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Happy Birthday cpsTN
Carpal Tunnel
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What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it?
      #4426421 - 03/04/11 06:03 PM

I understand the Cat's Paw is located near the Apollo 11 landing site, but I can't find any reference to it other than that.

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jack savard
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Reged: 05/26/04

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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: cpsTN]
      #4426494 - 03/04/11 06:40 PM

google

http://the-moon.wikispaces.com/West
or
http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/4177465/page/2/view/expanded/sb/5/o/all/fpart/

http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/4177465/page/2/view/expanded/sb/5/o/all/fpart/

jack 47"N 71'w


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Doug Neal
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: cpsTN]
      #4426866 - 03/04/11 09:35 PM Attachment (103 downloads)

Charles,
Here's my modest attempt at the Apollo 11 area with the Cat's Paw just to the left of the ^ symbol. This was taken a couple of years ago for the 40 yr. anniversary of the moon landing...If you compare the photo to an moon atlas you will see Armstrong, Aldrin and Collins...

Reards,
Doug


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Rick Woods
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: Doug Neal]
      #4427037 - 03/04/11 10:50 PM

"Modest attempt"???? That looks like an orbiter picture!

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azure1961p
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: cpsTN]
      #4427046 - 03/04/11 10:55 PM

If you can find the Apollo 11 panorama taken by one [or more?] of the Apollo 11 crew the Cats Paw is actually seen on the horizon as two gently raised humps, subtly but there. It relevant to me in that its one or the only crater structure visible from the landing site and still visible in better amateur i nstruments. Id like to succede at it one day.

Pete


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David Knisely
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: cpsTN]
      #4427214 - 03/05/11 01:30 AM Attachment (71 downloads)

Cat's Paw is one of the craters in the area of the Apollo 11 landing site. It is somewhat shallow, around 2.7 km (1.6 miles) or so across, and in Lunar Orbiter images resembles the footprint of a cat's paw. I have seen Cat's Paw in my 9.25 inch SCT when the sun angle is modestly low, so it isn't all that hard if the seeing is halfway decent. Below is an image from the Consolidated Lunar Atlas which I have labeled for reference:

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David Knisely
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: David Knisely]
      #4427227 - 03/05/11 01:51 AM Attachment (70 downloads)

Here it is from the Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter front-side lunar mosaic of the area at higher resolution:

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Asbytec
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: David Knisely]
      #4427234 - 03/05/11 01:59 AM

Wow, that looks tough. I've seen the crater next to Sabine readily, but the cat's paw looks very shallow. Not much rim shadow, at least in this image. It looks easy to find, though.

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C_Moon
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: Asbytec]
      #4427764 - 03/05/11 11:33 AM

How tough is it relative to Armstrong, Alrdin & Collins?

I've seen those three once when the sun angle was just right and the seeing was great. Didn't know enough to look for the Cat's Paw. Pete's comments on it have given me the bug to see it though


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Asbytec
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: C_Moon]
      #4427790 - 03/05/11 11:51 AM

Yea, Pete's been buggin all of us about seeing it.

I'd imagine tougher than the three you listed. I've observed Sabine many times and never knew Apollo landing was THAT close. Kind of got the bug, myself, but not sure I can do it. Ah, what the "H" "E" double toothpicks...next time I'm in the area, we'll see.


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C_Moon
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: Asbytec]
      #4427809 - 03/05/11 11:58 AM

So what will we see first, Norme, the Cat's Paw or Enceladus?

I love this hobby.


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Asbytec
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: C_Moon]
      #4427837 - 03/05/11 12:08 PM

Yea, I love this hobby, too. The Plato challenge was fun. Just looking for the next challenge with two in the oven.



Where is it? Where is iiiiit?


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moonnerd
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Reged: 12/18/08

Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: Asbytec]
      #4428988 - 03/05/11 09:17 PM

The Cat's Paw is one of my visual "holy grails." What would be the minimum scope needed to see it?

If I remember right, I asked Doug a few years ago what scope he used for that photo. I think he said a 4" Tak!!! Or if it wasn't Doug, then someone who posted a similar photo showing the Cats Paw did it with the Tak.


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Asbytec
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: moonnerd]
      #4429110 - 03/05/11 10:16 PM

Estimating from the LAC chart, Sabine C is about 1.5 miles across. This borders on the lower limit I have detected in a 6" under good seeing at about 1.1 miles in diameter. And of course, this will depend on the distance to the moon, as well. The closer, the better.

The Cat's Paw is nearly that size. So resolution is probably within a 6" and maybe a 4" with optimum conditions. The problem appears to be with how shallow it is and what rim shadow it creates...and of course seeing. So it looks doable.

What say you, Pete? Wanna find the lander by watching the sun glint off it's surface? Maybe we can see the ejecta it kicked up during landing.


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Happy Birthday cpsTN
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: Asbytec]
      #4436925 - 03/09/11 08:50 AM

Thanks to all. It seems no matter how many years I observe the Moon, I always run into things I have seen or heard of yet.

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azure1961p
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: Asbytec]
      #4438248 - 03/09/11 07:04 PM

Quote:





What say you, Pete? Wanna find the lander by watching the sun glint off it's surface? Maybe we can see the ejecta it kicked up during landing.




Well if the truth be told, that same night I detected 32 craterlets in Plato, there was an Apollo 15 event Im afraid I cant prove. Still, I'll divulge...

Under very low angle illumination by the Hadley Rille, a microscopic near stellar glint of light transversed the area in a loop. Quickly, it was easy to surmise there was a local impact that sent the rover on its way, un manned and out of control.

The burden of this knowledge weighs heavily on me. Its actually quite depressing.


Pete


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Asbytec
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: azure1961p]
      #4439047 - 03/10/11 02:56 AM



Careful divulging stuff, you might have to go observe it and do a lengthy thread no one will believe. So, what's the point?


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azure1961p
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: Asbytec]
      #4439233 - 03/10/11 07:26 AM

Its interesting how flat the catspaw is and as a result low contrast - too bad really. Another interesting thng seen in the high res image are the small crater chains seemingly all over the place, above Aldrin, Armstrong etc. All tilted at the same angle.


Well time to get outta bed and start coffee.


Pete


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Asbytec
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Re: What is the Cat's Paw and exactly where is it? new [Re: azure1961p]
      #4439249 - 03/10/11 07:43 AM

Yea, I'm waiting your cat's paw and 32 crater-let in Plato threads.

Good morning, Pete.

Off to read about a newbie who saw Saturn for the first time and see if that thread develops into a battle of the scopes between guys who have seen Saturn.


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