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Equipment Discussions >> Electronically Assisted Astronomy

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ccs_hello
Postmaster
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Reged: 07/03/04

Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD new [Re: Moromete]
      #5675397 - 02/12/13 08:33 AM

Please use the other guiding thread or start a new thread on this severely off topic discussion.
P.S. not any CCTV videocam, but only on long exposure capable videocam. Also, the autoguide software has to be configured differently to capture in the right time interval. Rather involved and not optimal at all.


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svrider1000
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Reged: 06/28/12

Loc: Sylmar, California
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD *DELETED* new [Re: mattflastro]
      #5680079 - 02/14/13 07:20 PM Attachment (63 downloads)

Here is a quick video I took last night. I sort of took a small part and looped it a few times. I also added an image. These are not stacked at all.

Test Video of Orion Nebula with XLT 150 and LN-300 CCD camera

Edited by svrider1000 (02/14/13 07:22 PM)


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astrojunkie52
journeyman


Reged: 03/08/08

Loc: Pennsylvania USA
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: Hemmi]
      #5690058 - 02/20/13 12:48 AM

Hemmi,

I bought the wireless remote. What gets connected to the TX on the camera, the + or - from the dome controller?

Can you be more detailed on what keys controls the OSD?


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astrojunkie52
journeyman


Reged: 03/08/08

Loc: Pennsylvania USA
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: astrojunkie52]
      #5690407 - 02/20/13 09:03 AM

Played with camera and have wireless remote working. + on dome controller goes to RX on camera, - goes to TX. Go to settings in camera and confirm camera ID is 1 and baud rate should be 9600.

Power up wireless remote and it should display either A001 or P001. Hold down red Setup button for at least 3 seconds and display will change to d 24 which is the current baud rate. Use the right arrow button to scroll through settings until 96 is displayed then press Enter. A001 will now be displayed and 9600 baud rate will be set.

The Iris Open button behaves as Enter key and the arrow buttons behave as Up, Down, Right, and Left.


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svrider1000
super member
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Reged: 06/28/12

Loc: Sylmar, California
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: astrojunkie52]
      #5691989 - 02/20/13 11:33 PM

Astro,

What camera is this remote working for. Is this for the larger Sony camera?


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mattflastro
Vendor - Astrovideo Systems


Reged: 07/31/09

Loc: Brevard County , FL
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: svrider1000]
      #5692156 - 02/21/13 03:09 AM

Quote:

Astro,

What camera is this remote working for. Is this for the larger Sony camera?



Any camera that uses PElco-D over RS485 . Lntech for example (the large one).
The same codes that are used by the remote could be sent from a computer (if you use a frame grabber ) .
There is software available which allows pc remote control of PElco-D cameras , see this post http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=VAA&Nu... .


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telfish
sage
*****

Reged: 11/17/10

Loc: Adirondack Mountains NY
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: mattflastro]
      #5692368 - 02/21/13 08:59 AM

Will this work for the smaller camera?

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mattflastro
Vendor - Astrovideo Systems


Reged: 07/31/09

Loc: Brevard County , FL
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: telfish]
      #5693046 - 02/21/13 04:17 PM

Quote:

Will this work for the smaller camera?



The smaller Lntech camera uses the same imaging board as the large one but a different interface board.
It does not have the RS485 connections to the outside world, although its DSP has the necessary firmware.
out of the box the small cam can't be remote controlled over rs485.


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astrojunkie52
journeyman


Reged: 03/08/08

Loc: Pennsylvania USA
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: svrider1000]
      #5695995 - 02/23/13 02:36 AM

LN-320-11673

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astrojunkie52
journeyman


Reged: 03/08/08

Loc: Pennsylvania USA
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: mattflastro]
      #5696002 - 02/23/13 02:50 AM

Quote:

Any camera that uses PElco-D over RS485 . Lntech for example (the large one).
The same codes that are used by the remote could be sent from a computer (if you use a frame grabber ) .
There is software available which allows pc remote control of PElco-D cameras , see this post http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=VAA&Nu... .




Matt,

Checked the link. Would you use HyperTerminal to send the hex codes?

The PTZ Controller software also looks like it will do the job. Wish it was less than $69.


