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Equipment Discussions >> Binoculars

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BillC
on a new path
*****

Reged: 06/04/04

Loc: Lake Stevens, WA, USA
Re: "Conditional Aligmment" accepted by SPIE new [Re: rydberg]
      #5370174 - 08/15/12 01:48 PM

Okay, college Pu . . . YOU have a stroke, and then get back to me! When it first happened, eye Kudnt tipe at lal. Still seeing grass from the green side was a blessing.

BillC

PS Why do you have "Nikon Prostar 7x50" in bold print?


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rydberg
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 02/25/04

Loc: Richmond, KY, USA
Re: "Conditional Aligmment" accepted by SPIE new [Re: BillC]
      #5370184 - 08/15/12 01:55 PM

Yo're so smrt,
figure it out...


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BillC
on a new path
*****

Reged: 06/04/04

Loc: Lake Stevens, WA, USA
Re: "Conditional Aligmment" accepted by SPIE new [Re: rydberg]
      #5370191 - 08/15/12 02:02 PM

Ahl redi did! 'twas jus pulin yor chain.

It must be a million degrees where you are. Are you getting the afternoon storms to cool things down?

We get such storms here so seldom, when they come the photos can make the front page of the paper. I kid you not. What these guys know about rain comes from the myths about Seattle.

BillC


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Jon Isaacs
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 06/16/04

Loc: San Diego and Boulevard, CA
Re: "Conditional Aligmment" accepted by SPIE new [Re: BillC]
      #5370214 - 08/15/12 02:18 PM

Quote:

We get such storms here so seldom, when they come the photos can make the front page of the paper. I kid you not. What these guys know about rain comes from the myths about Seattle.

BillC




Been to Seattle, spent some real time across the sound in Kingston. It doesn't rain hard in Seattle, it just drizzles about 8 months of the year.

Jon


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Claudio
sage
*****

Reged: 07/26/04

Re: "Conditional Alignment" accepted by SPIE new [Re: BillC]
      #5370262 - 08/15/12 03:01 PM

Bill, what a nice news! I am very happy for you.
Looking forward to reading your text!
Claudio


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rydberg
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 02/25/04

Loc: Richmond, KY, USA
Re: "Conditional Aligmment" accepted by SPIE new [Re: BillC]
      #5370277 - 08/15/12 03:14 PM

Quote:


It must be a million degrees where you are. Are you getting the afternoon storms to cool things down?




Actually we have been pretty hot in July (over 95 for days). But August has been pretty mild, with lots of rain.
So much so that I have had to mow the lawn once a week. Darn it...
Marco


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Gordon Rayner
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 03/24/07

Re: "Conditional Aligmment" accepted by SPIE new [Re: BillC]
      #5370316 - 08/15/12 03:46 PM

I wonder why you did not pre-announce , in this forum, your presentation? Thus, I missed it.


I went to the bookstore at the convention yesterday, and found the error, which I mentioned a few weeks or months ago, in the Vukobratovich & Yoder book , about the WW II B&L wide angle 7 x 50. A box describes
it as 6 x 50, with a field well above its actual 10 deg.

Might what they describe have been some rare oddball experimental unit?


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BillC
on a new path
*****

Reged: 06/04/04

Loc: Lake Stevens, WA, USA
Re: "Conditional Aligmment" accepted by SPIE new [Re: Gordon Rayner]
      #5370373 - 08/15/12 04:34 PM

Hi Gordon:

I certainly made no secret of the presentation, as others will attest. But, look at it from the positive side. You saved $600, and I was spared from having you point out all my mistakes, as you have done with the Yoder and Vukobratovich book.

While I’ve yet to see an error-free publication, I’m sure the gentlemen would entertain your correction for subsequent editions. They already know you; at least Dan does.

I think those on Cloudy Nights would support you producing a field guide of your own to set the record straight on all you see wrong. It’s a lot of work. But, you seem like a driven fellow.

Cheers,

BillC


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ronharper
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 02/14/06

Re: "Conditional Aligmment" accepted by SPIE new [Re: BillC]
      #5370958 - 08/16/12 01:00 AM

If you please Bill, can you give a reference to your article? Or if it's too academic for us, just say!
Ron


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BillC
on a new path
*****

Reged: 06/04/04

Loc: Lake Stevens, WA, USA
Re: "Conditional Aligmment" accepted by SPIE new [Re: ronharper]
      #5370995 - 08/16/12 01:57 AM

Heavens no; are you kidding! I wrote it half geek and half nerd . . . so I could confuse the greatest number of people. I won't reference it yet because . . . I didn't send them the FINAL . . . and Kenny will shred me. Once I get the REAL one in the system, THEN, I'll let you know.

"Too academic," indeed!

BillC


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BillC
on a new path
*****

Reged: 06/04/04

Loc: Lake Stevens, WA, USA
Re: "Conditional Alignment" accepted by SPIE new [Re: Claudio]
      #5371935 - 08/16/12 05:34 PM

Quote:

Bill, what a nice news! I am very happy for you.
Looking forward to reading your text!
Claudio




And you're prominently mentioned!

