achille66
member
Reged: 08/15/08
Posts: 16
Loc: athens greece
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hi there,
keep wondering if c9.25 goes better with ethos 17 or 13?
17 gives magnification of 138 and FOV 0.72, exit pupil of 1.7
then 13 gives magnification of 180 and FOV 0.55, exit pupil of 1.3
my most used ep for now is orion q70 38mm and then is baader hyperion 21mm. lower than that (baader 13mm and 8mm) almost never.
what do u think?
achilleas 
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c9.25
eq6 pro synta
etx 125 pe
dsi ii c
hyperion 21/13/08, orion q70 38mm
self made Bahtinov laser cut aluminum mask
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RAKing
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 12/28/07
Posts: 2089
Loc: West of the D.C. Nebula
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A lot of this depends on how you like the edge performance of your C925. The 17mm is a "magic" focal length in my C925. The 138x magnification works very well and I can spend most of the night with this eyepiece. But I prefer the 17T4 Nagler over the Ethos in my SCT. Even though I have a great C925, the edges of the SCT are a little soft compared to my refractors, so I discovered that I didn't need that extra FOV.
I also prefer the Pentax 14XW over my 13mm Ethos in this scope - same reason. Plus it has a slightly brighter exit pupil.
This is merely my experience. YMMV. 
Ron
PS - The Ethos eyepieces work like gangbusters in my refractors. Their super sharp, magnificent FOV really knocks me out. 
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Time spent looking at the stars is added to your life.
Tak FS-128, C925-CF, C6SE, other stray cats and refractors.
A-P Mach1 GTO
Zeiss orthos to Ethos - and some stuff in between.
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hfjacinto
Almost got me
Reged: 01/12/09
Posts: 2092
Loc: Union,NJ
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I have the 9.25 and for that scope I think an Ethos is overkill. I personally like the 13 MM Hyperion and 17 MM Hyperion. If you want 82* the 14MM Meade UWA is also good. If you want a TV product I would tell you the 13MM or 17MM Nagler are both excellent. Would also take the risk and get the Zhummel 100* 16MM at $250 it is less than 50% of an Ethos and I doubt that on an F10 scope you would notice much of a difference.
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C9.25 ASGT 9*50 MM Finder,FT Focuser & 2" Diagonal
Meade LXD 75 6 Inch SNT w 9*50 MM Finder
5,6,9,14.5 MM Zhummel Planetary EPs
13,17,21,24,31,36 MM Baader Hyperion
6.7,8.8 MM Meade UWA & 11 MM Nagler T6
Planetary, OIII and Narrowband Filters
Thousand Oaks Dew Control w Kendrick Heaters
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Lane
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 11/19/07
Posts: 1515
Loc: Frisco, Texas
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I think if I had to pick just one for C9.25 and give up the other, I would keep the 17mm.
But be warned, these things do not have the long eye relief of your hyperions. You need to get your eye pretty close to take in the whole view. If you wear glasses I would definitely recommend against them, because even though they will work, they are not very comfortable to use when wearing glasses.
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Mounts: CGEM, ORION SIRIUS, AT Voyager/motorized
SCTs: C6, C8, C9.25, C11,
Refractors: TV Pronto, Orion ED80
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dscarpa
sage
Reged: 03/15/08
Posts: 257
Loc: San Diego Ca.
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I've had a C 9.25 and a Ethos 13 for years and consider it one of the best medium size DSO combos I've used, 180X and over half a degree FOV. It also barlows very well. I get 270X with my Siebert 1 1/2X and 360X with my Parks APO 2X, both 1 1/4", this gives excellent lunar-planertary performace. My seeing here is San Diego is often good. I haven't used the 17 Ethos in my scope, I'm sure that would be a great combo too. David
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achille66
member
Reged: 08/15/08
Posts: 16
Loc: athens greece
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it looks like my idea for a 17mm ethos is drifting away from your advise.
now the question is: nagler 17t4 or nagler 16t5?
thank you again,
achilleas
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c9.25
eq6 pro synta
etx 125 pe
dsi ii c
hyperion 21/13/08, orion q70 38mm
self made Bahtinov laser cut aluminum mask
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Lane
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 11/19/07
Posts: 1515
Loc: Frisco, Texas
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Definitely 17 T4.
The 16 has very little eye relief and that is especially bad when combined with an 82 degree eyepiece.
