mintaka77
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Reged: 09/12/11
Loc: Norwich, UK
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Advanced Star Atlas
#5363068 - 08/11/12 09:48 AM
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Hi there
Thanks to everyone who answered my eyepiece query last year - I got a new star diagonal and the refractor now works fine.
New question is, how to get really detailed star maps, more detailed than in my trust Sky Atlas 2000? I discovered that when trying to see the supernova in M39 (was it M39 - I forget) a few months ago. There are faint stars not in the star atlas, and one cannot then know if one is or is not seeing a supernova ... so presumably more advanced users obtain detailed maps of the area of sky of interest?
Thanks!
Mintaka.
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brianb11213
Postmaster
Reged: 02/25/09
Loc: 55.215N 6.554W
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Re: Advanced Star Atlas
[Re: mintaka77]
#5363075 - 08/11/12 09:56 AM
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I have a copy of Atlas Coeli 1950.0 but that only goes down to mag. 7.75.
These days I use Starry Night Pro which goes about as deep as my 11" SCT can comfortably get. If I need anything fainter than that I try to find Palomar Sky Survey images.
You identify variable stars by making a time sequence of estimated brightness over days, weeks, months or years ("light curves" they're called in variable star observer's jargon). As to whether the "new star" close to a galaxy is a supernova or a previously undiscovered eruptive variable which just happens to be in the line of sight, you need to obtain a spectrum - something which is still really in the professional domain so far as supernovae in distant galaxies are concerned as you're going to need to have upwards of 0.5 metres (20") of aperture as well as the spectrograph itself.
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Shawn H
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Reged: 05/16/07
Loc: Equatorial Guinea, West Africa
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Re: Advanced Star Atlas
[Re: mintaka77]
#5363143 - 08/11/12 10:48 AM
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Google: Willmann-Bell,Inc then click on celestial atlases then Urano Metria 2000.0. Stars down 9.75, and its modern! 
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Shawn H
Postmaster
Reged: 05/16/07
Loc: Equatorial Guinea, West Africa
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Re: Advanced Star Atlas
[Re: mintaka77]
#5363150 - 08/11/12 10:53 AM
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PS They have all kinds of astronomy books also that might interest you! 
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Tony Flanders
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Reged: 05/18/06
Loc: Cambridge, MA, USA
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Re: Advanced Star Atlas
[Re: mintaka77]
#5363157 - 08/11/12 10:58 AM
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Quote:
New question is, how to get really detailed star maps, more detailed than in my trust Sky Atlas 2000? I discovered that when trying to see the supernova in M39 (was it M39 - I forget) a few months ago. There are faint stars not in the star atlas, and one cannot then know if one is or is not seeing a supernova ... so presumably more advanced users obtain detailed maps of the area of sky of interest?
Certainly not in M39! There were supernovas in M51 and M101 earlier this year.
This goes far beyond any star atlas. What you need is a photograph. The easiest place to get it is Wikisky. More sophisticated are the sources behind Wikisky, notably the Digitized Sky Survey, which covers the whole sky, and the Sloan Digital Sky Survey, which goes even deeper but doesn't cover the whole sky.
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jwheel
professor emeritus
Reged: 01/23/08
Loc: Fort Davis TX
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Re: Advanced Star Atlas
[Re: Tony Flanders]
#5363200 - 08/11/12 11:26 AM
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This one might be of interest too:
http://www.uv.es/jrtorres/triatlas.html
Joe Wheelock
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Fuzzyguy
sage
Reged: 12/21/11
Loc: Colorado/Kansas
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Re: Advanced Star Atlas
[Re: jwheel]
#5363346 - 08/11/12 01:26 PM
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I use Cartes du Ciel for which I downloaded the Tyco 2 catalog. It shows stars down to Mag 12 which works well for me with an 8" scope. On really good nights, I see stars dimmer than that, but they are just barely visible or are only visible with averted vision. You can print out the charts you need or turn on the "night vision" feature and use the computer at the scope. Just last night I found a planetary nebula NGC 6804, that I couldn't see until I added an OIII and let my eyes become completely dark adapted, but when I did see it, it was right where it should be in the star field I found first.
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GeneT
Ely Kid
Reged: 11/07/08
Loc: South Texas
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Re: Advanced Star Atlas
[Re: Shawn H]
#5363441 - 08/11/12 02:43 PM
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Google: Willmann-Bell,Inc then click on celestial atlases then Urano Metria 2000.0. Stars down 9.75, and its modern!
