WOBentley
member
Reged: 09/16/09
Posts: 53
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My current ep collection has a complete Ethos series (with a 21 preordered but not purchased) and a 41 Panoptic. Scopes are a Meade 8" LX90LNT and an Obsession 20" f5. It seems to me that I should be looking for an ep around 26mm or so to fill the hole. I have heard that the Ethos design will not be possible for much larger than a 21mm (anyone else heard this?) and I want a 2" EP if possible....What would you recommend I look at, considering that I really like the wide field of view (as if that wasn't obvious enough already  ) I am thinking 26 Nagler but would like to hear other suggestions...
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sixela
Postmaster
Reged: 12/23/04
Posts: 10848
Loc: Boechout, Belgium
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Quote:
My current ep collection has a complete Ethos series (with a 21 preordered but not purchased) and a 41 Panoptic. Scopes are a Meade 8" LX90LNT and an Obsession 20" f5. It seems to me that I should be looking for an ep around 26mm or so to fill the hole.
Honest opinion: no. There is no hole in FOV at all between the future 21mm Ethos and the 41mm Pan.
All you could get is a different magnification, but anything that will show up in that field the 21mm Ethos will show better, certainly in the Obsession (even with filters, on the Obsession).
The only exception I'd know would be observing large faint objects with OIII filters on the f/10 SCT. But I assume that it wouldn't see that much use on the kinds of objects involved compared to the Obsession, so buying an eyepiece just for that seems awkward.
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400mm f/4.46 self made Dobsonian on Tom Osypowski equatorial platform
Orion Starblast (114mm f/4 reflector, Alt/Az)
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Scott Beith
SRF
Reged: 11/26/03
Posts: 37118
Loc: Frederick, MD
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Yep the 21E should have a FOV covering the FOV of a 26mm EP with a darker background.
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   SLAP Observer (TMB130SS, SV102V, SV80ED)
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -- Edmund Burke.
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell
"The measure of a man’s greatness is not determined by what he accomplishes for himself, but by what he accomplishes for others.” -- Some Bald Guy
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astro744
member
Reged: 09/22/07
Posts: 70
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21mm Ethos has a 36.2mm field stop.
26mm Nagler has a 35mm field stop.
The 21E will show a little more sky at a slightly higher power than the 26N; 96x vs. 78x on 8" and 120x vs. 97x on 20"
The 41mm Panoptic has a 46mm field stop and the 35mm Panoptic has a 38.7mm field stop diameter. If you want to fill a 'hole' in your lineup may I suggest the 31mm Nagler which has a 42mm field stop. The 31mm Nagler will give you an extra 0.16 degrees in your 8" and 0.13 degrees in your 20" over the 21E. Probably not worth it since you have the 41P unless you want 82 degrees over 68 degrees AFOV.
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sixela
Postmaster
Reged: 12/23/04
Posts: 10848
Loc: Boechout, Belgium
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What I'd suggest is swapping the Pan 41 for a 31T5 (or something similar). I doubt he'll need more than a 3mm exit pupil for anything, and the field it covers is almost as large as that of the 41mm Pan.
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400mm f/4.46 self made Dobsonian on Tom Osypowski equatorial platform
Orion Starblast (114mm f/4 reflector, Alt/Az)
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gaz-in
sage
Reged: 12/17/07
Posts: 441
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I second the reccomendation to swap the 41 Panoptic for a 31 T5. I swapped a 35 Pan for a 31 T5 and am awestruck buy the views! Just an amazong eyepiece.
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jrbarnett
Eyepiece Hooligan
Reged: 02/28/06
Posts: 4340
Loc: Petaluma, CA
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The 26mm Nagler Type 5 or 27mm Panoptic come to mind. I have the 27mm Panoptic and like it in every scope I've used it in, including fast Dobs, slow MCTs and refractors in between. I have the 20mm Nagler Type 5 and have used the 31mm Nagler Tyoe 5, and really like them, so would bet that the 26mm is likewise excellent.
Regards,
Jim
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"I do not know what I may appear to the world; but to myself I seem to have been only like a boy playing on the seashore, and diverting myself in now and then finding a smoother pebble or a prettier shell than ordinary, whilst the great ocean of truth lay all undiscovered before me."
