JSnuff1
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Reged: 12/29/04
Loc: NY
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DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
#5201995 - 05/02/12 02:17 PM
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Im trying to piece together my new imaging setup, and it will require some camera lenses for wider field shots I'm planning on taking.
Choosing a telescope is rather easy, as they are designed for this stuff, but choosing the right camera lens for astrophotgraphy is a whole other ball game. I don't want to end up shelling 500-1000 for a fix focal length lens that I find out later was the wrong choice for the application.
Let me start off by what kind of setup I'm looking for.
First I bought a Cannon 60Da, which will be my main imaging camera. It will be paired with my William Optics 110 FLT @ 770mm for all my deep sky object imaging. Obviously these will be imaged on my Equatorial Mount.
Now I want two more lenses, one for wider field shots that can shoot whole constellations and very large and wide nebulosities. Here Im thinking a lens around 100mm should do the trick. Most of these will be imaged on an equatorial mount as well.
The second lens I want a really wide angle where I can do terrestrial+night sky shots. I also plan on experimenting with night sky time lapse imagery with this lens. These will just be imaged on a fixed tripod (so I have to factor in time before star trailing is an issue). For this I'm thinking a 20-28mm.
Now in terms of the lens speed should I just grab the fastest lens I can find in that category? Obviously bigger aperture means more light which is what we need for astro images. Ive read though that the larger the aperture the worse coma is for these lenses, and that I would have to stop it down either way if I want a usable image. So would I be wasting my money with a F/1.4 lens and I should just go for the f/2 instead?
Any suggestions/feedback would be greatly appreciated. Feel free to list the two lens you guys would get for these applications.
Thanks!
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Maverick199
Postmaster
Reged: 02/27/11
Loc: India
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: JSnuff1]
#5202008 - 05/02/12 02:22 PM Attachment (56 downloads)
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That nifty fifty is a neat lens for really wide field AP but make sure your site is nowhere near light sources as it can gobble up light fast. At F/4 I find shooting with this fun. Here's an image I too last week which one of the forum members helped process a bit.
I am sure there are other lenses like 70-200 or 18-135mm which can work well.
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luigis
super member
Reged: 07/27/10
Loc: Buenos Aires, Argentina
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: Maverick199]
#5202081 - 05/02/12 03:00 PM
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Hi,
Yours are good questions.
Astrophotography is hard on lenses,only a few are usable wide open and most of them need to be stpped down 1 or 2 stops. Some lenses have bad comma or CA. Others are better.
So about your questions.
You still want a luminous lens, if a lens has to be stopped down 1 stop to work nicely a F1.4 stopped to F2 is still brighter than an F2 lens stopped to F2.8.
In the 100mm range the "top" choices would be the 100mm macro F2.8 (old version or new L version) and the 135mm F2. Both are usable wide open, very sharp and with little or no distortion of stars near the borders.
The 90mmm F2.8 TSE is also very good.
On the wide end it's much more difficult. The 17-40 and 16-35 both have bad borders. The Nikon 14-24 with adapter is superb but very expensive.
Two nice options are the Samyang 14mm F2.8 and 35mm F1.4 both are manual lenses, no problem for Astro, both are sharp. For the 14mm I've seen differences between copies.
Hope this helps
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terry59
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 07/18/11
Loc: Colorado, USA
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: JSnuff1]
#5202118 - 05/02/12 03:17 PM
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Here's a link to lens reviews. I use Nikkor so I've never looked at Canon but many of the Nikkor lenses are tested to see where the sweet spot is. The tests are terrestrial but should help.
I presonally would recommend this, this, and this for Nikkor.
Get some step down rings and use your light pollution filter with the lenses.
Edit: The rings will help with bright stars when you are stopped down too
Edited by terry59 (05/02/12 03:22 PM)
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Falcon-
Post Laureate
Reged: 09/11/09
Loc: Gambier Island, BC, Canada
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: JSnuff1]
#5202164 - 05/02/12 03:42 PM
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As Maverick199 said the "Nifty 50" is indeed a good lens - very sharp and good performance to the edges when stopped down. I personally use the EF 50mm f/1.8 II. Best of all... it is very inexpensive. I tend to use it stopped down to f/4 or f/4.5.
