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Daniel Mounsey
Vendor (Woodland Hills)
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Reged: 06/12/02

Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: blb]
      #5119782 - 03/13/12 09:04 AM



For those asking about Kindle, I apologize, I was wrong. A friend of mine and I were looking at a Kindle of BCH about 3 weeks ago, but my friend contacted me the other day apologizing after I asked again because of this forum. What it was, is a suggestion box to recommend BCH for Kindle, not an actual BCH Kindle program. Sorry for the confusion.


Hi Buddy,

Your comments are interesting regarding Burnham. For that reason I do tend to go after you whenever the Burnham topic surfaces. I'll be back to address your comments shortly because I do have a response to your post.


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Daniel Mounsey
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Reged: 06/12/02

Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: rmollise]
      #5119826 - 03/13/12 09:42 AM

Quote:

Quote:



Everyone who reads Robert Burnham's guide will certainly become aware of its age and that it may or may not be technically current




It's not technically correct, and, frankly, wasn't on day one. But that's not why you real Burnham's. You don't read it for hard information on objects beyond the bright ones, either. You read it for its poetic take on the cosmos. Which is enough for me on a cloudy winter's evening. If not for at the telescope...and that is OK.




If Burnham were available in digital; others may find it easier to take to the telescope in the field but paper is still the best IMO because you can scribble notes in it. I am working on a review of BCH because in my opinion, there still appears to be several key topics that are overlooked about the way BCH was set up and how it was designed to be used in the field. BCH has some super unique features no other field guide in the world offers even to this day and I'm going to expose them later. Many observers appear to be under the impression that BCH is just an arm chair read. That's actually not correct. For users of 12" telescopes on down especially, it's still a good source. Many of the DSO are a magnitude fainter than should be but BCH was also specifically designed to be used in the field as well. That's why the objects are listed as they are and I also like the NSOG. BCH and NSOG are set up differently and each deserve mention but they're both good sources. BCH just requires some more understanding because it has more features that are absent in the NSOG. More on that later.


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jrbarnett
Eyepiece Hooligan
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Reged: 02/28/06

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Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: Daniel Mounsey]
      #5142466 - 03/26/12 03:31 PM

Daniel:

Your pictures of your post-it and scribble jammed BCH inspired me to dedicate my oldest paperbound copy of BCH to field use (I have three sets; two paperbound and one hardbound).

An iPad iBook or Kindle version would be great, though, for those of us using iOS devices in the field to control mounts using Sky Safari and Sky Wire or Sky Fi.

Regards,

Jim


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rmollise
Postmaster
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Reged: 07/06/07

Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: jrbarnett]
      #5142547 - 03/26/12 04:09 PM

It has many features and many good ones. But not for observing at the scope. NSOG has many more objects and data on their appearance with different apertures.

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blb
Post Laureate


Reged: 11/25/05

Loc: Piedmont NC
Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: rmollise]
      #5142720 - 03/26/12 06:27 PM

Even if you are a double star/variable star observer (which is the bulk of Burnhams three volumes) you still have to look up the current information about the stars. If on the other hand you are into observing those nonstelar DSO's, like I am, then you know that Burnhams little over a thousand objects listed are pretty much the showcase tourist objects. Almost all of us look at many more objects than Burnham's covers and you will still need to look up the curent information on the majority of those objects. Why? because less than a fifth of the non-stelar objects are included in his detailed notes about them and the rest are only listed.

Do I have a set of Burnham's three volumes? YES, and I still look at them on ocasion when hunting information about an object. I also have two works by Olcott and I have several other turn of the last centery works on a disk that I have saved. Do I love to read those on ocasion too. YES! In fact reading about our observational history is a lot of fun for me. But do I use them at the telescope or for planning my night of observing? NO! They simply do not cover all that I wont to see in a nights observing. We have many works that cover so much that these works did not even know about or observers were not able to observe then at those times. But hey that was then and this is now and we have works like the NSOG and Sue French's Deep Sky Wonders along with others that cover more of what is observed today.

I say enjoy the older work's for what they were but come on let's move on beyond 50 to 100 year old books. Their is so much more to be seen in the sky. Enjoy the history of observational astronomy and let's not exclude or limit our viewing to these older works. If you have not viewed these objects yet then please do, they are wonderful sights, but do not limit yourselves either, there is much more to be seen and not looking would be your loss.