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Mounts: CGEM, ORION SIRIUS, AT Voyager/motorized
SCTs: C6, C8, C9.25, C11,
Refractors: TV Pronto, Orion ED80
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Bowmoreman
Post Laureate
Reged: 09/11/06
Posts: 3996
Loc: Bolton, MA
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Quote:
I have the 9.25 and for that scope I think an Ethos is overkill. I personally like the 13 MM Hyperion and 17 MM Hyperion. If you want 82* the 14MM Meade UWA is also good. If you want a TV product I would tell you the 13MM or 17MM Nagler are both excellent. Would also take the risk and get the Zhummel 100* 16MM at $250 it is less than 50% of an Ethos and I doubt that on an F10 scope you would notice much of a difference.
I notice HUGE differences between my Ethos, my T4's and my Hyperion (admittedly the 8-24 zoom) in my C11...
I think it is a complete myth that SCT's don't "appreciate/need/whatever other word you want to substitute here" Naglers or Ethos or Pentax XW levels of wide-field quality (and price).
The fact is, they ARE demonstrably better (to me) in any/all scopes I've tried (APOs: 66, 80 and 100mm, Newts: 10" f4.7 and 8" f4.0, and SCT: C11 at f10 and f6.3).
Now "worth it" is a WHOLE different conversation.
but there are quite noticeable qualitative (and quantitive in terms of FOV) distinctions...
to OP original question: if I had to pick ONE, based on that scope, I'd go with the 17E... but then, in my case, once mags start approaching 200X viewing falls apart.
Clear enough skies
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Dave
Imaging: MI-250+ADM/SBS/Optec Libra: C11Hyperstar,TMB80SS
Visual: XT10i RTP
TV: 31T5,22T4,17T4,12T4,13Ethos,8Ethos;2x Powermate,Paracorr, 1.6X Antares, Hyperion8-24Zoom
Cameras: Mallincam Color Hyper Plus, QHY8
Guider: SBIG STV eFinder
Key Add-ons: Gerbings Heated clothes, WilderSkiesObservatory(BYO#90), Speco 9"Monitor
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cuzimthedad
Just Be Cuz
Reged: 04/09/06
Posts: 3723
Loc: Sonoma, Northern California
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Original question...13E
Second question...17T4 hands down.
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Dan
20" f/5 Obsession
Antares 1529
TV102
Various Naglers, Ethos, UO Orthos and TV Plossls
The Off Fisher Lane Irregulars
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hfjacinto
Almost got me
Reged: 01/12/09
Posts: 2092
Loc: Union,NJ
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Quote:
I think it is a complete myth that SCT's don't "appreciate/need/whatever other word you want to substitute here" Naglers or Ethos or Pentax XW levels of wide-field quality (and price).
The fact is, they ARE demonstrably better (to me) in any/all scopes I've tried (APOs: 66, 80 and 100mm, Newts: 10" f4.7 and 8" f4.0, and SCT: C11 at f10 and f6.3).
And Dave, I will disagree with you. I am not saying a Hyperion is better than an a Nagler, because a Nagler is better if you like Wide Fields. But I am saying that an F10 scope is much more forgiving of less expensive and not as well corrected eyepieces. When I compare my Nagler to the Meade UWA, I see no difference in my 9.25. I doubt that if we did blind side by side testing very few people would notice a difference.
If Panoptics came in 13 and 17MM, I doubt many would see much of a difference (other than TV having warmer color). IMO on an F10 scope very expensive eyepieces are not needed, as I don't see enough of a difference.
Now if you want the best and can afford the best, than I see no reason why you shouldn't buy the best there is whether its a ZAO, Ethos, Nagler or Pentax.
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C9.25 ASGT 9*50 MM Finder,FT Focuser & 2" Diagonal
Meade LXD 75 6 Inch SNT w 9*50 MM Finder
5,6,9,14.5 MM Zhummel Planetary EPs
13,17,21,24,31,36 MM Baader Hyperion
6.7,8.8 MM Meade UWA & 11 MM Nagler T6
Planetary, OIII and Narrowband Filters
Thousand Oaks Dew Control w Kendrick Heaters
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Pete Kopfer
member
Reged: 12/01/08
Posts: 84
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Quote:
When I compare my Nagler to the Meade UWA, I see no difference in my 9.25. I doubt that if we did blind side by side testing very few people would notice a difference.
If Panoptics came in 13 and 17MM, I doubt many would see much of a difference (other than TV having warmer color). IMO on an F10 scope very expensive eyepieces are not needed, as I don't see enough of a difference.
You can't see the difference between 213* and about 265* in your telescope (your 11 mm Nagler and 8.8 mm UWA)? 
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cuzimthedad
Just Be Cuz
Reged: 04/09/06
Posts: 3723
Loc: Sonoma, Northern California
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Not to steal this thread, but what annoys me is when a person asks a specific question concerning a particular item or items and people go off in a different direction not addressing the ops ?. It doesn't matter whether someone wants to use an expensive ep in a slow scope or not. What matters is whether their original question is answered to their satisfaction. It's really nice when people stay to the specifics.