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mattflastro
Vendor - Astrovideo Systems


Reged: 07/31/09

Loc: Brevard County , FL
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: astrojunkie52]
      #5696347 - 02/23/13 10:53 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Any camera that uses PElco-D over RS485 . Lntech for example (the large one).
The same codes that are used by the remote could be sent from a computer (if you use a frame grabber ) .
There is software available which allows pc remote control of PElco-D cameras , see this post http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=VAA&Nu... .




Matt,

Checked the link. Would you use HyperTerminal to send the hex codes?

The PTZ Controller software also looks like it will do the job. Wish it was less than $69.



I suppose you could use hyperterminal although I haven't tried.
I used this:
http://www.commfront.com/232default.htm


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John59
professor emeritus


Reged: 11/06/11

Loc: Round Rock,TX
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: mattflastro]
      #5698152 - 02/24/13 12:04 PM Attachment (112 downloads)

Here is a snapshot of the spindle galaxy with my unmodded mini NTech. (commercial IR filter is removed)
This was through a C11 with 6.3 reducer at 1024 integration.

Matt I would be interested in how this looks with your modded camera.

Edited by John59 (02/24/13 12:05 PM)


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mattflastro
Vendor - Astrovideo Systems


Reged: 07/31/09

Loc: Brevard County , FL
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: John59]
      #5698832 - 02/24/13 07:47 PM Attachment (75 downloads)

Quote:

Here is a snapshot of the spindle galaxy with my unmodded mini NTech. (commercial IR filter is removed)
This was through a C11 with 6.3 reducer at 1024 integration.

Matt I would be interested in how this looks with your modded camera.



For now it would look like the attached picture.
I'm waiting for a good moment .
Just a note about the IR cut filter on the LNtech cameras. There are 2 types of IR cut filters that can be shipped with the cameras, a 670nm and an 850nm .
I believe the 850nm is for low light IR illuminator applications . This one seems ok to not remove . The 670nm should be removed .
In order to figure out which one you have, the simplest thing is to shine a TV or other appliance IR remote at the camera and see either a blinding light (indicating you have the 850nm filter) or nothing (you have the 670nm ).
Some of the cameras came with a version of the OSD menu that allows you to select which IR cut filter you have (the DSP will calculate the white balance slightly differently depending on the selected filter) .


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John59
professor emeritus


Reged: 11/06/11

Loc: Round Rock,TX
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: mattflastro]
      #5698850 - 02/24/13 07:59 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Here is a snapshot of the spindle galaxy with my unmodded mini NTech. (commercial IR filter is removed)
This was through a C11 with 6.3 reducer at 1024 integration.

Matt I would be interested in how this looks with your modded camera.



For now it would look like the attached picture.
I'm waiting for a good moment .
Just a note about the IR cut filter on the LNtech cameras. There are 2 types of IR cut filters that can be shipped with the cameras, a 670nm and an 850nm .
I believe the 850nm is for low light IR illuminator applications . This one seems ok to not remove . The 670nm should be removed .
In order to figure out which one you have, the simplest thing is to shine a TV or other appliance IR remote at the camera and see either a blinding light (indicating you have the 850nm filter) or nothing (you have the 670nm ).
Some of the cameras came with a version of the OSD menu that allows you to select which IR cut filter you have (the DSP will calculate the white balance slightly differently depending on the selected filter) .




I hear you Matt. Last winter we had 25 clear nights between Dec and Jan. This this year...1. So far Feb has been better, clear and steady 5 nights so far.


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Moromete
professor emeritus


Reged: 02/15/12

Loc: Romania
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: John59]
      #5700143 - 02/25/13 04:10 PM

Matt, are you modding the Lntech cameras with Super HAD II or Exview II sensor?

Secondly, are you using the bigger or the smaller Lntech model to put Peltier cooling on it?

PS: Put some dame photos with the modded camera to cool us down a little.


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Live_Steam_Mad
sage


Reged: 07/24/07

Loc: Moss Bank, St.Helens, England
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: Moromete]
      #6121288 - 10/06/13 08:54 PM

Hi, I fancy getting this 40 GBP smaller version camera shortly.

There was mention of the camera defaulting to black and white ? If I set Sens up to OFF and the AGC to OFF and Lens to electric between x32 and x1024, does the camera stay in color all the time? Do I have manual control over the white balance whilst it does this?

I would like to know please what is the source of the noise that the pix have, even when switching the camera on and using it straight away from ambient temp? Is it the on chip amp? The readout amp? Another amp. chip after that? The 1/3" chip itself?

