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David PavlichAdministrator
Transmographied
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Reged: 05/18/05

Loc: Mandeville, LA USA
ST8300C
      #3567081 - 01/17/10 08:03 PM

Anyone take delivery of the ST8300C?

David


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BlueGrass
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 07/25/09

Loc: Wasatch Front, UT
Re: ST8300C new [Re: David Pavlich]
      #3567114 - 01/17/10 08:23 PM

Still waiting on mine... OPT says end of January, early February. You also ordered from OPT David? They said they got 8 monos in the first shipment and hope to get 8 colors in that first shipment. We'll see...

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justabob
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Reged: 05/05/07

Re: ST8300C new [Re: BlueGrass]
      #3567211 - 01/17/10 09:06 PM

Still waiting! Thats ok, I have had almost no clear skies here. But I am ready for wide field with my eos lens adapter. Still I hope I have time to learn a bit about it and build a dark library before the weather improves.

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lawrie
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Reged: 01/31/06

Loc: Okanagan Valley
Re: ST8300C new [Re: justabob]
      #3567299 - 01/17/10 09:45 PM

I was told Feb.
Your right the weather has been terrible.


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mikertx
sage
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Reged: 09/29/05

Loc: Austin, TX
Re: ST8300C new [Re: lawrie]
      #3567391 - 01/17/10 10:28 PM

Hey Guys,

I'm curious why would you buy the OSC version of the 8300 over an OSC with the Sony ICX-413AQ like the QHY8? The 413 is a larger chip and is lower noise. The only two reasons that I've come up with are, 1. maybe you're more comfortable with the QA and support from SBIG and 2. you want the smaller pixels for use on a short focal length refractor.
Have I missed anything?

Mike


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David PavlichAdministrator
Transmographied
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Reged: 05/18/05

Loc: Mandeville, LA USA
Re: ST8300C new [Re: mikertx]
      #3567476 - 01/17/10 11:14 PM

Quote:

Hey Guys,

I'm curious why would you buy the OSC version of the 8300 over an OSC with the Sony ICX-413AQ like the QHY8? The 413 is a larger chip and is lower noise. The only two reasons that I've come up with are, 1. maybe you're more comfortable with the QA and support from SBIG and 2. you want the smaller pixels for use on a short focal length refractor.
Have I missed anything?

Mike




In my case, I have a C14/Hyperstar. The 8300C is a very good match for the system. Its small profile is one good thing and the other is that the K8300 chip should work well at f1.9. And yes, having SBIG as the camera maker also played a big part in the decision.

David


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BlueGrass
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 07/25/09

Loc: Wasatch Front, UT
Re: ST8300C new [Re: mikertx]
      #3567488 - 01/17/10 11:19 PM

Mike,
That pretty much sums it up for me.
This will be my first dedicated AP CCD. I had read a number of forums, posts and articles about the various cameras, vendors and the whole mono vs. OSC debate. For me, at my present, limited knowledge, the OSC offered less of a learning, imaging and processing curve than mono. Some day I will probably move to LRGB. For now, the 8300C with the quality and support of SBIG was the logical choice.


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justabob
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 05/05/07

Re: ST8300C new [Re: mikertx]
      #3567491 - 01/17/10 11:20 PM

Quote:

Hey Guys,

I'm curious why would you buy the OSC version of the 8300 over an OSC with the Sony ICX-413AQ like the QHY8? The 413 is a larger chip and is lower noise. The only two reasons that I've come up with are, 1. maybe you're more comfortable with the QA and support from SBIG and 2. you want the smaller pixels for use on a short focal length refractor.
Have I missed anything?

Mike




I will be using mine with short fl glass, mostly lenses.

Yes the reasons you stated as well as long proven track record of customer service.

Excellent software included.

I prefer a regulated camera.

No knock on the qhy8, but if it is superior I wonder why they felt the need to introduce the qhy9c?


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mikertx
sage
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Reged: 09/29/05

Loc: Austin, TX
Re: ST8300C new [Re: justabob]
      #3567543 - 01/17/10 11:48 PM

Thanks all. I understand your reasoning.

Bob, Actually Qui never originally intended to make the QHY9 in the color version but folks started asking for it. BTW, I'm not claiming it's a superior OSC just that some specs are superior. The size of the chip is not my opinion, it's a simple fact. I have a mono QSI-583 and a QHY-8. I like them both.

Congrats on the new cameras and I look forward to your results!

Mike


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justabob
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Reged: 05/05/07

Re: ST8300C new [Re: mikertx]
      #3567609 - 01/18/10 12:41 AM

Quote:

The size of the chip is not my opinion, it's a simple fact.




Correct, the physical size is larger. Same as an aps size dslr chip. The chips are quite different in total pixels.

6mega pixels for the 413 and 8.3 for the 8300.