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Dan
20" f/5 Obsession
Antares 1529
TV102
Various Naglers, Ethos, UO Orthos and TV Plossls
The Off Fisher Lane Irregulars
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Pete Kopfer
member
Reged: 12/01/08
Posts: 84
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I agree. To answer the OP's original question: given that he appears to favor the longer FLs, then I think maybe he would prefer the 17E.
Pete
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cuzimthedad
Just Be Cuz
Reged: 04/09/06
Posts: 3723
Loc: Sonoma, Northern California
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I used the 13E in my 12" then LX200R but because of it's long fl the mag was often to high to be useful under the current seeing conditions at the time. Perhaps you're right and the 17E would be a better choice. I do love spending other people's money. 
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Dan
20" f/5 Obsession
Antares 1529
TV102
Various Naglers, Ethos, UO Orthos and TV Plossls
The Off Fisher Lane Irregulars
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Pete Kopfer
member
Reged: 12/01/08
Posts: 84
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Quote:
I do love spending other people's money.
Me too, Dan. 
For the OP, also I would pick the 17T4 over the 16T5 for the same reason Lane mentioned (I've never had the opportunity to look through a 16T5 - like the size but the eye relief is only about 10 mm).
Pete
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kaaikop
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 07/13/08
Posts: 768
Loc: North of the Montreal nebula
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Just a different point of view here:
I hate those big heavy eyepieces. I`ll never own an Ethos or a T4 simply for that reason.
My favorite EP on my C925 is the Nagler T5 16mm.
Nice & pocket size, it is the sharpest of all my eyepieces (I have about 25 different TV eyepieces),
and I could spend the whole evening with only this one EP (well... okay maybe add the Pan24...)
Something to think about... 
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Benoit, RASC Montreal
-C9.25 on EQ6 Pro - C6/ED80 on Portamount
-TV Plossls, Radians, Nags, Pans, UO Orthos.
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hfjacinto
Almost got me
Reged: 01/12/09
Posts: 2092
Loc: Union,NJ
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Quote:
You can't see the difference between 213* and about 265* in your telescope (your 11 mm Nagler and 8.8 mm UWA)?
I could see a difference in magnification but not sharpness to the edge or FOV. If I put in a UWA and a Nagler and asked people what it was I would say that 50% couldn't tell.
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C9.25 ASGT 9*50 MM Finder,FT Focuser & 2" Diagonal
Meade LXD 75 6 Inch SNT w 9*50 MM Finder
5,6,9,14.5 MM Zhummel Planetary EPs
13,17,21,24,31,36 MM Baader Hyperion
6.7,8.8 MM Meade UWA & 11 MM Nagler T6
Planetary, OIII and Narrowband Filters
Thousand Oaks Dew Control w Kendrick Heaters
Edited by hfjacinto (11/06/09 11:19 PM)
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Tiny
super member
Reged: 05/02/08
Posts: 197
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if you want the 100* FOV, Ethos 17mm.
If you just want to expand your eyepiece collection and you like your hyperions why shun them? They make a 17mm too.
For 82* i wouldnt rule out Celestron Axioms [similar to Meade series 5000 UWA] either, especially for an F10. The differences simply wont be overly apparent.
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achille66
member
Reged: 08/15/08
Posts: 16
Loc: athens greece
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wow overwhelming responses.
it looks like im back to square one with lots to think about.
i think i need to go to a star party and hope somebody has an ethos 17 and naglers 17 and 16 to see by myself
or then i could follow al naglers advice, who was here in greece last year and presented a great deal about the gemini project (great stuff to listen to al talking about such an important subject).
al recommends the ethos 17 as a medium powered eyepiece for 8" scopes, so i think he cant be wrong about this.
the great part about his hobby is that there is no right or wrong, its what works for you.
so yes the hyperions are great value and i have 3, although i use the 21 and 13 more.
the orion q70 38mm is a fantastic eyepiece for an f/10 scope - great views and no problems there at a really good price.
televue is a class in its own and i want a small piece of that for the nights ahead.
thank you all again.
achilleas
--------------------
c9.25
eq6 pro synta
etx 125 pe
dsi ii c
hyperion 21/13/08, orion q70 38mm
self made Bahtinov laser cut aluminum mask
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Todd
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 02/23/04
Posts: 1612
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Having used both in an 11-inch SCT, I think the 17mm Ethos would be my choice between the two (if I could have only one).
I personally really like viewing most deep sky objects @ around 130x or so which is what the 17mm will give you. I think the wider FOV (especially valued in an SCT) that the Ethos gives would be enjoyable to you too.
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