky, and you are right, those objects are not easy. I am glad you are enjoying your large binocular. I would love to see the southern sky some day before I die.
Welcome to the forum,
Ron
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KennyJ
Reged: 04/27/03
Posts: 12909
Loc: Lancashire UK
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Ron ,
That was most generously put !
Given the proven reduced aperture of so many fixed magnification binoculars , I would be surprised if this zoom model really has 80mm of aperture .
Kenny
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If everyone is thinking the same thing , no-one is thinking - General George S.Patton
Zeiss 7 x 42 BGAT
Captain's Helmsman 7 x 50
Nikon 10 x 42 Superior E
Swift Audubon Kestrel 10 x 50
Helios 15 x 70 Observation
Strathspey 20 x 90
Televue 76 APO
Zeiss 85 Diascope
Helios 102 f5 refractor
Various eyepieces barlows tripods mounts etc.
Panasonic Lumix DMC - TZ5 digital camera
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Jay_Bird
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 01/04/06
Posts: 959
Loc: Nevada 36N 115W
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Welcome Nuncius, is your CN name a nod to Galileo?
There is a great deal to be said for doing as much as you can with what you have at hand (some of which was said by Gen. Patton), rather than not doing anything and waiting for something better. Thanks for your report.
If I have 'only' Papilios or birding binos on a camping trip I still enjoy turning them skyward. The first edition of "Binocular Astronomy" by Crossen and Tirion made a point of saying that 1/2 the objects in the book could be seen with 7x35 and all with a Sears 10x50. I also appreciate how another author, Peter Lancaster Brown often gave descriptions of how objects appeared when viewed in 3x or 4x "opera glasses" and small 6x to 8x handheld binos as well as of the views he saw in his giant mounted binos and telescopes.
I hope we hear more from you, about putting less-than-perfect zooms to good use, and other observations.
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'these things stand like stone - kindness in another's troubles, courage in your own' Gordon
C-8, Nighthawk, C-90; Binoculars 6-11x21-80mm; Paragon p-mount
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ronharper
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 02/14/06
Posts: 1276
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Kenny,
Right, but I have not seen a measurement of a cheap "20x80" that came out quite as small as 70mm, nor quite as low powered as 16x. It doesn't take much aperture difference to overwhelm a few percent transmission advantage.
Still, you are right, I am probably magnanimous to a fault.
Newbies, hut, two, three, four!
Ron
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BillC
on a new path
Reged: 06/04/04
Posts: 2238
Loc: Washington, USA
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Hi, Pete. He said "POST ONE." Thus, I will try to be a man and not chime in. . . . Besides I'm at work. So, I will hold my tongue until the bleeding stops and just welcome our newcomer onboard.
Cheers,
Bill
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Man in a Tub
Not Retired!, But a little cranky!!!
Reged: 10/28/08
Posts: 2059
Loc: San Francisco, CA
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As the saying goes: "Whatever floats your boat."
However, the exact meaning of "don't barbarize on zooming" is not clear to me. I can certainly guess and guess again...
As a monolingual American, I admire learning languages, but that admiration should not interfere with requests for clarity.
I like your user name, Nunciusaustralis! A lot more charming than #89104. I don't know Latin either! Welcome!
Clear skies!
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Todd
Brunton Eterna 15x51 ° Garrett Optical Signature Series 15x70
Nikon Action EX 12x50 ° Oberwerk 15x60 and 20x80 Standard
Orion Paragon Plus Mount and Paragon XHD Tripod
Garrett Optical Series 2000 Grip-Action Monopod
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Ford Prefect
super member
Reged: 09/25/05
Posts: 196
Loc: Italy
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Hello Nuncius.
You are right when you say that "any kind of optical aid will improve what you see".
My experience with ruby-coated binocs:
one night I had the possibility to compare a friend of mine's 12x60 binoculars (brand Breaker Optics) with my Meade 10x50. Both were cheap binoculars.
The ruby binos, despite the increased mag and aperture, showed a bit less than the standard 10x50.
The nebulas where darker, and there were a bit less faint stars on open clusters, and a green tint around brighter stars.
The only aspect were it was superior was a somewhat darker background sky than the Meade.