Beyond that... well you can spend a LOT of money if you want - I know for example my friend's Canon EF 300mm f/4.0 L IS USM performs very well wide open, but of course you pay for the privilege (well not me, I just borrowed it :P).
Good as it is though of course to use it I turn off autofocus and turn off image stabilization and set the aperture value manually... so why not just get an older manual lens? I was able to get a used Tair-3 300mm f/4.5 that performs very well at f/6.7 for 1/10th the cost of the Canon 300 L f/4.
In fact for less then the cost of the Canon 300 L f/4 I got:
- JML 28mm f2.8 M42 mount (quite good)
- Pentacon 135 f/2.8 M42 mount (reasonable but my sample needs internal cleaning and aperture repair)
- Super Takumar 200 f/4 M42 mount (reasonable but has some CA)
- Tair-3 300 f/4.5 M42 mount (very good)
Add the Nifty-50 to that list and I have quite a bit of choice in framing for very little money.
The Nikon 180-ED can also be converted to Canon and I know quite a few people on the forums here have used that with good results.
Quote:
Now in terms of the lens speed should I just grab the fastest lens I can find in that category?
Instead of worrying about aperture I would instead look for reviews or samples on the web and find the *sharpest* lens. Nearly all lenses need to be stopped down to find the sweet spot in sharpness/optical correction - the 50mm f/1.8 being the perfect example of horrible wide-open performance and excellent f/4 performance.
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JSnuff1
sage
Reged: 12/29/04
Loc: NY
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: terry59]
#5202172 - 05/02/12 03:48 PM
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Awesome thanks for the info thats give me a bunch to look into.
Now in terms of the f-stop...will a f/1.4 lens stopped down to f/2 give the exact same image as an f/2 lens? Or will the f/2 lens give a more distorted image because its wide open?
I don't see how a f/2 lens would not give a good image if an f/1.4 lens stopped down to f/2 does. They both have the exact same focal length and aperture so unless something weird is going on with the optics then the image should be the same...
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Falcon-
Post Laureate
Reged: 09/11/09
Loc: Gambier Island, BC, Canada
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: JSnuff1]
#5202256 - 05/02/12 04:32 PM
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Quote:
Now in terms of the f-stop...will a f/1.4 lens stopped down to f/2 give the exact same image as an f/2 lens? Or will the f/2 lens give a more distorted image because its wide open?
Depends entirely on the design of the specific lens.
Unfortunately that means there is no set rule... Each lens must be evaluated differently and each has a separate sweet-spot.
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pfile
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 06/14/09
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: Falcon-]
#5202296 - 05/02/12 05:00 PM
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the canon 200 f/2.8L ("primepipe") is a great lens for astrophotography. i stop mine down to f/4 but i think others have used it wide open with success.
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fco_star
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 12/13/10
Loc: Texas, Midland
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: pfile]
#5202433 - 05/02/12 06:10 PM
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Nikkor 2.8 180mm ED with an adapter is the best option for me
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Erk1024
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 07/06/11
Loc: Henderson, NV
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: fco_star]
#5202521 - 05/02/12 06:57 PM
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Jerry Lodriguss has a good article on lenses and which f-stops to use 'em at. HERE
The Tair-3c is fun and sharp even though you have to stop it down to f/5.6. (This is no different from more expensive lenses.) Try using the nifty 50 at f/1.8--holy elongated stars! The Nikon 180mm ED AIS (as others have mentioned) is also good. You can use Nikon lenses on your Canon with an inexpensive adapter.
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archer1960
sage
Reged: 07/26/11
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: Erk1024]
#5202659 - 05/02/12 08:07 PM
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Tokina 11-16 f/2.8
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Planemo
sage
Reged: 08/07/10
Loc: Alabama Gulf Coast
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: JSnuff1]
#5202662 - 05/02/12 08:08 PM
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Here is another EF 50mm f/1.8 II Nifty Fifty image, I just bought it a few weeks ago and just got 1 image with it in bad conditions, it's a light bucket and I had to shoot f/4.5 and only 40 sec. at 400 iso to keep from blowing out, but I think it did pretty well.