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rmollise
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Reged: 07/06/07

Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: blb]
      #5143750 - 03/27/12 11:12 AM



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Daniel Mounsey
Vendor (Woodland Hills)
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Reged: 06/12/02

Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: jrbarnett]
      #5148191 - 03/30/12 02:16 AM

Quote:

Daniel:

Your pictures of your post-it and scribble jammed BCH inspired me to dedicate my oldest paperbound copy of BCH to field use (I have three sets; two paperbound and one hardbound).

An iPad iBook or Kindle version would be great, though, for those of us using iOS devices in the field to control mounts using Sky Safari and Sky Wire or Sky Fi.

Regards,

Jim




Jim,
I'm glad you were inspired. Burnham was undoubtedly a remarkable individual. BCH was the only thing that inspired me to observe because he really spoke from the heart. Had it not been for those copies of BCH I purchased in the early 90's, I wouldn't even be involved with public outreach. BCH is like having a close observing friend. People can say all the negative things they want, but I've given many lectures on the night sky, just like Dennis Mammana has and both he and I still use Burnham's. The inspiration is there. What I will sometimes do is check some of the astrophyical data against current data to see how much certain things have evolved but the detail of the work is still unrivaled by anything out there IMO. It's a total package companion.


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Daniel Mounsey
Vendor (Woodland Hills)
*****

Reged: 06/12/02

Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: blb]
      #5148201 - 03/30/12 02:34 AM

Buddy,
It was the Washington double star catalog. Btw I do like and appreciate technology and I hope it continues to grow further, however, I already appreciate what I have. I don't need all the tech stuff to be inspired. BCH has enough to last a life time. btw you may not care much about stars, but have you looked at Polaris lately with a pair of binoculars? It's the tip of a diamond ring. I learned that from BCH. I don't recall anything else telling me that.


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skyward_eyes
Vendor - Sky-Watcher USA
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Reged: 12/12/06

Loc: California
Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: Daniel Mounsey]
      #5148632 - 03/30/12 11:12 AM

There is something you dont see brought up very often! The Diamond Ring, nice work Daniel.

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blb
Post Laureate


Reged: 11/25/05

Loc: Piedmont NC
Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: skyward_eyes]
      #5148710 - 03/30/12 12:11 PM

Quote:

BCH was the only thing that inspired me to observe because he really spoke from the heart.




I am sorry to hear that. What inspired me to observe was the longing to see the wonders of the sky for myself and not just look at pretty pictures in books and magazines. It is not unlike my bird watching. I can look at fantistic pictures in books or I can get out and look for myself. I am the type of person who has got to see it for myself. There is so much more to see than what is contained in BCH.

Quote:

Btw I do like and appreciate technology and I hope it continues to grow further, however, I already appreciate what I have. I don't need all the tech stuff to be inspired.




I certanily hope so. You make your living selling the latest and greatest equipment. That's a good thing. We today enjoy the best equipment for viewing that has ever been made.

Quote:

I don't need all the tech stuff to be inspired.




And I do? I have been star hoping since 1964. Only my ETX and my C=11 have go-to, all the rest I star hop with.

Quote:

...but have you looked at Polaris lately with a pair of binoculars? It's the tip of a diamond ring. I learned that from BCH. I don't recall anything else telling me that.




Yes I have seen the diamond ring with my 10x50 binoculars. I really don't remember the first time that I looked at it but I have known about it for a long time now. This asterism is on almost all asterism lists. Asterisms are something that tweeks my interest every now and then. They are neat but can't hold my interest like an interacting pair of galaxies.

Quote:

BCH has enough to last a life time.




I guess that's true if you wont a limited list to view from but there is so much more to see, I just can't see limiting myself to only that list of objects when there is so much more to see.


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Daniel Mounsey
Vendor (Woodland Hills)
*****

Reged: 06/12/02

Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: blb]
      #5151067 - 04/01/12 01:21 AM

In your defense Buddy, you're obviously a good observer. I respect and understand your desire to explore even more extensive catalogs. Btw I actually wouldn't mind a Kindle with a red back light with all these awesome books discussed.

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rmollise
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Reged: 07/06/07

Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: Daniel Mounsey]
      #5151385 - 04/01/12 09:44 AM

Quote:

Buddy,
It was the Washington double star catalog. Btw I do like and appreciate technology and I hope it continues to grow further, however, I already appreciate what I have. I don't need all the tech stuff to be inspired. BCH has enough to last a life time.