- Sir Issac Newton
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FirstSight
Post Laureate
Reged: 12/26/05
Posts: 3873
Loc: Raleigh, NC
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Quote:
I second the reccomendation to swap the 41 Panoptic for a 31 T5. I swapped a 35 Pan for a 31 T5 and am awestruck buy the views! Just an amazong eyepiece.
As the owner of a 31T5 as well as all five currently available Ethos (through the 17mm) I heartily second this recommendation. I too plan to get the 21E to complete the set. The 31T5 is the *only* low-powered widefield Nagler that holds its own in an otherwise all-Ethos lineup, in terms of the difference in AFOVs not being nearly so noticeable vs the Ethos as they are compared against the 26T5 or 17T4 Naglers. Not that these latter two Naglers aren't generously, enjoyable endowed with AFOV against any other standard than 100 deg AFOV EPs.
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Chris M., aka "First Sight"
Orion XT12i Dob with Moonlite CR-2 focuser
WO Megrez 90 refractor on UniStar Light mount
Nikon 10x50 Binoculars
Edited by FirstSight (11/03/09 09:10 PM)
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turtle86
professor emeritus
Reged: 10/09/06
Posts: 665
Loc: Red Sox Nation
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I'm a bit late to this thread but just wanted to give my two cents as I once owned a 26 T5, and currently own all the present Ethos EP's plus the 31 T5. The 26 T5 is a very fine EP, but I stopped using it once I acquired a 31 T5. The 31 T5 is *the* EP for low power viewing with big Dobs IMHO. Plus, the 21 Ethos you have on order basically covers the FOV of the 26 T5, and with the higher mag the 21 Ethos is bound to offer a darker background...
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Simoes Pedro
member
Reged: 02/03/09
Posts: 16
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Pan 24 is excellent. Super confortable viewing. No back outs, beans, etc...
Excellent on a fast scope.
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astrodon
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 04/07/05
Posts: 1804
Loc: Hillsboro, OR, USA
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Another alternative would be the 30mm Pentax, but it would give you about the same true field as the 26 Nagler. To me it is still an excellent eyepiece and for some superior to the 31 Nagler.
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Putting Tasco Refractors back on their mounts one scope at a time!
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bicparker
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 02/07/05
Posts: 1701
Loc: Plano, TX
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Okay, I will take the contrary view here (everyone's eyes are different) and recommend you keep the 41 Pan and just buy the 31T5, if you decide you really want it. You have a nice interval between that and the soon to arrive 21E and, quite frankly, I love my 41 Pan in big dobs.
I use it quite a bit in my dob and the 20 and 30 inch dobs at 3RF and it really gives the quality widefield view (as a point of context and comparison, I do use a 31T5 for these scopes, as well, and I do like that eyepiece, so I am not dismissing it out of turn). Don't even concern yourself with the wasted exit pupil at that field of view. For the context of the observations, it really doesn't matter since most of the dim things you might be looking for will be below the image scale of what you can see at the lower magnifications. Plus, even with the unused exit pupil, you are still working with a lot of aperture.
And in any case, the 41Pan gives really really nice views. Why swap out something that carries that quality? If you really want the 31T5, just get one in addition to your collection instead of sacrificing a good one you already have.
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Bic Parker
17.5" f/5 dob
10" f/10 SCT
5" f/8 refractor
80mm f/6 refractor
66mm f/6 refractor
Plus a few others out of the rotation
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turtle86
professor emeritus
Reged: 10/09/06
Posts: 665
Loc: Red Sox Nation
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It would be a real luxury to have both a 41 Pan and a 31 T5, but I agree that it's not worth fretting over any wasted exit pupil, esp. when you have plenty of aperture to begin with and the main goal is achieving a nice, wide FOV. When I first got my 18", several folks told me that the 26 T5 is a better low power EP than the 31 T5 for fast Dobs since the 26 T5 has a smaller exit pupil. However, I came to find that at least for my eyes, the 31 T5 gave away nothing to the 26 T5 in terms of contrast, and obviously yielded a wider FOV. As much as I liked my 26 T5, I always found myself reaching for the 31 T5 instead when a low power situation presented itself, and wound up selling the 26 T5.
Quote:
Don't even concern yourself with the wasted exit pupil at that field of view. For the context of the observations, it really doesn't matter since most of the dim things you might be looking for will be below the image scale of what you can see at the lower magnifications. Plus, even with the unused exit pupil, you are still working with a lot of aperture.
