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lighttrap
Reged: 02/06/04
Posts: 3833
Loc: cloudy, foggy, humid NC, US
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Hello all,
I wanted my first post on this site, and this forum to be something that EdZ could directly relate to, and something that hopefully all will someday relate to. In a nutshell, I'm looking for suggestions for extremely inexpensive binoculars that are still capable performers on the nightsky for use as loaners and demonstrations of what can be accomplished extremely inexpensively.
Those of you who may know me from other forums may wonder why somebody that's owned way too many binoculars, and tested way too many more than that number would even be interested in the very low end spectrum of binoculars. But the truth is that I'm seeking as much info as is reasonable, in pursuit of:
Binoculars for use as public demos
Binos for kids
Binos for the extremely cash strapped
Generally, I recommend porro prism binos in the $150-$250 US range as being the best merger of price/performance etc. However, for this mission, I'm specifically ONLY interested in binos that can be obtained for less than $50-$75 that have been actually found to be adequate performers on the nightsky. This is a whole area of the retail market that I really know very little about.
Unfortunately, the local Walmart has apparently stopped selling the $20-$25 Simmons Red Line 10x50s that I most wanted for this particular project. So, I'm looking for other suggestions based on what folks have actually tried and had success with.
I would be very interested in hearing what very inexpensive binoculars work well for an assortment of folks of all ages and all ability levels for specific handheld use on the nightsky. Yeah, tall order, I know, but I've done something like this with birding, and think that there have to be parallel solutions for el cheapo astronomy just to get 'em hooked.
Thanks, and hello to EdZ, Kenny, Erik and everybody else,
Mike Swaim
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18" Starsplitter II f/4.5
8" Hardin Dob f/6
C5 workhorse mini SCT f/10 or f/6.3
70mm TV Ranger dual purpose birding/astro
77mm Leica Televid APO
16x70 Fujinons on UA Deluxe Mt.
12x50 Nikon SE
8x30 Nikon E2s
and many others
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Erik D
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 04/28/03
Posts: 2573
Loc: Central New Jersey, USA
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Hello Mike S,
I wanted to be the first one to welcome you here. I've been meaning to ask you to join us away from the forum you usually hang out....this way we can have free exchange of infomation about 'best buys' without fear of violating certain TOS. ;-)) As you can see, Prof Ed and Kenny J have been active here for quite a while. We have a lot of catching up to do and I look forward to it!
Erik D
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lighttrap
Reged: 02/06/04
Posts: 3833
Loc: cloudy, foggy, humid NC, US
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Thank you, Erik.
I've got to say that recent curmudgeonisms (now there's a word that oughta be!) and other such on the OTHER forum that we're not talking about has me looking for another home in much the same way that I fled Egroups when the yahooligans took over. TOS, POS, DOS, BOSS... I get them all confused.
Besides, I upgraded the browser on this antique that I post from, so that now I actually can post to this site for awhile. Imagine that.
Mike Swaim
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18" Starsplitter II f/4.5
8" Hardin Dob f/6
C5 workhorse mini SCT f/10 or f/6.3
70mm TV Ranger dual purpose birding/astro
77mm Leica Televid APO
16x70 Fujinons on UA Deluxe Mt.
12x50 Nikon SE
8x30 Nikon E2s
and many others
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Charlie Fisher
member
Reged: 06/28/03
Posts: 38
Loc: Tampa, FL USA
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Wow. That's a toughie. For birding 8X25 compact reverse porros can be had that are great for getting started, that clock in at under $75, and have serviceable optical performance, like the Eagle Optics Triumph and others. But aperture is so much more important for astronomical applications. No 8X25 will be particularly compelling for that purpose.
Gosh, I look forward to what everyone has to say. I figure we will be hearing about nonweatherproof 10X50 Bk-7 binoculars on super-special sale.
Like you said, I believe that Wal-Mart occasionally has bargain sales on bins like this sometimes. There is a fellow who posts on astronomy.com named John ("TrashAstronomer") who is really generous with bargain bins for youth and newbies and who sometimes posted on special bargains he was able find, and Wal-Mart was often a good source for him... the make and model were always at the whim of the Wal-Mart store purchasing agent, I believe! He would buy them 20 at a time and just give them away at star parties when he got a good enough deal.
Perhaps other discount retailers run into the same overstock problem occasonally. In any case, I think the trick is not necessarily to identify particular brands/ models, but to find the big sales at the retailer, if you know what I mean. Any collimated cheap 10X50 porro is a lot better than naked eye for observing, and would be welcome for someone who was trying to get started with no/ low budget.
You are embarked on a good hearted and generous project, it sounds like to me, and I wish you the best of luck.
