Telescope Reviews: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist?

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Equipment Discussions >> Binoviewers

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bgavin
scholastic sledgehammer

Reged: 01/25/11

Loc: 38°41' x 121°13'

Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist?
#4834535 - 09/29/11 04:15 PM

I'm curious if there are any modest bino viewers available in 1.25".
My needs are simple, and I have no future plans for using any 2" EP for this.

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Jim7728
Postmaster

Reged: 04/10/05

Loc: Stoop Landing Observatory, NYC

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: bgavin]
#4834815 - 09/29/11 07:13 PM

Here.

William Optics

and here.

Orion

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sopticals
sage

Reged: 03/28/10

Loc: New Zealand

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: Jim7728]
#4834850 - 09/29/11 07:36 PM

Quote:

Here.

William Optics

and here.

Orion

I give my vote also for the Williams Optics unit with its excellent provided 20mm 66deg eyepieces.I find my WO bino to be all I could want for the two eyed visual experience, and at a price thats affordable for most of us.

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bgavin
scholastic sledgehammer

Reged: 01/25/11

Loc: 38°41' x 121°13'

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: sopticals]
#4834873 - 09/29/11 07:48 PM

I see that Baader makes a 1.25"/2.0" interchangeable nosepiece model.
This is about the upper limit I want to spend for casual use.

In my signature, I have a good number of EP pairs suitable for BV in the 1.25" format.

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hfjacinto
I think he's got it!

Reged: 01/12/09

Loc: Land of clouds and LP

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: bgavin]
#4834993 - 09/29/11 08:53 PM Attachment (23 downloads)

I have the Baader unit and its very good, comparable to the standard Denk but not as good as the Mark V or Televue or the Premiun Denk. With the Prism diaganol, I can reach focus in the 120 and 9.25 without a corrector and it looks cool.

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bgavin
scholastic sledgehammer

Reged: 01/25/11

Loc: 38°41' x 121°13'

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: hfjacinto]
#4835025 - 09/29/11 09:13 PM

Hi Helder,

I've been reading old threads here and picking up on your experience.

In my signature, I have a several pairs of LER.
These were originally purchased during the Big Sale for a Garrett BT70.
Unfortunately, the BT70 is vapor ware.. the factory burned down, they are doing (another) redesign, the dog ate my homework, ad nauseum.
The delay was going to wind up almost a year, so I gave up.

The Astro-Tech AT90EDT in my signature is coming mid-October from Doug76 (CN'er).
In retrospect, I will probably be a lot happier with a high quality APO and (maybe) a BV setup.

I picked the f/6.7 intentionally, so my various BGO or UO orthos can reach their full potential.
All this history aside, the shorter LER pairs will no doubt go up for sale.
I understand a stronger corrector/long focal EP is superior to weak corrector/short focal EPs.

I'm a casual observer, so I have to figure out if I want to pony up the big $$$ for a Denk.
The Maxbright seems to be the middle of the road choice, but the setscrew issues, etc, etc, do bother me.
I understand there is none of that silliness with a Denk.

We plan to do both terrestrial and astronomical work with the APO.
I'm looking forward to hooking my Nikon D200 DSLR up for both daylight and lunar photos.

The intended diagonal is the Televue 1.25" Everbrite, unless there is a compelling reason for something else.

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hfjacinto
I think he's got it!

Reged: 01/12/09

Loc: Land of clouds and LP

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: bgavin]
#4835043 - 09/29/11 09:25 PM

This is my second pair of Baaders, the first were defective, I got from Alpine Astro and had no issues getting another one. The Denk is very nice also, I actually spent almost the same with the prism diagonal and the various adapters to make the Baader work for 3 of my scopes, so the Denks were also in the picture. Thomas (AstroJensen) gave a very good recommendation for the Baaders so I went with his opinion, I am happy, the other option is Earthwin, but from several sources the reply to e-mails was longer than they liked so that turned me off.

As far as imaging, that's in a different spectrum. There are times that I am visual just so that I don't image and bring all the gear.