BillC


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BillC
on a new path
*****

Reged: 06/04/04

Loc: Lake Stevens, WA, USA
Re: "Conditional Aligmment" accepted by SPIE new [Re: ronharper]
      #5371943 - 08/16/12 05:41 PM

Quote:

If you please Bill, can you give a reference to your article? Or if it's too academic for us, just say!
Ron




Send me your email. It's okay to turn it loose. Besides they don't have the last edit. Kenny--dear friend that he is--would dig a hole and shove me in.

w j c 1111 (at sign) hot mail dot com

Cheers,

BillC


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Trinovid6x24
member


Reged: 09/24/10

Re: "Conditional Aligmment" accepted by SPIE new [Re: BillC]
      #5372244 - 08/16/12 10:14 PM

Bill,
I don't log in that often but I just want to throw my hands together for you on this paper.

It has always been my believe that true collimation is not that easy to understand for most people, thus this is why so many are scratching their heads.

It's like the intrinsic value vs the market value of a binocular. Simple words but not easy to understand.

Best wishes and hope it your paper can clarify the matter for people.

Mike


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BillC
on a new path
*****

Reged: 06/04/04

Loc: Lake Stevens, WA, USA
Re: "Conditional Aligmment" accepted by SPIE new [Re: Trinovid6x24]
      #5372393 - 08/17/12 12:09 AM

Thanks, Mike:

Sadly, no; that’s part of the misunderstanding I find troubling. Early in our careers, Cory and I determined to keep things close to the vest, so as to provide job security. Now, as old turkeys, we’re doing all we can to teach those willing to use their heads as something other than hat racks.

The procedure is simple and offered in my paper. It does not offer as much fun as those who want to spend their lives in endless—and often useless—speculation seem to want. But I swear it’s not that hard to do it right. We have been sidetracked several times on CN, but if we could stay with logic, much could be done. Ask daniel_h; he’s been to one of Cory’s classes.

Then, too, people think you need expensive gear. I hope the following (from my paper) will clarify the point. I don’t want to speculate about why we don’t “just” build some device that is failed technology from 60 years ago and would cost a king’s ransom to build or a forklift to move.

12. The Mk 5: THIS TECHNICIAN’S CHOICE

For the sake of speed and efficiency, this technician would chose to collimate most hand-held binoculars via the Fujinon U.B.M.M. However, building such a device is beyond the capabilities of most who have an interest in collimation and used units are at a premium, with manufacturers vying for any that might become available
.
The British Mk IV and the US Navy’s Mk 5 offer alternatives that are more in line with the average machinist’s capabilities. While not being as portable as the British Mk IV, the US Navy Mk 5 offers simpler construction, collimation procedures, and can address a much larger array of instruments. For those reasons, I propose the building of such devices by larger telescope making workshops around the country, as well as being built by or contracted for every dedicated binocular retailer or importer. The construction of such devises is not nearly as mysterious, complicated, or expensive as many think.

For example, the test stand can be made of plywood (I would prefer “apple ply”), a wooden dowel, a couple of strong rubber bands, a used industrial door hinge, 2 or 3 1/4-20 bolts, and some fixture to hold the binocular stationary during collimation. Everything except the last are probably in the garages of most do-it-yourselfers, already.

There is a tendency to think a 12 -inch objective lens would cost a fortune. If it were an achromat, it would. But remember, it’s two pieces of relatively thin convex-plano plate glass.

The ultra-expensive, full-diameter reticle? That can be a 1/4-inch piece of plate glass with a computer-generated transparency affixed to one side. The target need not be of any particular design. While making one, I had to go through several iterations in order to get the graduations (degrees and minutes) exact; but remember, a graduated cross is only a convenience—the middle of the target is just a point. And the superimposition of two points is the goal.

Finally, the auxiliary telescope may be purchased from any number of scientific and retail optical sources, leaving only the rhomboid prism to purchase and its holder to machine.


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Trinovid6x24
member


Reged: 09/24/10

Re: "Conditional Aligmment" accepted by SPIE new [Re: BillC]
      #5374853 - 08/18/12 03:13 PM

Bill, it's my belief that the resistance you are seeing is not because they don't want to believe your method but they just can not grasp the whole concept clearly. The experience put together between you & Cory is quite significant after all the two of you are practitioners.

Since I love to explain things using analogies, I will say collimation is like interest calculation. If compounded annually, semi annually, quarterly, or even monthly the crowd will be with you. but if you say compounded CONTINUOUSLY, you will lose 95% of the audience. Compounding continuously means infinity and a Mark V simulates an object at infinite. It took me some time to grasp onto this concept.

i wonder what daniel_h thinks.

Mike


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BillC
on a new path
*****

Reged: 06/04/04

Loc: Lake Stevens, WA, USA
Re: "Conditional Aligmment" accepted by SPIE [Re: Trinovid6x24]
      #5374929 - 08/18/12 04:24 PM

Hi Mike:

I don’t really feel it’s a resistance; it’s just easier to talk, speculate, and cover the same ground over and over. Conversation is a big part of what CN is all about.

Also, it’s not MY method. It’s just what the Navy decided on after a few decades of theory and practice. And—another also—I thought your analogy was a good one!

I used “3-axis collimation” even when talking to the Post Docs in San Diego. My goal was to make a point—not amaze anyone with my vocabulary. The University of Washington concluded a study in 1982 that showed even Post Docs retain more when taught on a 7th grade level. Sure there are many, many times in optics when the $5 words just have to be used. But, as Twain put it: “The difference between the right word and the ALMOST right word is like the difference between lightening and the lightening bug.”

Or, as the navy put it, KISS . . . Keep It Simple, Stupid! That’s why the optics primer in the front of OM3 & 2 is one of the most elegant out there.

Cheers,

BillC


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