Charlie
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Don25
professor emeritus
Reged: 10/20/03
Posts: 701
Loc: Delaware, U.S.A.
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Hey Mike, I don't know if this helps...but this Hunting/sportgear online store has great prices on lower-end (and also some upper-end) binoculars....
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/ctd/dept.asp?dept%5Fid=1801&category=Optics&dept%5Fname=Binoculars&mscssid=R707437FQK889JJ4LGD7NAG6GWG99J57
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edcannon
professor emeritus
Reged: 11/19/03
Posts: 679
Loc: Austin, Texas
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Very recently Phil Harrington started a thread on another forum about sub-$100 binoculars, which drew a fair number of replies:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/telescopes/message/95515
Ed Cannon - Austin, Texas, USA
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Ed Cannon - Austin, Texas, USA
As of 23 August 2008 - Celestron Skymaster 12x60
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KennyJ
Reged: 04/27/03
Posts: 10163
Loc: Lancashire UK
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Welcome to this forum Mike,
This place will be much the richer and wiser for your presence , knowledge and writing skills , should you find the time from all your other useful activities.
I am delighted to see you have already got some great and potentially very useful reponses to your initial query , which I agree sounds like a most honourable project that deserves success.
For your consideration , a couple of months ago I purchased a Bushnell 8 x 42 H2O waterprrof porro prism bino for one of my daughters , which I feel due to it's wide field and instant "easy -view" would be a very useful tool for a novice getting to know the constellations etc.
It would seem I paid a little "over the odds" for them here in the UK --because I believe they can be obtained for sub $50 in the US.
Hey -- they're not THAT bad, mate :-)
Regards and I greatly look forward to benefiting even more from your acquired wisdom and admirable willingness to speak your mind.
Kenny
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If everyone is thinking the same thing , no-one is thinking - General George S.Patton
Zeiss 7 x 42 BGAT
Captain's Helmsman 7 x 50
Nikon 10 x 42 Superior E
Swift Audubon Kestrel 10 x 50
Helios 15 x 70 Observation
Strathspey 20 x 90
Televue 76 APO
Zeiss 85 Diascope
Helios 102 f5 refractor
Various eyepieces barlows tripods mounts etc.
Panasonic Lumix DMC - TZ5 digital camera
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EdZ
Professor EdZ
Reged: 02/15/02
Posts: 12601
Loc: Cumberland, R I , USA42N71.4W
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Hi Mike,
Glad to see you're here.
Back in the fall, there was some info posted about a label named "Whitetails" available at the time on Amazon. I bought two pair 10x50s. They were single MgF coated, not every surface, 10x50 porros, typical barska style, $39.95 each. I tried them out before giving both pair away as presents. They were pretty decent. Did not see as much as a pair of Orion Ultraviews, but for $39, the view was pretty darn good.
My "table" binoculars at observing sessions I hold for schools include a variety of binocs. An old pair of 7x35 Minolta Standards, decent very wide fov, heavy, lot of distortion at edges. Had the Whitetails out for a while till Christmas came along. A pair of 7x35 Minolta Activas, best 7x35 I own, FMC, very wide fov, picked them up for ~$100 on Astromart. My Orion Ultraviews, 10x50s, great FMC, great view, kind of a funky right diopter lever. And my Swift Ultralite 8x42's, FMC, small compact with an IPD that can get small enough for a 6 year old kid.
Pete Rassmussen, a long time (past) contributor to the reviews here on CN, had been posting on google sci astro amatuer, deals of the day, places where inexpensive binocs could be found. Pete's very knowledgable about optics, if you happen to cross paths with him.
For those of you who don't know Mike yet, he's anything but a newbie. Six years ago, I was reading the "lighttrap" reviews on the internet to learn about binoculars!
edz
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Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21
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Charlie Fisher
member
Reged: 06/28/03
Posts: 38
Loc: Tampa, FL USA
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Mike, I note that the Nikon Action binocular series has been coming down in price of late. 7X50 and 8X40 models can be had for 69.99 at Eagle Optics. They are not bad at all, not for $70 anyway. I have an old 10X50 from this series and it is quite serviceable.
Charlie
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KennyJ
Reged: 04/27/03
Posts: 10163
Loc: Lancashire UK
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Mike,
Since I read your post yesterday , I've been doing a little research on where to find REALLY inexpensive but "apparantly useful" binos.
I found a company in the "tax -free" Channel Islands that seems to sell most things from hair -dryers to luxury yachts and they have a selection of binoculars , including some 8 x 40s , 10 x 50s, 12 x 50s and 16 x 50s the are selling for about US $10 each.
If all else fails -- send me a private message and I'll pass on the details ( have lost them temporarily due to an unforseable technical problem with my PC )
Regards -- Kenny.
