Return to the Cloudy Nights Telescope Reviews home pageAstronomics discounts for Cloudy Nights members
· Get a Cloudy Nights T-Shirt · Submit a Review / Article

Click here if you are having trouble logging into the forums

Privacy Policy | Please read our Terms of Service | Signup and Troubleshooting FAQ | Problems? PM a Red or a Green Gu… uh, User

Equipment Discussions >> Binoviewers

Pages: 1 | 2 | (show all)
dr.who
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 01/05/12

Re: Baader Bino what EP's ES 68's or 82's? [Re: johnnyha]
      #5592879 - 12/28/12 03:38 PM

Thank you for that Johnny. That is something important to consider...

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
dr.who
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 01/05/12

Re: Baader Bino what EP's ES 68's or 82's? new [Re: dr.who]
      #5612097 - 01/08/13 02:43 PM

Update-

Woodland Hills Telescope and Darkroom (my local shop) was kind enough to lend me a Denkmeir to test with including the 1.2x OCS. Last night at about 8:30 I saw the clouds clear and went out with the 127mm to test. These are my results.

I looked at (a small portion of) the double cluster, Orion nebula, and Jupiter.

I used two 11mm ES 82* EP's. I am using 11's because I don't have any other 1.25" EP's to test with at the moment.

I used an 8.8 mm ES EP as the starting point to make sure the objects were centered up. The reason for the 8.8 was that the ES 11's divided by 1.2 equals 9.16mm so the closest EP I had was the 8.8.

I tested the BV's with and without the OCS. I did this because the problem I was having with the Baader's were too little infocus whereas with the Denk's I was reaching focus with the focuser out almost half it's length so I was hoping for focus without the OCS.

I was able to reach focus with the OCS in the nosepiece of the stock ES diagonal with the focuser out about 4.5 inches. I was not able to reach focus without the OCS. This was expected but to be thorough I wanted to test it.

My results with the ES 127 are that the views of the DSO's were like I was looking at something in 3D. This part was fantastic. What was not fantastic was that the objects were so dim that it really took away from the experience. To the point where the 3D effect was overshadowed by how dark the views were making a BV a non-starter for this OTA for DSO viewing. Yes I understand why there was a light loss.

On Jupiter it was very nice and had the same 3D effect with acceptable levels of light loss. Were I primarily a planetary viewer a BV in this OTA would be a big win.

I plan to repeat this test this evening (clouds willing) in the C11. My expectation is that the views will be brighter. My hope is that they will be bright enough to justify a BV for me for this OTA.

As an aside the ES EP's perform very well in the Denk's. No problems with vignetting or anything else.

More (hopefully) to follow.

Thank you all again for your help on this!


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Eddgie
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 02/01/06

Re: Baader Bino what EP's ES 68's or 82's? new [Re: dr.who]
      #5613342 - 01/09/13 09:10 AM

I'm confused.. I did not know that Denkmeier had a 1.2x OCS configuration.

Where you using a Supersystem with a 1.3x low power arm?


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
dr.who
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 01/05/12

Re: Baader Bino what EP's ES 68's or 82's? new [Re: Eddgie]
      #5613887 - 01/09/13 03:04 PM

Update Part II-

Based on the information gleaned from Eddgie's post regarding the actual magnification of the Denkmeir Format Correcting System (words taken from their web page to describe it) being higher than I was expecting it does explain the loss of light in terms of views. Per Eddgie if it's not used in a Denk diagonal then it would be a 1.3x or even 1.4x as opposed to the 1.2x I was expecting. Thus moving the EP's from a 9mm to an 8.4 or even 7.8.

Regardless it was still an unsatisfactory view in the APO.

I did test it last night with my 11" SCT. It was an abbreviated test with me looking at the Orion Nebula, Rigel, and Jupiter due to family obligations and clouds rolling in.

The C11 handled the Denk's much better than the ES 127mm in terms of brightness with much less light loss though it was still noticeable and did take away from the viewing enjoyment. Focus was easy to find and overall I think that were I to go down the BV path the only way I would use a pair was if it was on a 8" SCT or larger due to loss of light.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Eddgie
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 02/01/06

Re: Baader Bino what EP's ES 68's or 82's? new [Re: dr.who]
      #5614092 - 01/09/13 05:01 PM

This is why I asked about whether you were using the Demkmier.

Frankly, I fell as if the Denkmeier web page is a bit misleading in suggesting that the Supersystem gives 1.3x. At the least, they should have an asterisk with a disclaimer stating that the Denk (or similar) diagonal is required.


Otherwise, this mirrors my own experience. I just don't find them rewarding in my 6" APO. Even accounting for the extra magnification (1.4x maybe vs 1.3), the view still seemed very dim. Even on planets at 200x, I just could not get enough brightness to make the image work for me. In monovision, I get my best performace from my 6" APO at this power. I can go higher for bigger scale, but the image gets to dim I think for the lowest contrast detail to be easily visible.

But in the binoviewers, it was just to dim, and (I refuse to cut the tube) the inability to reach meaningful low powers leaves me a bit less than happy. with them binoviewers in that scope.

Even in the C14, I find that past about 300x using the binoviewers on planets, the image gets dim too. In fact I just bought a pair of Televue 40mm Plossls to see if I can punch up the deep sky performance a bit. Clusters are fine, but I feel as if some Nebula are a little to dim.

On the other hand, even though I am using a bit lower powers on planets than I used to, I feel as if I am seeing as much or more than before, and more comfortably.

And I am trying to use Binoviewers more, but I keep feeling like I am missing some brightness.

My plan it to bino exclusivly for another 6 months, then go out one night and start with binos, then switch to Mono to see if I get an "Oh Wow!" If I do, I may move more back to mono for much viewing and relegate the binos to planetary and doubles and things like that.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Pages: 1 | 2 | (show all)


Extra information
2 registered and 4 anonymous users are browsing this forum.

Moderator:  TG, Geo557 

Print Thread

Forum Permissions
      You cannot start new topics
      You cannot reply to topics
      HTML is disabled
      UBBCode is enabled


Thread views: 1718

Jump to

CN Forums Home


Cloudy Nights LLC
Cloudy Nights Sponsor: Astronomics