This is my experience, I cannot talk about zoom binocs for astro use (never tried)
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Claudio from Rome
Celestron C5 on Giro-Mini Mount
StellarVue F50,10x50 and 15x80 binoculars
Coronado PST
"Los que van con prisa, nunca ven el cielo"
"Considerate la vostra semenza:
fatti non foste a viver come bruti,
ma per seguir virtute e canoscenza"
Dante, Inf. XXVI, 118-120
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jkevn
sage
Reged: 03/02/06
Posts: 211
Loc: Tucson, Arizona
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A long time ago my wife bought me a pair of Meade ruby coated 10x50 binoculars. Despite the annoying blue-green tint of the moon, they were OK for cheap binoculars, but I didn't notice that the ruby coating improved the view in any way that I noticed. I tried to find some advantage to the coatings...maybe there were less stray reflections with the cheaper single later MgFl coatings on all the optical surfaces because longer red wavelengths were reflected. But I really couldn't find any practical advantage. If anything, there was maybe a slight reduction in my ability to see faint deep sky objects.
What I think, is that from a marketing perspective, these coatings were pushed because people associate the red color with infrared night vision, thinking that you could somehow see more in dim light or at night with red coatings. Also, typical advertising talks about the red coatings eliminating "glare". A lot of people may naturally associate bright hot sources like the sun as containing a lot of red light, and maybe the thinking is, if this deep red color is rejected, "glare" will be reduced somehow. But this isn't the case at all; all visible wavelengths are involved in "glare" (and I'm not even sure what the advertising even means by "glare"--stray reflections and scattering, and difficulty looking at bright reflections and light sources, I guess).
Just some thoughts. There has to be some economic marketing reason, because the ruby coatings were promoted for a very long time, and still are, to some extent.
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Sarkikos
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 12/18/07
Posts: 1071
Loc: Suburban Maryland
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Messenger of the South,
Welcome to Cloudy Nights! I have a pair of ruby-coated binoculars: Barska X-Trail Wide Angle 20x50. They were on sale, and I've had other Barska binos that I liked, so I took a chance and bought them. They arrived well collimated, had a nice feel to them, the optics were clear and consistent, everything looked good and functioned well. I like the bino, but not for astronomy, because the ruby coatings do dim the image. Also, I don't like unnatural color on celestial objects ... unless the color is from filters that I can use or not use as I choose. I even tried the ruby bino on the Moon, the brightest sky object, but I don't think any binos are the best instrument for lunar observation in any case, so I won't use the ruby bino for the Moon in future. But they are great for daytime use. I've taken them hiking a lot. The combination of 20x and the ruby coatings cut down on daytime glare quite a bit. Personally, I think they make daytime objects look sharper, with better contrast and easier on the eyes. And I was surprised that the bino was so easy to keep steady for hand-held use despite having a fairly high magnification of 20x. So I think I would give a nod to good quality ruby coated binos, but just not for astronomy.
Clear Skies,
Mike
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Celestron 10" f5 Newt on 1stBase (DSO)
Zhumell 8" f6 Newt, Bosma 6" f12 MCT (NSO)
6" f5 Newt, 130ST, 4.5" f4.4 Ball w/GLP, ST80 w/Crayford (RFTs)
C4-R (NSO/DS)
90mm f13 MCT (Luna/DS)
SkyMaster 25x100, 15x70
Zhumell 20x80
Barska XWA 10x50, 8x40
OptiView LPR 10x50
Const View 2.3x40
BV-125C
CG5, 2 drv / CG4, 2 drv, wood legs, ScopeStuff saddle / CG3, 1 drv
SV AZ / 501HDV on Bogen 055XB / P+ on Oberwerk
QuikFinder, Telrad
Orion Dynamo Pro 12, Dew-Not
Have GLP and not afraid to use it!
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DJB
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 02/23/05
Posts: 1590
Loc: Lisle NY
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Hi guys,
Stay away from ruby. What is so wrong with the standard MC or FMC bincoluars? Even the older, simply coated ones are better in my opinion.
True, the price is right, but these things do not merit any new technological benefits, the best that I can determine.
I've never owned one, nor do I intend to. Just my opinions--but do as you see fit guys.
Best regards,
Dave.
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KennyJ
Reged: 04/27/03
Posts: 12909
Loc: Lancashire UK
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< And I was surprised that the bino was so easy to keep steady for hand-held use despite having a fairly high magnification of 20x. >
Mike ,
That was an interesting point .