These are good. What kind of telescope do you have? I have found that my Sky Atlas 2000 yields me about 99 percent of anything I want to view. It is easy to use and comes in a variety of editions. You may want to move into the computer world and buy something like Sky Tools.
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bumm
sage
Reged: 01/07/11
Loc: Iowa
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Re: Advanced Star Atlas
[Re: GeneT]
#5363553 - 08/11/12 04:14 PM
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"Uranometria 2000" is a wonderful atlas that goes down to mag. 9.5. For me, it's indispensable when using my C8 or 11x80 binoculars.
I just sent away for "The Great Atlas of the Sky" which goes down to mag. 12. It's going out of print and selling out for 99 dollars, instead of the previous 250. http://www.greatskyatlas.com/ I've never used it, but I'm looking forward to giving it a try.
Star atlases as detailed as these take some getting used to, and you'll need your less detailed atlas to find your way around on these, but once you've found your field, they're a big help.
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star drop
Snowed In
Reged: 02/02/08
Loc: Snow Plop, WNY
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Re: Advanced Star Atlas
[Re: bumm]
#5364218 - 08/12/12 01:58 AM
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Recently I switched from Sky Atlas 2000 to Sky Safari Pro (had to buy a tablet first).
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Mark9473
Postmaster
Reged: 07/21/05
Loc: 51°N 4°E
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Re: Advanced Star Atlas
[Re: Fuzzyguy]
#5364285 - 08/12/12 04:02 AM Attachment (11 downloads)
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I use Cartes du Ciel for which I downloaded the Tyco 2 catalog. It shows stars down to Mag 12 which works well for me with an 8" scope.
I wholeheartedly second that recommendation. You can go a lot fainter than mag 12 if you want.
BTW I think the supernova you meant was in M95 not M39.
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Tony Flanders
Postmaster
Reged: 05/18/06
Loc: Cambridge, MA, USA
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Re: Advanced Star Atlas
[Re: Fuzzyguy]
#5365099 - 08/12/12 05:42 PM
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I use Cartes du Ciel for which I downloaded the Tyco 2 catalog. It shows stars down to Mag 12 ...
The question was regarding supernovas. Mag 12 is not deep enough for supernovas. Also, Tycho 2 gets pretty ragged below magnitude 11.5 -- that is to say, not very reliable.
You need something deeper, like the Hubble Guide Star Catalog or (vastly better) UCAC. But honest, photos work best of all. That's what all the serious observers use for this kind of application.
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Fuzzyguy
sage
Reged: 12/21/11
Loc: Colorado/Kansas
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Re: Advanced Star Atlas
[Re: Tony Flanders]
#5365134 - 08/12/12 05:58 PM
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Quote:
The question was regarding supernovas. Mag 12 is not deep enough for supernovas. Also, Tycho 2 gets pretty ragged below magnitude 11.5 -- that is to say, not very reliable.
You need something deeper, like the Hubble Guide Star Catalog or (vastly better) UCAC. But honest, photos work best of all. That's what all the serious observers use for this kind of application.
Not sure why he would need anything that goes deeper than Mag 12 with his refractor unless it's larger that 7" or 8". With my 8" scope, anything below about mag twelve depends on great seeing anyway. How bright was the super nova he was looking for?
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Matt2003
Post Laureate
Reged: 04/22/10
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Re: Advanced Star Atlas
[Re: Fuzzyguy]
#5365274 - 08/12/12 07:27 PM
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Sounds like you may want some darker skies, I can get Mag. 13 stars in my 8 inch. True, not bright & you may need AV some times here in the Orange but not at all hard. ( I am basing this on my views of some NGC globs where I got a bit of resolution).
Clear Skies,
Matt
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mintaka77
member
Reged: 09/12/11
Loc: Norwich, UK
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Re: Advanced Star Atlas
[Re: Matt2003]
#5371889 - 08/16/12 05:09 PM
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Hi there
Thanks all! I'm really looking forward to trying some of these suggestions. FYI I have a 12 inch Dob and a semi dark sky (probably green zone) and no street lights (but annoying neighborly porch lights). it was the supernova in M95. I don't remember how bright it was.
Mintaka.
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