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Equipment Discussions >> Mounts

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OzAndrewJ
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 11/30/10

Re: LX80 RA tracking new [Re: exparrot]
      #5316579 - 07/13/12 08:38 PM

Gday Kev/Jerry

Just for info, can you redo a dummy polar align
and then let it track as before.
Once stable, use a stethoscope, or put your ear against the scope housing, so you can hear the RA motor.
Does it sound like its running smoothly, or do you hear ragged or stop/start operation???
The system "should" reset/resend its speed every 2 seconds (IIRC )
so listen over about a 20 second interval.

Andrew


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dmdouglass
professor emeritus


Reged: 12/23/07

Loc: Tempe, AZ
Re: LX80 RA tracking new [Re: OzAndrewJ]
      #5316695 - 07/13/12 10:20 PM

Dennis.... your question was:
<<We might want to compare when Tom, David, Jerry, and Kevin got their mounts. Could the ones having the issue of slow RA in polar, all be mounts from the 2nd batch shipped?>>

My LX80 Ordered from OPT on June 20 - in stock and shipped that day (it came with the 6" SC), and received on June 20.

I am currently in travel status, and am now in Northern Arizona. It is more cloudy here than back home in Tempe, and its raining there !!! (Actually - it is raining here too.) So...... no visual opportunity. It will come.


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Tmohr36
member


Reged: 09/27/10

Loc: Nevada
Re: LX80 RA tracking new [Re: dmdouglass]
      #5316817 - 07/14/12 12:05 AM

Dennis,

I ordered a mount only back in December 2011, decided to just go for a full set up listed in-stock at OPT at the end of April. Mount and 8" SC arrived on May 2, 2012.

oh, and it's raining here too....probably got our annual accumulation today.

Edited by Tmohr36 (07/14/12 12:08 AM)


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exparrot
member
*****

Reged: 02/13/12

Loc: Dallas/Fort Worth, TX
Re: LX80 RA tracking new [Re: OzAndrewJ]
      #5316965 - 07/14/12 02:58 AM

Andrew

I did another indoor test and listened up against the underside of the mount since it was tilted for EQ. That's about the only spot I could hear anything. The drive noise was faint, but steady - no change in pitch, or anything like that.

I also had a small window of opportunity to go outside, so I hauled everything out to the backyard and set up for polar. Did the one-star, got Polaris aligned and then it selected Arcturus. The goto was close enough. I centered it in a 25mm EP (about 80x with the Meade 8" SC). 18 minutes later, it drifted totally out of view.

Jerry


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OzAndrewJ
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 11/30/10

Re: LX80 RA tracking new [Re: exparrot]
      #5316998 - 07/14/12 04:38 AM

Gday Jerry

Quote:

I did another indoor test and listened up against the underside of the mount since it was tilted for EQ. That's about the only spot I could hear anything. The drive noise was faint, but steady - no change in pitch, or anything like that.




Drat. That blows another guesstimate theory.
Did you happen to retry the goto after it had drifted out of view???
Just to see if it went back to target????

Andrew


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exparrot
member
*****

Reged: 02/13/12

Loc: Dallas/Fort Worth, TX
Re: LX80 RA tracking new [Re: OzAndrewJ]
      #5317569 - 07/14/12 02:25 PM

Hi Andrew

No, I didn't do another goto. The wind was knocked out of my sails when I saw the drift, so I was bummed. I practiced a couple of more polar aligns and then packed it in. That's a good question, though, so I'll do it next chance I get.

Jerry


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OzAndrewJ
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 11/30/10

Re: LX80 RA tracking new [Re: exparrot]
      #5317986 - 07/14/12 07:51 PM

Gday Dennis/Kev/Jerry

Just another thought.
I see a lot of photos have been posted on the LX80 Yahoo site
showing the guts of the units.
I like the worms etc in this beast :-)

However, i see they have a semi exposed encoder,
like in the LX90s.
I dont think it will help but it cant hurt, sooooooo.
Have you tried doing a calibrate motors???
I'm pretty sure it wont have much effect with this type of encoder, but doing the process will eliminate it from the possible causes.

Andrew


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Wigleydh
member


Reged: 10/26/07

Re: LX80 RA tracking new [Re: OzAndrewJ]
      #5318044 - 07/14/12 08:42 PM

Andrew,

Calibrate motors has been done multiple times, with no improvement. That first night it got done a couple of times. We started completely over a couple of times that night attempting to make sure we hadn't missed something. We've also redone the train the drive routine several times as well.

The gotos have been good just slow RA tracking.

Let us know if there is other stuff that might be done to help isolate what is happening.

I was planning on going to Kevin's house later to double check stuff again but I'm not sure that the clouds will cooperate - not looking good at the moment.


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OzAndrewJ
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 11/30/10

Re: LX80 RA tracking [Re: Wigleydh]
      #5318148 - 07/14/12 10:16 PM

Gday Dennis

I didnt think it would help, but it has to be done to prove it wasn't the cause.
I currently cant understand how it can run slow in one mode only
whilst still knowing where it is in both modes.
If i had access to one, the next step i would be doing is putting a logic analyser onto the motor cards, but thats not possible for remote users.
I guess if a few more people pop up and corroborate whats happening, its time for everyone to put it back on Meade.

Andrew


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Tmohr36
member


Reged: 09/27/10

Loc: Nevada
Re: LX80 RA tracking [Re: Starhawk]
      #5318179 - 07/14/12 10:42 PM

Quote:

This is progress! What was the focal length? What we want is image angular size per pixel. So that means figuring out how wide the field of view is in your telescope, then rotate the image to line up with a vertical or horizontal marker, then find the coordinates of high and low peaks and multiply by the angular size of the image width divided by the pixe size of the width.

