Telescope Reviews: Using Nikons for AP

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Astrophotography and Sketching >> DSLR & Digital Camera Astro Imaging & Processing

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EyeSage
member

Reged: 06/08/12

Loc: Canukistan

Re: Using Nikons for AP new

new

[Re: SteveRosenow]
#5328272 - 07/21/12 01:12 PM

Around the time I got the D80 most of the talk about using current Nikons for AP was about an issue with extreme thermal noise that appeared as a magenta fog around the edges of long exposure images. The cause, at least according to the discussions at the time, was heat coming from the surrounding electronics leaking on to the sensor. This resulted in shots that look like this:

This is about an 11 minute single exposure and of course no kind of long exposure noise reduction has been used here (in this case I was making separate dark frames). I find there is so much noise and so little signal in these areas that I end up with artifacts when noise reduction is applied and I usually end up cropping unusable portions. I have a D70 that gives similar results. The issue is barely noticeable with exposures of say one minute, but adding a stack of shorter exposures stacks this fogging just the same.

I have no real issue with high ISO noise or other image quality shortcomings, but I still haven't been able to get a real sense of how current models compare in this respect under similar circumstances.

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EyeSage
member

Reged: 06/08/12

Loc: Canukistan

Re: Using Nikons for AP new

new

[Re: TimN]
#5328297 - 07/21/12 01:30 PM

Quote:

Check the Anna Morris review of the D7000 for AP.
http://www.eprisephoto.com/nikon-d7000.pdf

Thanks Tim, the dark frame example from the article really paints the picture. The dark frames from either of my cameras show the same magenta fog seen in the example photo in my previous post. Hers look like a sheet of black velvet that have accumulated a days worth of dust.

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ccs_hello
Postmaster

Reged: 07/03/04

Re: Using Nikons for AP new

new

[Re: EyeSage]
#5328379 - 07/21/12 02:40 PM

Nikon DSLR transitioned from using CCD sensors to CMOS image sensors in recent years. Thus the heavy-handed "processing" on sensor image, i.e., the bad habit of RAW is not raw, has changed a bit.
Later they started to open up their SDK for third party software, and the third party software vendors have dropped the price a bit.
The "everything else costs extra" practice has also changed a bit too.

So N will eventually get there. If APers' can gradually warm up. Time will tell...

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terry59
Carpal Tunnel

Reged: 07/18/11

Loc: Colorado, USA

Re: Using Nikons for AP new

new

[Re: EyeSage]
#5328424 - 07/21/12 03:20 PM

Quote:

Around the time I got the D80 most of the talk about using current Nikons for AP was about an issue with extreme thermal noise that appeared as a magenta fog around the edges of long exposure images. The cause, at least according to the discussions at the time, was heat coming from the surrounding electronics leaking on to the sensor. This resulted in shots that look like this:

This is about an 11 minute single exposure and of course no kind of long exposure noise reduction has been used here (in this case I was making separate dark frames). I find there is so much noise and so little signal in these areas that I end up with artifacts when noise reduction is applied and I usually end up cropping unusable portions. I have a D70 that gives similar results. The issue is barely noticeable with exposures of say one minute, but adding a stack of shorter exposures stacks this fogging just the same.

I have no real issue with high ISO noise or other image quality shortcomings, but I still haven't been able to get a real sense of how current models compare in this respect under similar circumstances.

I get that with my D50 but it disappears when I process the image. all images on my link below were done with the D50.

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EyeSage
member

Reged: 06/08/12

Loc: Canukistan

Re: Using Nikons for AP new

new

[Re: ccs_hello]
#5328465 - 07/21/12 03:46 PM

There was a point at which Canon was looking like it might become the only real choice for pro photographers after Nikon dominated the market in the pre-digital era. After Nikon changed their attitude in a number of areas (for example a fanatical commitment to their DX 1.5x format over 35mm size sensors) they started winning back Canon converts and claiming back market share pretty quickly. Once a reasonable case can be made that Nikon is at least a good a choice for AP as Canon I don't think it will take long for this to translate into purchases. I haven't visited the issue in years, but it's looking like they've gone further towards this than I had suspected.

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EyeSage
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Reged: 06/08/12

Loc: Canukistan

Re: Using Nikons for AP new

new

[Re: terry59]
#5328539 - 07/21/12 04:25 PM

Quote:

I get that with my D50 but it disappears when I process the image. all images on my link below were done with the D50.

Yes, once processed it's maybe not as horrible as I make it out to be. If I posted the processed image at this resolution you'd never know there was a thing wrong with it. It's easy to pixel peep in Photoshop and when I see artifacts on the full res image at 100% I can't tell myself the problem has disappeared. Any way you look at it though, it's still way better than working with film.
(Hope I didn't offend any film people there.)

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terry59
Carpal Tunnel

Reged: 07/18/11

Loc: Colorado, USA

Re: Using Nikons for AP new

new

[Re: EyeSage]
#5328634 - 07/21/12 05:54 PM

Quote:

Quote:

I get that with my D50 but it disappears when I process the image. all images on my link below were done with the D50.

Yes, once processed it's maybe not as horrible as I make it out to be. If I posted the processed image at this resolution you'd never know there was a thing wrong with it. It's easy to pixel peep in Photoshop and when I see artifacts on the full res image at 100% I can't tell myself the problem has disappeared. Any way you look at it though, it's still way better than working with film.
(Hope I didn't offend any film people there.)

Not offended here at all. If you can find issue on this image please point it out. It's full res...

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EyeSage
member

Reged: 06/08/12

Loc: Canukistan

Re: Using Nikons for AP new

new

[Re: terry59]
#5328692 - 07/21/12 06:39 PM

Maybe I just need to revisit what I'm doing to subtract noise.

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terry59
Carpal Tunnel

Reged: 07/18/11

Loc: Colorado, USA

Re: Using Nikons for AP new

new

[Re: EyeSage]
#5328765 - 07/21/12 07:27 PM

I think that Nikon gets slighted, and very unfairly. Today's tools are very satisfactory...

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SteveRosenow
sage

Reged: 07/10/12

Loc: Shelton, Washington

Re: Using Nikons for AP [Re: terry59]
#5329183 - 07/22/12 01:22 AM

Quote:

I think that Nikon gets slighted, and very unfairly. Today's tools are very satisfactory...

I will agree. Wholeheartedly.

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