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If everyone is thinking the same thing , no-one is thinking - General George S.Patton
Zeiss 7 x 42 BGAT
Captain's Helmsman 7 x 50
Nikon 10 x 42 Superior E
Swift Audubon Kestrel 10 x 50
Helios 15 x 70 Observation
Strathspey 20 x 90
Televue 76 APO
Zeiss 85 Diascope
Helios 102 f5 refractor
Various eyepieces barlows tripods mounts etc.
Panasonic Lumix DMC - TZ5 digital camera
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
Unfortunately, the local Walmart has apparently stopped selling the $20-$25 Simmons Red Line 10x50s that I most wanted for this particular project.
I just got home from Wallyworld, and ours still had a few of these left. So you might shop around at different stores.
Just curious are these going to be noticably visually inferior to most of the under $100 bins? Sure is cheap.
Edited by Kevin (02/08/04 07:36 PM)
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edcannon
professor emeritus
Reged: 11/19/03
Posts: 679
Loc: Austin, Texas
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Two sporting-good/outdoor chain stores here that have a pretty fair
selection of binoculars from inexpensive to costly are Oshmans and
Academy. Academy is in the SE USA only; I think Oshmans is more
widely spread. I would assume that all regions have comparable
stores. Both of these places have display cases with lots of
binoculars available to try out.
I also found that a gun/hunting store had a lot of binoculars,
although I think the prices were somewhat higher. The day I went
there, it was so busy that there was no hope of me trying any
out, and I really did want to look through Swarovskis and Leicas.
They did have some full-sized as low-priced as $80.
Ed Cannon - Austin, Texas, USA
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Ed Cannon - Austin, Texas, USA
As of 23 August 2008 - Celestron Skymaster 12x60
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Rusty
Postmaster
Reged: 08/06/03
Posts: 16419
Loc: Brooker, FL
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Anacortes has Celestron 8x21s on sale for $12.95. These are surprisingly decent little binocs (I have three pairs keep one in each of my vehicles plus one at home.)
http://www.buytelescopes.com/product.asp?pid=438
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N11GPS Fastar
TOA-130S
MK66 Std
Vintage C5
Megrez II 80mm ED Triplet APO
SolarMax 40
NJP Temma II
Sirius EQ-G
ST8XE/CFW-8(LRGBHa)/AO-7/DF-2/STV Dlx/ST237a/350D (Unmodded)/Mallincam Color Hyper Plus/DSI III Color/DSI II Pro
Two not-spoiled Golden Retrievers - Maggie and Casey
Sometimes I think we're alone in the universe, and sometimes I think we're not. In either case the idea is quite staggering. - Arthur C. Clarke
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Aquarianperry
sage
Reged: 02/01/04
Posts: 330
Loc: Durham, NC, USA
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A nice set of 10X50's at a low-low budget price are the Barska 10X50mm WA's. I'm not sure how you pro's might rate them but for me they are pretty good for quick glancing at the sky, I keep them in the car for quick views every once in a while when I find I'm in a dark location. Here's some quick spec's: The FOV on these are 367ft/1000yds, 4mm exit pupil, 12.7 eye relief, center screw for tripod mounting, light at 1.8 lbs. the bad thing about them would be the BK-7 prism glass but to me it doesn't hurt these binoculars that bad.
In my light polluted work parking lot they showed me a light dark grayness around M42 and produced a good number of stars around M45. The stars were crisp in the center view almost all the way to the edge where I got a little flaring and blurriness but not enough to mess up such a wonderful sight. The build is as solid and firm as the Barska 15X70's and fully coated blue optics looks the same as well. The price is right on target for someone to go real cheap, I got them for $17.97 from Sportsman's Guide ( http://www.sportsmansguide.com/cb/cb.asp?a=102363 ) and have seen them around the net for around that range up to $50. If considering these be careful though, it seems Barska has at least three versions of their 10X50's. The one's I've seen around the net are:
Model 50-1169 WA (the ones I own) - the fully blue coated WA's with a 367ft/1000yds FOV that have the same build/body as the popular 15X70's
Model 58-1269 WA - a fully ruby coated WA's with a 375ft/1000yds FOV and different type build/body
Model 50-1169 - a fully blue coated pair with a 300/1000 FOV with yet another build/body but the same model number as the blue coated WA's
if you can get them for below $20 each you shouldn't mind sampling a pair and if they don't work good for you wouldn't mind giving them away.
Hope this helps.
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Orion SVP8 "Brute"
Hardin 80/6 "Stella"
Orion Starmax 90 "Magnet"
Edited by Aquarianperry (02/11/04 01:00 AM)
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