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Zuben el Genubi
member
Reged: 03/24/09
Posts: 86
Loc: 12deg 28 S, 130deg 50 E
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Quote:
I second the reccomendation to swap the 41 Panoptic for a 31 T5. I swapped a 35 Pan for a 31 T5 and am awestruck buy the views! Just an amazong eyepiece.
The 35PAN is not the same as the 41PAN... a swap from the 41PAN to the 31T5 will lose a bit of FOV... the 41PAN is as big as FOV gets.
But the 31T5 is s'posed to be very very good, and nice with an ethos series.
My recommendation; get the 31T5 if you want, but don't lose the 41PAN straight away.
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sixela
Postmaster
Reged: 12/23/04
Posts: 10848
Loc: Boechout, Belgium
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Quote:
It would be a real luxury to have both a 41 Pan and a 31 T5, but I agree that it's not worth fretting over any wasted exit pupil,
That's not the point. You'll see more in a 31T5 because of the smaller exit pupil, and its field is often "close enough" to the 41mm Panoptic's field that you'll probably end up never using your 41mm Pan.
But if you have the budget to hold on to the 41mm Pan, there's nothing that prevents you from doing so (yes, the exit pupil is large, but you're doing it for the field anyway).
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400mm f/4.46 self made Dobsonian on Tom Osypowski equatorial platform
Orion Starblast (114mm f/4 reflector, Alt/Az)
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WOBentley
member
Reged: 09/16/09
Posts: 53
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Wow, 
Go away for a couple of days and see what happens!
This is great information...thanks. I will be getting the 21E I have on order (I admit to being addicted to them..amazing views) will consider what to do with the 31T5 recommendation. At this point I would be inclined to add that, can always sell the 41 if it turns out I am not using it at a later date.
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Lane
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 11/19/07
Posts: 1494
Loc: Frisco, Texas
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As I mentioned in another thread I have a 40 and a 35 and I keep a nebula filter on the 35 most of the time and use the 40 for non-filtered views. When it is cold and you are wearing gloves it is very hard to screw on filters. So it is nice to permanently mount them on specific eyepieces. I want the 31 and the 26 in addition to my existing long FL eyepieces so I have more options for more filters. There are no filter wheels or filter slides that work well for visual use. They are either designed exclusively for AP or they have design issues that make them undesirable.
So I recommend adding more long FL eyepieces and keeping the ones you have. Don't make it into a choice between two or more great eyepieces, get all of them.
Edited by Lane (11/06/09 12:47 PM)
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FLYcrash
member
Reged: 08/29/09
Posts: 95
Loc: Chicago, IL, USA
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Wow, folks, consider yourselves fortunate to have hand grenade collections like these! 
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Raman
Young, myopic, non-astigmatic eyes; polycarbonate spectacles; Minox HG 8x33, 10x52 binoculars
Orion XT4.5 (114mm, f/8) Dob
Sirius 25mm, 10mm Ploessls; Vixen 17mm LVW; Orion Deluxe 2x barlow
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Lane
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 11/19/07
Posts: 1494
Loc: Frisco, Texas
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When you are an old geiser like most of use out here you will be able to buy all this junk too. But personally I would swap it all to be younger again.
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CGEM, ORION SIRIUS, AT Voyager
OTAs: C6, C8, C9.25, C11, Pronto, ED80
Orion 9x63, Fujinon 10x50 & 16x70
Ethos 13, 17 Nagler 9t1,12t4,16t2,22t4 Panoptic 27,35
Antares 1.6x, TV Powermates 2x & 4x, TV Barlow 3x, TV Plossl 8,11,13
Baader Hyperion 21, 8-24 Zoom, UO HD Ortho 6,7,9,12,18
TMB Planetaries 3.2,4,5,6,7,8, Pentax XW 10,14,40
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FLYcrash
member
Reged: 08/29/09
Posts: 95
Loc: Chicago, IL, USA
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Fair enough. 
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Raman
Young, myopic, non-astigmatic eyes; polycarbonate spectacles; Minox HG 8x33, 10x52 binoculars
Orion XT4.5 (114mm, f/8) Dob
Sirius 25mm, 10mm Ploessls; Vixen 17mm LVW; Orion Deluxe 2x barlow
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