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lawrie
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Reged: 01/31/06

Loc: Okanagan Valley
Re: ST8300C new [Re: justabob]
      #3568415 - 01/18/10 01:16 PM

On the website for the QHY-8 camera it says read noise at
8-12e @600kp/s.
The website for the SBIG camera says
9.3e @ 1000kp/s
I don't understand where the Q has less noise, or is it thermal noise?
I am getting a camera because the pixel size is a very good match for my NP101 around 2"/p , the build quality that should come from the SBIG brand, regulated cooling and the software supplied.
I also plan on eventually getting a 8300 mono camera (in time), but at that point the Atik 8300L looks interesting especially at the price point they are talking $1870.00 +-


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justabob
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 05/05/07

Re: ST8300C new [Re: lawrie]
      #3568516 - 01/18/10 01:58 PM

I am pretty sure the person operating the camera and processing the images will play a much larger role in final image quality than specs on noise that differ by a few electrons.

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m2434
professor emeritus


Reged: 01/01/09

Loc: on the road
Re: ST8300C new [Re: lawrie]
      #3569983 - 01/19/10 08:34 AM

Quote:

On the website for the QHY-8 camera it says read noise at
8-12e @600kp/s.
The website for the SBIG camera says
9.3e @ 1000kp/s
I don't understand where the Q has less noise, or is it thermal noise?
I am getting a camera because the pixel size is a very good match for my NP101 around 2"/p , the build quality that should come from the SBIG brand, regulated cooling and the software supplied.
I also plan on eventually getting a 8300 mono camera (in time), but at that point the Atik 8300L looks interesting especially at the price point they are talking $1870.00 +-




They mean thermal noise. I am playing with a friends Orion SSP V2, which is more or less the same camera. Really the difference is it is interlaced, not progressive. This means when you read from the chip, it reads every other line, then the other line. There is a 1/60th second delay before reads, so, if your doing very short exposures the QY8 is a little better. Also, the QHY8 is said to be cooled -40 deg C ver -30 def C for the Orion. However, otherwise, they are essentially the same.

Anyway, for the Orion the I have taken a lot of darks and there really is almost no thermal noise. A 10min dark, in my house (70 deg F), after subtracting bias, had an average background value of approx 29 ADU. Also, I took a series of darks ranging from 6 to 30 minutes and there really wasn't any obvious difference. Unfortunately, the noise difference between it and my Canon XT 350 does not seem to make for better pictures for me at least. After stacking, they do look look a bit cleaner, but that dosn't seem to translate to more detail, which is what I really want.

The SBIGs's smaller pixels may make a slight difference as far as detail and I seriously doubt any noise difference would be noticeable after stacking a few images....


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Gama
Vendor (Gama Electronics)


Reged: 08/23/05

Loc: I come from the land downUnder
Re: ST8300C new [Re: lawrie]
      #3570005 - 01/19/10 08:49 AM

Quote:

On the website for the QHY-8 camera it says read noise at
8-12e @600kp/s.
The website for the SBIG camera says
9.3e @ 1000kp/s
I don't understand where the Q has less noise, or is it thermal noise?
I am getting a camera because the pixel size is a very good match for my NP101 around 2"/p , the build quality that should come from the SBIG brand, regulated cooling and the software supplied.
I also plan on eventually getting a 8300 mono camera (in time), but at that point the Atik 8300L looks interesting especially at the price point they are talking $1870.00 +-




Hi Lawrie,
Firstly, the Sony CCD in the QHY-8 or equivalent cameras using the Sony CCD is totally different to the CCD in the ST8300 or any camera using the KAF-8300.

Secondly, the read out noise may change when read at a faster or slower speed. This is why they specify at what speed the read noise was measured at.

Theo


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Ohioastro
member


Reged: 06/12/09

Loc: Ohio
Re: ST8300C new [Re: Gama]
      #3570483 - 01/19/10 01:29 PM

Just finished a call to OPT (Rod). Two to three weeks. About what I expected from an order placed Nov. 2009

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BlueGrass
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 07/25/09

Loc: Wasatch Front, UT
Re: ST8300C new [Re: Ohioastro]
      #3571184 - 01/19/10 07:26 PM

That's also what I heard a week or so ago. End of January for first 8300C cameras to arrive..... let hope so ....

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nofxrx
Vendor (HyperCams & Mods)
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Reged: 07/12/05

Loc: Palm Bay,Florida
Re: ST8300C new [Re: BlueGrass]
      #3571216 - 01/19/10 07:43 PM

I ordered on 1/3/10,was told the ST8300M would be available MAYBE by March.
I canceled the order though as my interests have shifted..
I hate waiting..I will buy one when they hit the used market!!


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BlueGrass
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Reged: 07/25/09

Loc: Wasatch Front, UT
Re: ST8300C new [Re: nofxrx]
      #3571238 - 01/19/10 07:56 PM

Well, you may not see one for awhile Brent, but Good Luck to you! Maybe one will show up if a person gets out of AP or decides to go with the Atik or a Sony based camera.

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David PavlichAdministrator
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Reged: 05/18/05

Loc: Mandeville, LA USA
Re: ST8300C new [Re: BlueGrass]
      #3571643 - 01/19/10 10:57 PM

The way I understand it, the initial OSC version shipments will be for those that were on the initial order list. If you got on later, it'll be closer to March.

David


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justabob
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 05/05/07

Re: ST8300C new [Re: David Pavlich]
      #3571844 - 01/20/10 01:48 AM

I wonder where I am in the que I ordered on November 15th?

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