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Equipment Discussions >> Electronically Assisted Astronomy

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mattflastro
Vendor - Astrovideo Systems


Reged: 07/31/09

Loc: Brevard County , FL
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: Live_Steam_Mad]
      #6504069 - 05/03/14 12:34 PM

The problem is that you can't stretch 30dB , which is 5 bits, out of an 8 bit Directshow video histogram. It can be done with CCD imagers because they sample at 12 to 16 bits which become 7 to 11 after the 30dB digital gain. Doing the same to video would leave 3 bits!

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ccs_hello
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 07/03/04

Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: Live_Steam_Mad]
      #6504504 - 05/03/14 05:09 PM

Alistar,

As you might have noticed, many standard, out of the box cameras, such as this thread has been referring to, most likely have limitations. These are hard coded by the camera factories. In the most general statement, factory manufacturers worried about image quality. When it degrades the image quality too much, the factory setting simply won't allow to push it further.

View that bar as the "minimum S/N" allowed by the factory.

Can that bar be lowered to see "deep" while the image degradation is considered by the end-user as acceptable compromises? The answer is may be. Some mods firms just did that for astro purposes. Kudos to them. Naturally, do not expect S/N will be as good as the original camera factory is willing to give to you. If you are looking for that direction, this thread is not for you. It's about the original LNtech LN-300 or LN-320 devices. There are other threads discussing modified version of the cameras (mainly in vendor forums.) <-- gain fully manually adjustable.

Clear Skies!

ccs_hello

Edited by ccs_hello (05/03/14 06:02 PM)


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Live_Steam_Mad
sage


Reged: 07/24/07

Loc: Moss Bank, St.Helens, England
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: ccs_hello]
      #6504574 - 05/03/14 05:58 PM

Quote:

These are hard coded by the camera factories. In the most general statement, factory manufacturers worried about image quality. When it degrades the image quality too much, the factory setting simply won't allow to push it further.

View that bar as the "minimum S/N" allowed by the factory.

Can that bar be lowered to see "deep" while the image degradation is considered by the end-user as acceptable compromises? The answer is may be. Some mods firms just did that for astro purposes. Kudos to them. Naturally, do not expect S/N will be as good as the original camera factory is willing to give to you. If you are looking for that direction, this thread is not for you.





Curses Yes that is the direction I want to go in i.e. maximum manual control and flexibility out of the camera. If I can't have that then the standard unmodded LNTech camera isn't worth having IMHO. Oh well, time to start saving for a Mallincam JR PRO PC

Thanks for the answers.

Best Regards,

Alistair G.


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BigDob Al
super member


Reged: 12/31/13

Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: Live_Steam_Mad]
      #6504836 - 05/03/14 08:59 PM

Quote:

Quote:

These are hard coded by the camera factories. In the most general statement, factory manufacturers worried about image quality. When it degrades the image quality too much, the factory setting simply won't allow to push it further.

View that bar as the "minimum S/N" allowed by the factory.

Can that bar be lowered to see "deep" while the image degradation is considered by the end-user as acceptable compromises? The answer is may be. Some mods firms just did that for astro purposes. Kudos to them. Naturally, do not expect S/N will be as good as the original camera factory is willing to give to you. If you are looking for that direction, this thread is not for you.





Curses Yes that is the direction I want to go in i.e. maximum manual control and flexibility out of the camera. If I can't have that then the standard unmodded LNTech camera isn't worth having IMHO. Oh well, time to start saving for a Mallincam JR PRO PC

Thanks for the answers.

Best Regards,

Alistair G.



Alistair,
I am looking for the same exact thing as you, a camera with as much manual control as possible.
So far I could only find ONE camera vendor , Astro-Video Systems who is offering such cameras .
They have a $400 MK III camera with full manual gain control and manual black level control via standalone remote or computer .
They also have a cooled model but that's more money at $599, still less that a Jr PRo .
This is the cooled model APU-1 and has manual gain, manual black level, color saturation, gamma and a bunch of other adjustments all available to the user.
All other color cameras on the market have only AGC = automatic gain control.
They allow some user intervention to select a high/med/low value or other such system for the AGC range but in the end, it's always the camera who decides how much gain to apply, not the user.
That's why you have to wait for a few minutes for an image to stabilize every time you change the AGC setting .
You're right about the LN300 , I had one and it's almost impossible to control . It feels like it has great potential but couldn't be tapped due to the AGC issue.
If B&W is ok for you, there's Stellacam 2 , 3 or Watec 120 in its several versions , with great sensitivity but no color . It does have manual gain, integration, gamma and there's a cooled version (mucho dinero though).

Clear Skies,
Al


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Dwight J
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 05/14/09

Loc: Lethbridge, Alberta, Canada
Re: 17 sec (x1024) Camera Sony 960h Exview HAD CCD2 new [Re: BigDob Al]
      #6504940 - 05/03/14 10:05 PM

"They also have a cooled model but that's more money at $599, still less that a Jr PRo"

The choice there is between a cooled camera with a 1/3" chip or an uncooled camera with a 1/2" chip. If you live in a climate where nights are warm a cooled camera would be a wise choice.


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