Hardly any of the many Ruby coated models I've looked at and through ( there is always at least one vendor trying to sell these for the price of two burgers and two cokes at every sunday market and car boot sale ) have had anyhting like the magnification or true effective aperture that is displayed on them .
A typical stated 20 x 50 could thus be a 10 x 25 in reality , which is quite clever in a way as at least the exit - pupil remains the same size as it would be if it really were a 20 x 50 !
Another thing I've noticed that hasn't been mentioned so far is a phenomena relating ruby coated binoculars to elbow extension .
I think one of the the main purchasers of Ruby Coated binoculars must be TV series , commercials and film prop. buyers.
Apart from on serious nature study documentaries , televised cricket matches or horse racing , every time I see binoculars featured on television they seem to be ruby coated ones , being held by people with their elbows sticking out to their full extent .
Kenny
--------------------
If everyone is thinking the same thing , no-one is thinking - General George S.Patton
Zeiss 7 x 42 BGAT
Captain's Helmsman 7 x 50
Nikon 10 x 42 Superior E
Swift Audubon Kestrel 10 x 50
Helios 15 x 70 Observation
Strathspey 20 x 90
Televue 76 APO
Zeiss 85 Diascope
Helios 102 f5 refractor
Various eyepieces barlows tripods mounts etc.
Panasonic Lumix DMC - TZ5 digital camera
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Sarkikos
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 12/18/07
Posts: 1071
Loc: Suburban Maryland
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Post deleted by Sarkikos
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Celestron 10" f5 Newt on 1stBase (DSO)
Zhumell 8" f6 Newt, Bosma 6" f12 MCT (NSO)
6" f5 Newt, 130ST, 4.5" f4.4 Ball w/GLP, ST80 w/Crayford (RFTs)
C4-R (NSO/DS)
90mm f13 MCT (Luna/DS)
SkyMaster 25x100, 15x70
Zhumell 20x80
Barska XWA 10x50, 8x40
OptiView LPR 10x50
Const View 2.3x40
BV-125C
CG5, 2 drv / CG4, 2 drv, wood legs, ScopeStuff saddle / CG3, 1 drv
SV AZ / 501HDV on Bogen 055XB / P+ on Oberwerk
QuikFinder, Telrad
Orion Dynamo Pro 12, Dew-Not
Have GLP and not afraid to use it!
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Sarkikos
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 12/18/07
Posts: 1071
Loc: Suburban Maryland
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Kenny,
(I'm resubmitting this post because my first posting might not have made it clear who was saying what. Sorry.)
Quote:
Quote:
< And I was surprised that the bino was so easy to keep steady for hand-held use despite having a fairly high magnification of 20x. >
That was an interesting point .
Hardly any of the many Ruby coated models I've looked at and through ( there is always at least one vendor trying to sell these for the price of two burgers and two cokes at every sunday market and car boot sale ) have had anyhting like the magnification or true effective aperture that is displayed on them .
A typical stated 20 x 50 could thus be a 10 x 25 in reality , which is quite clever in a way as at least the exit - pupil remains the same size as it would be if it really were a 20 x 50 !
If that was supposed to imply that the magnification on MY bino was actually less than 20x or the aperture was less than 50mm, I can assure you that both specs were correct. I do have some experience with binos. (Look at the list in my signature. I had to leave several binos out due to space restrictions.)
Quote:
Another thing I've noticed that hasn't been mentioned so far is a phenomena relating ruby coated binoculars to elbow extension .
I think one of the the main purchasers of Ruby Coated binoculars must be TV series , commercials and film prop. buyers.
Apart from on serious nature study documentaries , televised cricket matches or horse racing , every time I see binoculars featured on television they seem to be ruby coated ones , being held by people with their elbows sticking out to their full extent .
I have no idea what that is about. Maybe the actors are supposed to be admiring the ruby coatings? At any rate, I would be very reluctant to buy any bino advertised on TV or the shopping channels. All I can say is that my Barska ruby bino is good for daytime use. It's no Swarovski or Fuginon or other-uber-expensive-value-added-bino, of course, but there is no way I would ever own one of those unless I inherited it from a rich relative, and I don't see that happening.
The bottom-line is I wouldn't use any ruby-coated bino for astronomy, but some are decent enough for hiking and other daytime uses.