As far as the LER eyepieces, I would hold off selling them, I had a couple and they were very nice. Now my current favorite in the low cost long eye relief EPs are the Meade HD's but the Astro Techs are very good also.

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faackanders2
Pooh-Bah

Reged: 03/28/11

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: bgavin]
#4835076 - 09/29/11 09:45 PM

Most binoviewers do take 1.25" eyepieces. I believe only Siebert takes 2" eyepieces.
Both Denk and Earthwin have powerswitch capability which enables multiple power option with one pair of eyepieces.
Having a 2" nosepiece does allow more light to enter the system, even though the eyepiece is only 1.25"

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mikey cee
Postmaster

Reged: 01/18/07

Loc: bellevue ne.

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: faackanders2]
#4835144 - 09/29/11 10:43 PM

Get WO's and don't look back.

Mike

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teskridg
Pooh-Bah

Reged: 01/15/08

Loc: PA

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: mikey cee]
#4835681 - 09/30/11 10:07 AM

Earthwin has responded excellently to my emails, so I guess this is variable. Perhaps someone could respond as to the net amount of magnification added to the system by the correctors necessary to allow focus with binoviewers in a refractor. My experience with Chinese clone binoviewers (Burgess 24) is that above, say 175x, collimation issues making fusing the two images may become a problem. The WO's are great as are the included eyepieces. I strongly recommend you try a pair of binoviewers in your telescope at a star party if possible before purchasing; some vendors may let you try a pair or give you liberal return policy if they don't work out. I universally binoview and love the experience, but some people do have trouble fusing the images. One hint- don't tighten the eyepiece collets, but let the eyepieces ride loosely in the binoviewer if you have trouble getting the images to merge. The eyepieces can get cockeyed in the bino holders if they're not symmetrically held in place, and if you put them in loosely, they're frequently straighter than when tightened. Tim

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bgavin
scholastic sledgehammer

Reged: 01/25/11

Loc: 38°41' x 121°13'

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: teskridg]
#4836164 - 09/30/11 02:45 PM

I'm more inclined to purchase used from here or AM.
This makes learning-from-mistakes a lot less costly, but also removes the liberal return policy..

I'm more inclined to buy a used Denk, than a cheapie knockoff.
My single WO UWAN is a gem.. and my herd of LER are all pretty nice.
Problem is, these are simple compared to a BV.

I spent some time reading all the Maxbright threads here, and there seems to be an undercurrent of not-quite-right all the time.

I think the star party is a good idea... will have to find one in my area.
I'm keeping my eyes open for a Baader or Denk bargain, and will take the risk if one comes along.

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mikey cee
Postmaster

Reged: 01/18/07

Loc: bellevue ne.

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: bgavin]
#4836186 - 09/30/11 02:54 PM

I hope you don't consider WO's a cheapie knockoff. I'm impressed with their quality and price. I've taken mine to 750X on double stars and they work. With 66° 20mm plossls I'm in seventh heaven instead of the poor house!

Mike

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mike bacanin
Carpal Tunnel

Reged: 03/19/07

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: bgavin]
#4836200 - 09/30/11 03:01 PM

I'm curious as to why the WO seem so good. When i asked about these in general here in the UK, i'm told they are a typical lower end China/Taiwan unit. They do not have self centring diopters as for example the Skywatcher unit, so what makes it good? You would expect the Maxbright to be a higher quality unit according to the redesigned prism seats etc, but that seems iffy.
I have owned the high end Denk II, and Std's, but change of job circumstances means i have to now look at a budget unit.

Mike

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junomike
Pooh-Bah

Reged: 09/07/09

Loc: Ontario

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: mike bacanin]
#4836420 - 09/30/11 05:10 PM

Mike, Binoviewers are just like most other Astronomy gear. The WO's do the job and are great, but not as great as the higher end units.