Any news on those 1/2" cameras with the new Super HAD CCD 2 and Ex View HAD 2 yet?

Regards,

Alistair G.

Edited by Live_Steam_Mad (10/06/13 08:57 PM)


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ccs_hello
Postmaster
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Reged: 07/03/04

Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: Live_Steam_Mad]
      #6121841 - 10/07/13 08:11 AM

Alistair,

For detailed discussion on image sensor noise analysis including noise sources, please read Prof. Craig Stark's article series "Fishing for Photons" shown in Cloudy Night's home page:
http://www.cloudynights.com/index.php

Videocams, just like any other types of imaging devices, are depend on image sensors thus are subject to the same evaluation criteria and constraints.

Clear Skies!

ccs_hello


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barbarosa
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 04/11/10

Loc: "lamorinda", CA
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: Live_Steam_Mad]
      #6122490 - 10/07/13 01:35 PM

Quote:

There was mention of the camera defaulting to black and white ? If I set Sens up to OFF and the AGC to OFF and Lens to electric between x32 and x1024, does the camera stay in color all the time?




Yes

Quote:

Do I have manual control over the white balance whilst it does this?




Yes


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Live_Steam_Mad
sage


Reged: 07/24/07

Loc: Moss Bank, St.Helens, England
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: mattflastro]
      #6501030 - 05/01/14 07:33 PM

Quote:

I've been playing for the past couple of weeks with both the small and the large versions of the LNTECH cameras.

- in manual frame integration mode (sense-up off, lens manual, x2 to x1024 ) , the 3D noise reduction set to ON does a frame stacking or several frames interpolation of sorts . It stacks several consecutive long integration frames .
This brings the benefits of stacking such as better signal to noise but one big problem. Because the stacking is blind, without a frame alignment algorithm , the mount must track well for a much longer period of time . Instead of good tracking for the up to 17sec (x1024) , now it is several times the 17seconds. That means a good or at least decent polar mount .





Can I use the X2 to X1024 with 3D-DNR=OFF on these 2 cameras? And have NO frame stacking, just a complete refresh for every new frame?

Regards,

Alistair G.

Edited by Live_Steam_Mad (05/01/14 07:34 PM)


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Live_Steam_Mad
sage


Reged: 07/24/07

Loc: Moss Bank, St.Helens, England
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 [Re: Live_Steam_Mad]
      #6503099 - 05/02/14 08:46 PM

Well, someone PM'ed me (not sure if I am allowed to say who, but many Thanks to the person who messaged me, I appreciare it) anyway here is the info ;-

"the answer to your question (if you can use 3D-DNR off and set sens-up off, shutter manual x2 to x1024) is yes, you can use it like that." [Oh good, no more blurring due to non-aligned stacking of frames that the camera does with 3D-DNR activated]

"There is a catch, if you use it like that and AGC is not set to OFF, the camera will quickly lose color and the image will become B&W, even if you set it to color in the Day/night submenu." [Oh dear, OK then we will use AGC=OFF then, and the camera automatically will use a fixed small-ish 6dB gain (even though we just set AGC=OFF, this behaviour has been noted previously in these 2 small and large cameras).

"The only way the camera output remains color is if AGC is also OFF , which unfortunately makes the camera about 100 times less sensitive than AGC =HIGH and 3D-DNR =ON." [I assume this is because AGC=OFF applies a small 6dB fixed gain whereas AGC=HIGH applies a lot of gain]

"A 20sec (x1024) integration with AGC off generates the same image as a 0.2 sec with AGC on and 3D-DNR set to 5."

...so basically this is more sensitive than both the Samnsung SDC435 and SCB 2000, and a lot cheaper, but the gain has to be kept low on the unmodded camera (unless your tracking is very good indeed), which either lengthens integration times greatly, or you have to add more "gain" in Photoshop (which I would do by dragging the gamma curve upwards in the usual way) or in your video processing / capture software / hardware if you want live video.

What would be the best method to do this "gain" on the live image in software, for broadcasting on NSN, or can't that be done yet? I need the equivalent of about 30dB or so of software "gain" on the live video signal, I imagine, for use on DSO's?

Best Regards,

Alistair G.

Edited by Live_Steam_Mad (05/02/14 08:55 PM)


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