Clear Skies,
Mike
--------------------
Celestron 10" f5 Newt on 1stBase (DSO)
Zhumell 8" f6 Newt, Bosma 6" f12 MCT (NSO)
6" f5 Newt, 130ST, 4.5" f4.4 Ball w/GLP, ST80 w/Crayford (RFTs)
C4-R (NSO/DS)
90mm f13 MCT (Luna/DS)
SkyMaster 25x100, 15x70
Zhumell 20x80
Barska XWA 10x50, 8x40
OptiView LPR 10x50
Const View 2.3x40
BV-125C
CG5, 2 drv / CG4, 2 drv, wood legs, ScopeStuff saddle / CG3, 1 drv
SV AZ / 501HDV on Bogen 055XB / P+ on Oberwerk
QuikFinder, Telrad
Orion Dynamo Pro 12, Dew-Not
Have GLP and not afraid to use it!
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KennyJ
Reged: 04/27/03
Posts: 12909
Loc: Lancashire UK
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Mike ,
The first extract of my statement that you highlighted and questioned was self explanatory .
I was not IMPLYING anything , other than what I said -- which is that MOST of the ruby coated binoculars I've seen have not had the TRUE advertised specs. -- which indeed why I found your comment so interesting , and why I said that I found it interesting .
Regarding the quote that you have no idea about , I was not talking about actors ADVERTISING BINOCULARS on TV commercials , but actors who are filmed using them in TV commercials for OTHER PRODUCTS , and in all kinds of TV dramas and soap operas , always seeming to be shown looking through models with RUBY coatings .
There is a good reason for this -- it's because they Ruby coated binoculars are relatively cheap to purchase , so it saves money over buying PROPER binoculars , with the added bonus of no - one being unduly worried if they get damaged , lost or stolen .
Almost everyone who is serious enough about using binoculars to become contributors to forums such as this , already know that keeping the arms close to the body helps to stabilise the views when hand - holding them .
When someone not used to looking through binoculars at all is suddenly asked to do so , it's very easy to tell by various things they tend to do , or don't do , and they not knowing about this basic trick / technique is one of the more obvious ones to spot .
My observations over several years have led me to notice that the vast majority of people who DO try and BUY Ruby coated binoculars , tend to be of that ilk .
That is what my comment was about -- an attempt at a light -hearted twist on that observation .
It's a branch of attempted comedy writing really , although admittedly probably too " satirically British " for many readers of this forum to understand or appreciate for what it was meant to be .
I hope this helps clear up any misunderstanding ! :-)
Kenny
--------------------
If everyone is thinking the same thing , no-one is thinking - General George S.Patton
Zeiss 7 x 42 BGAT
Captain's Helmsman 7 x 50
Nikon 10 x 42 Superior E
Swift Audubon Kestrel 10 x 50
Helios 15 x 70 Observation
Strathspey 20 x 90
Televue 76 APO
Zeiss 85 Diascope
Helios 102 f5 refractor
Various eyepieces barlows tripods mounts etc.
Panasonic Lumix DMC - TZ5 digital camera
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Sarkikos
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 12/18/07
Posts: 1071
Loc: Suburban Maryland
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Kenny,
In an attempt to end a potential sniping contest before it really gets started here, I'll just repeat the jist of my position:
I wouldn't use any ruby-coated bino for astronomy, but some are decent enough for hiking and other daytime uses.
'Nuff said,
Mike
--------------------
Celestron 10" f5 Newt on 1stBase (DSO)
Zhumell 8" f6 Newt, Bosma 6" f12 MCT (NSO)
6" f5 Newt, 130ST, 4.5" f4.4 Ball w/GLP, ST80 w/Crayford (RFTs)
C4-R (NSO/DS)
90mm f13 MCT (Luna/DS)
SkyMaster 25x100, 15x70
Zhumell 20x80
Barska XWA 10x50, 8x40
OptiView LPR 10x50
Const View 2.3x40
BV-125C
CG5, 2 drv / CG4, 2 drv, wood legs, ScopeStuff saddle / CG3, 1 drv
SV AZ / 501HDV on Bogen 055XB / P+ on Oberwerk
QuikFinder, Telrad
Orion Dynamo Pro 12, Dew-Not
Have GLP and not afraid to use it!
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