It's no different than eyepieces. If I put a GSO plossl in a larger SCT (say 11") at a public viewing, most people would be blown away. If I then put in a "premium" eyepiece, would they be further impressed? Maybe, maybe not. To some the upgrade and associated cost is worth It. To others, It's not.

I can tell you that I have no issues with my WO Bino's, but when I do the "Bino test" (looking through them backwards), my TV's are near perfect whereas the WO's have a double image. Does this affect the views? Not for me, but I have no issues with merging. I have an Astro-friend who said he couldn't merge with the WO's (they were @ 200X).
He never mentioned this with my Televue Bino's'though.

So, for some the GSO plossl is fine, and for others, they need the "premium" EP.

I find the TV Binoviewer prisms a little "cleaner" and the self centering splines alleviate the issues with undercut eyepieces.
Also, the clear aperture is larger in the TV,Denk,EW Bino's, but that only comes into play with a pair of 24mm Pans (which I highly recommend).

In conclusion, like most Astro-gear, small differences in performance for large difference in price.
You decide!

Mike

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amillego
super member

Reged: 12/14/10

Loc: Southeast MI USA

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: junomike]
#4836441 - 09/30/11 05:23 PM

WO's are the way to go for an super view at the right price.

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mike bacanin
Carpal Tunnel

Reged: 03/19/07

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

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[Re: amillego]
#4836455 - 09/30/11 05:39 PM

Thanks for those helpful and interesting comments.

Mike

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Mike B
Starstruck

Reged: 04/06/05

Loc: shake, rattle, & roll, CA

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: junomike]
#4836732 - 09/30/11 08:55 PM

Quote:

In conclusion, like most Astro-gear, small differences in performance for large difference in price.

Another aspect not mentioned often, and one that is really an unknown, is the sample variation at the differing levels. A BVer is not a Plossl... in fact, i'd dare say it way surpasses an Ethos for optical complexity... and places for things to go askew! With the "premium" units, they're probably almost ALL at the same level of quality... with the WO/Orion/import-type units there's probably a greater degree of variance- some being quite good, other units having issues. Some have reported similar issues with the Baader low-end BVers, too.

So those who rant about their excellent results with the WO-type BVers- perhaps their samples are excellent, and thereby represent a fairly "hot" deal on the matter. Yet another may take their word & buy a set for themselves, and end up with a not-so-great sample.

This is just my guess to account for the wide variety of reports seen on these forums re: the WO-type BVers... a variance we don't so much see with the "premium" units.

Similar discussions occur frequently in the "Reflectors" forum, re: buying "stock" Dobs with import mirrors, versus investing in "premium" mirrors- so you KNOW you are getting quality, rather than taking pot-luck.

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Derwin Skotch
super member

Reged: 03/11/05

Loc: PA, USA

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: Mike B]
#4836836 - 09/30/11 10:42 PM

These look interesting

http://www.siebertoptics.com/SiebertOptics-blacknightbinoviewers.html

I have a Siebert Echelon 35 and have used his previous 20 mm Black Night and they are very good.

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mike bacanin
Carpal Tunnel

Reged: 03/19/07

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

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[Re: Derwin Skotch]
#4839862 - 10/02/11 05:37 PM

After doing more digging, it seems the Skywatcher Bino is the same as the WO, but with self centring diopters. Surely this is better than the WO set screw? I keep hearing how WO owners have to put their ep's in loose to avoid the setscrew slightly tipping the eyepiece, and causing merge issues.

Mike

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Doug Culbertson
Post Laureate

Reged: 01/06/05

Re: Does a Modest 1.25" BV Exist? new

new

[Re: mike bacanin]
#4839954 - 10/02/11 06:21 PM

The WOs use a compression ring; that's what the set screws are for. Just like with most diagonals these days. I have not had to put my eyepieces into the WO binos loosely and have noticed no collimation issues at all. FWIW, some people will tell you that you can't go above 150x with the WO, but I have used 235x with no issues.

BTW, have you heard these issues from actual WO bino users? I ask because some comments that I have heard sound like second or third hand information.

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