Milky Way around M18
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Erk1024
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 07/06/11
Loc: Henderson, NV
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: Planemo]
#5202783 - 05/02/12 09:31 PM
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Cool image Planemo! I like it. How fun. I think f/4.5 is the happy f-stop on that lens. Nice work.
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Samir Kharusi
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 06/14/05
Loc: Oman
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: JSnuff1]
#5202868 - 05/02/12 10:42 PM
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These are the lenses I use(d) for astro (all primes) and my comments as regards making A3-sized prints from either a full 35mm format or a crop Canon DSLR. Once you get a decent A3-sized print, you can basically go to any larger size since you stand further back to view it. My max print sizes have been 4ftx6ft, example:
Tamron 14mm/2.8. Works very well at f4 but you have to edit star shapes along the edges. Thereafter you can make any size prints you wish. My max was 4ftx6ft.
Canon 28mm/2.8 and Canon 28mm/1.8. Both have to be used at f5.6
Canon 50mm/1.8 and Canon 50mm/1.4. Both have to be used at f4
Canon 100mm/2.8macro USM. Use wide open
Canon 200mm/2.8L II. Use wide open
Canon 400mm/5.6L. Use wide open
Canon 600mm/4.0L IS. Use wide open
Example pics can be seen here. I also have a couple of comparos between seriously priced astroimaging APOs and a couple of the above lenses on my website below. For my $ I would opt for camera lenses each time, but at around 600mm focal length nothing beats a Hyperstar (mated to a crop DSLR, not suitable for full 35mm format). Got rid of my Canon 600mm/4.0L IS and settled on a C14 Hyperstar (675mm/1.9).
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ChrisBeere
professor emeritus
Reged: 10/20/10
Loc: London, UK
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: Samir Kharusi]
#5203677 - 05/03/12 12:17 PM
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My personal favourites are the Canon 200 for close ups and the Nikon 14-24 for wide field.
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JSnuff1
sage
Reged: 12/29/04
Loc: NY
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: ChrisBeere]
#5203998 - 05/03/12 03:00 PM
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I also have a question on the 60Da and daytime photography. I see there are filters you can get that hook up in front of the imaging chip and before the lens, are there any screw on filters that can be added to the thread in front of the lens?
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Falcon-
Post Laureate
Reged: 09/11/09
Loc: Gambier Island, BC, Canada
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: JSnuff1]
#5204081 - 05/03/12 03:43 PM
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Yes, though it can get expensive quick to try and match all the sizes of camera filter sizes you might have doing it lens-front method. That is why the clip-in filters are appealing, they will work regardless of the lens or telescope the camera is attached to. Downside is that they do not work with most EF-S lenses because those lenses stick into the camera body too far. (all EF lenses work though)
If the lens aperture is small enough you can use telescope 2" filter (48mm?) filters in front of your lens with a step-down ring, that way you can also use those same filters when imaging at prime focus.
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JSnuff1
sage
Reged: 12/29/04
Loc: NY
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: Falcon-]
#5204168 - 05/03/12 04:25 PM
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Where can I find the front IR/UV filter for the 60Da...been looking around and can't find one.
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Falcon-
Post Laureate
Reged: 09/11/09
Loc: Gambier Island, BC, Canada
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: JSnuff1]
#5204264 - 05/03/12 05:17 PM
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Hmm... you should not *need* a UV/IR filter for the 60Da. If it was a full-spectrum mod, sure, but the 60Da has a UV/IR filter integrated.
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zAmbonii
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 01/19/08
Loc: Ypsilanti, MI
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Re: DSLR Camera Lenses for Astrophotgraphy
[Re: JSnuff1]
#5204599 - 05/03/12 09:12 PM
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Quote:
Where can I find the front IR/UV filter for the 60Da...been looking around and can't find one.
Are you looking for a filter to take normal pictures (w/o a custom white balance)? Maybe this is what you are looking for: http://www.optcorp.com/product.aspx?pid=845-11799
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