Longer trails are needed, though. It's best if you can get three revolutions of the worm, and that makes it possible to see what the periodic element is.

-Rich




Rich,

this was taken with Meade's 8" SCT so that's 2034mm from info off Meade's site.

hmmm, 3 revs of the worm I don't know how long that would be. (21 minutes?) I'll try anything though, so as soon as the monsoonal moisture moves out of Vegas and those dark billowy things in the sky move away again, I'll give it another go.

I'll need to account for the 1.6x crop sensor in my camera too, right? or is that covered by finding how wide the FOV is in my telescope?

I would certainly love to find out what the PE is of this mount.

thanks for the guidance,


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TALK2KEV
sage


Reged: 03/08/06

Loc: Oklahoma
Re: LX80 RA tracking [Re: Tmohr36]
      #5318286 - 07/15/12 12:28 AM

Andrew

Dennis and I set up the LX80you was wanting to know what the motor sounds like. We recorded the sounds that the drive makes for two minuets.If you would PM me I'll send it to you.


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TALK2KEV
sage


Reged: 03/08/06

Loc: Oklahoma
Re: LX80 RA tracking [Re: TALK2KEV]
      #5318375 - 07/15/12 02:41 AM

Andrew / David
Digging around in the HBX we see Ra percent 10 and Dec percent 10 does anyone know what these setting do and how it works.


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OzAndrewJ
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 11/30/10

Re: LX80 RA tracking [Re: TALK2KEV]
      #5318387 - 07/15/12 02:55 AM

Gday Kev

No need to send a file of the noise,
i was more interested in if the motors were intermittently stopping while polar, hence giving the perceived slowdown, whilst still maintaining correct encoder counts.
To get a 50% slowdown in tracking, these stops would be easily heard.

As to percentages, when you do a drive train, the scope measures the amount of slop in the geartrain on reversing direction.
The percentage tells the system how much of this to apply as a rapid burst, with the residual being melded into the tracking until it's all used up.
For RA guiding in Polar, it's irrelevant, as the motors never reverse,
but in AltAz or DEC in Polar, correct percentage setting can assist in how long it takes to reverse direction at low speeds.

Andrew


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TALK2KEV
sage


Reged: 03/08/06

Loc: Oklahoma
Re: LX80 RA tracking [Re: TALK2KEV]
      #5318389 - 07/15/12 03:02 AM Attachment (33 downloads)

Also I noticed the saddle has a wider gap for the dovetail plate which it pushes the OTA off axis by a 1/4" so if you are on the east side meridian pointing north at Polaris during alignment now you go to shot something in the south on the west side your error in OTA over axis will be a 1/2" off.Using a F/7 80mm as our primary Scope it has a nice FOV someone with a longer focal length OTA this is going to be more critical. Dennis and I was talking about using some flat stock Aluminum 1/8 thick to center the OTA above the axis.

Edited by TALK2KEV (07/15/12 11:45 PM)


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Starhawk
Space Ranger
*****

Reged: 09/16/08

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: LX80 RA tracking [Re: TALK2KEV]
      #5318916 - 07/15/12 01:52 PM

Movement parallel to the axis doesn't cause error in finding polaris on this scale. You'd need to be off a distance close to the diameter of earth's orbit to cause the parallax to be wrong.

-Rich


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Starhawk
Space Ranger
*****

Reged: 09/16/08

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: LX80 RA tracking new [Re: Starhawk]
      #5319993 - 07/16/12 10:05 AM

I do have to say though, that's the crudest looking dovetail clamp I've seen come from a major manufacturer.

-Rich


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jmiele
Patron Saint?
*****

Reged: 12/04/10

Re: LX80 RA tracking [Re: Starhawk]
      #5319999 - 07/16/12 10:08 AM

Quote:

I do have to say though, that's the crudest looking dovetail clamp I've seen come from a major manufacturer.

-Rich





+1


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mclewis1
Thread Killer
*****

Reged: 02/25/06

Loc: New Brunswick, Canada
Re: LX80 RA tracking [Re: jmiele]
      #5320248 - 07/16/12 12:32 PM

From that picture it looks like the saddle and the mounting point (cylinder) are a single piece. Am I seeing things or is that really a single piece casting?

If so that means that you can't replace the saddle if you wanted to use something better or larger. I would have expected the saddle to be bolted to a flat surface at the top of the shaft.



Edited by mclewis1 (07/16/12 06:36 PM)


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rmollise
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 07/06/07

Re: LX80 RA tracking [Re: mclewis1]
      #5320459 - 07/16/12 02:13 PM

Well, that's kind of a bummer, but you can use a Vixen-Losmandy adapter to allow Losmandy format dovetails to be used, at least.

I do hope all this (LX80) turns out OK, because a mount of this type would be a boon for me.

If not, well there's the Synta AZ EQ-6... If they would hurry up and release the cotton picking thing stateside it might be a better fit for me anyhow.

Edited by rmollise (07/16/12 02:16 PM)


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jmiele
Patron Saint?
*****

Reged: 12/04/10

Re: LX80 RA tracking [Re: rmollise]
      #5320488 - 07/16/12 02:28 PM

I agree Uncle Rod. As I posted in another thread, I think they should have put all their energy into this design and made it robust, and work super accurately. It could have been a game changer.

Best,
Joe


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