If that's enough for you, that's great. But for quite a few of us the Handbook's 1500 or so is more of a "best of the best." Useful on that level, but...

Some of us want to go deeper, far deeper...on to the next level beyond the NGCs.


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amicus sidera
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Reged: 10/14/11

Loc: East of the Sun, West of the M...
Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: Daniel Mounsey]
      #5151446 - 04/01/12 10:27 AM

Quote:

Daniel Mounsey wrote:

(snip)
Btw I do like and appreciate technology and I hope it continues to grow further, however, I already appreciate what I have. I don't need all the tech stuff to be inspired. BCH has enough to last a life time.
(snip)





+100.


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Matthew Ota
Hmmm


Reged: 04/30/05

Loc: Los Angeles, California
Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: rmollise]
      #5157034 - 04/05/12 02:04 AM

I started out with paperback editions of all three volumes. After donating them to the Mt Wilson Observatory Library, I purchased used hardcover editions of all three volumes. I enjoy reading books the old fashioned way, on printed bound paper. It is easier on the eyes. I will treasure my hardcover editions for a long time, with no need for an electronic edition.

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Daniel Mounsey
Vendor (Woodland Hills)
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Reged: 06/12/02

Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: Matthew Ota]
      #5158507 - 04/06/12 12:40 AM

I like technology, particularly the Kindle, but I'd rather have real paper in my hands if possible. To me it seems like so many people are on a technology binge. Last night I opened Burnham's Volume 2 to read about the 6 star Castor system and the description is so fantasic. Burnham has so many incredible stories to tell about so many objects of great interest no matter what kind it is.

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okieav8rAdministrator
I'd rather be flying!
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Reged: 03/01/09

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Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: Daniel Mounsey]
      #5158667 - 04/06/12 07:00 AM

Quote:

I like technology, particularly the Kindle, but I'd rather have real paper in my hands if possible. To me it seems like so many people are on a technology binge. Last night I opened Burnham's Volume 2 to read about the 6 star Castor system and the description is so fantasic. Burnham has so many incredible stories to tell about so many objects of great interest no matter what kind it is.




For some of us, it isn't about being on a "technology binge", but if that is what makes the hobby more enjoyable for some, then more power to them. I'd rather see folks enjoying astronomy that way than not at all. Having my laptop in the field is a simple matter of convenience. It helps make my observing sessions much more productive. When in the field, I'm not looking for incredible stories--I'm looking for cold information, in whatever form I deem most useful and convenient. When I'm not in the field, then yes, I prefer paper to screens, and I have much more time to enjoy and educate myself with the stories and lore in the comfort of my easy chair.


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Daniel Mounsey
Vendor (Woodland Hills)
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Reged: 06/12/02

Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: okieav8r]
      #5164813 - 04/10/12 09:24 AM

Rex,
What computer software are you using?


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okieav8rAdministrator
I'd rather be flying!
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Reged: 03/01/09

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Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: Daniel Mounsey]
      #5165295 - 04/10/12 01:57 PM

Quote:

Rex,
What computer software are you using?




Hi Daniel. I've tried most all of them, but I really like and use Skytools 3. I really love the planning and charting features that it has. If Skytools has one caveat (for me), it's that it doesn't have a planetarium feature. I kind of find it useful to be able to drag the sky map around, so I usually have Stellarium open along side it. I think they compliment each other nicely.

Another thing I like about Skytools is that its developer, Greg Crinklaw, has a yahoo groups page where he is very responisve to questions if you have trouble with something, and he's good about correcting any errors you might find. His website has a lot of good how-to videos for learning the software.


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Daniel Mounsey
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Reged: 06/12/02

Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: okieav8r]
      #5166207 - 04/11/12 12:36 AM

Rex,
So basically you can make an observational list which is nice. Do you use any other observational materials and what telescope are you using the majority of the time for those observations?


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okieav8rAdministrator
I'd rather be flying!
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Reged: 03/01/09

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Re: Burnham's Celestial Handbook - Digital new [Re: Daniel Mounsey]
      #5166373 - 04/11/12 06:32 AM

Quote:

Rex,
So basically you can make an observational list which is nice. Do you use any other observational materials and what telescope are you using the majority of the time for those observations?




I sometimes look at NSOG and Skytools for object information, and sometimes at Uranometria and/or SkyAtlas 2000 before a session. I have 18 and 20 inch Obsession telescopes, and a Televue NP-101is.


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