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General Astronomy >> Light Pollution

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magic612
Post Laureate

Reged: 09/30/08

Loc: S. of Chicago's light dome

I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map
#5602843 - 01/03/13 11:57 AM

http://bmander.com/dotmap/index.html

It's a census map of everyone in the U.S. and Canada represented as a dot. Zoom in on it, and you'll see what I mean.

Post Extras:

Mr. Bill
Postmaster

Reged: 02/09/05

Loc: Northeastern Cal

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: magic612]
#5602865 - 01/03/13 12:05 PM

Don't think you need to overlay...obviously a high correlation between people and LP.

That's why I seek out places without cell service, like central Nevada to observe.

Post Extras:

magic612
Post Laureate

Reged: 09/30/08

Loc: S. of Chicago's light dome

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: Mr. Bill]
#5602874 - 01/03/13 12:10 PM

Well, certainly the correlation is strong, but it would be interesting to see where it varied and wasn't correlated.

Post Extras:

csa/montana
Den Mama

Reged: 05/14/05

Loc: montana

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: magic612]
#5602890 - 01/03/13 12:21 PM

Well, as far as I can tell, my State shows only a handful of people. Granted, it isn't a "high" population State, (just under one million); but think it has more people than this shows.

As far as overlaying it on a LP map, it seems self-explanatory; more dots, higher LP; less dots, lower LP.

Post Extras:

tezster
professor emeritus

Reged: 07/14/09

Loc: Missisauga, Canada

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: csa/montana]
#5602911 - 01/03/13 12:32 PM

This is really interesting - maybe someone could contact the creator and ask about the possibility of creating an overlay that will work in conjunction with the LP chart and Google maps?

Post Extras:

magic612
Post Laureate

Reged: 09/30/08

Loc: S. of Chicago's light dome

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: tezster]
#5603006 - 01/03/13 01:29 PM

Carol, if you zoom in more, then more dots show up. It certainly does look "blank" in Montana from a distance, but there are people there. I just think it's a lot of distance separating them.

Terence, I don't think Jonathan Shine has updated the LP / GoogleMaps overlay for many years, and even says on that page that he doesn't have time, but if someone is interested he'll gladly give them the source code. I just don't have the knowledge to know how to work with that.

Post Extras:

csa/montana
Den Mama

Reged: 05/14/05

Loc: montana

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: magic612]
#5603455 - 01/03/13 06:09 PM

I did zoom in, and all the people (dots) disappeared.

Post Extras:

Mr. Bill
Postmaster

Reged: 02/09/05

Loc: Northeastern Cal

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: csa/montana]
#5603637 - 01/03/13 08:06 PM

Quote:

I did zoom in, and all the people (dots) disappeared.

Sounds like the Rapture....

Post Extras:

johne
sage

Reged: 11/10/06

Loc: Prescott, AZ.

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: Mr. Bill]
#5604143 - 01/04/13 06:43 AM

Seems to be a bit of a problem with the map/data? As you zoom in, some areas (i.e., Prescott, AZ. area), start to drop out in sections, then it all goes blank.

Still pretty cool to see the population density from a birds eye view.

Post Extras:

magic612
Post Laureate

Reged: 09/30/08

Loc: S. of Chicago's light dome

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: johne]
#5604663 - 01/04/13 12:13 PM

Hmm... I'm using the Chrome browser, and I'm not seeing any dropouts on the map. It does take a couple seconds for it to refresh and have the dots return depending on how fast you zoom, but I see them at each zoom level.

Even in Montana.

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Rich V.
Post Laureate

Reged: 01/02/05

Loc: Lake Tahoe area, Nevada, USA

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: magic612]
#5604992 - 01/04/13 03:05 PM

The distribution of dots isn't accurate; in my area there are lots of dots sprinkled all around a nearby mountain that I know for certain is uninhabited wilderness.

Rich

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magic612
Post Laureate

Reged: 09/30/08

Loc: S. of Chicago's light dome

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: Rich V.]
#5605833 - 01/05/13 12:27 AM

Ah, some of them are randomly placed based on random area distribution, I guess. That's unfortunate.

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Tony Flanders
Postmaster

Reged: 05/18/06

Loc: Cambridge, MA, USA

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: Rich V.]
#5606081 - 01/05/13 07:31 AM

Quote:

The distribution of dots isn't accurate; in my area there are lots of dots sprinkled all around a nearby mountain that I know for certain is uninhabited wilderness.

That's explained on the website. The dots are based on census blocks. Inside cities, that probably gives a resolution measured in hundreds of feet. In the wilderness, it's probably only good to 10 miles.

Post Extras:

George N
Carpal Tunnel

Reged: 05/19/06

Loc: Binghamton & Indian Lake NY

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: magic612]
#5608568 - 01/06/13 02:47 PM

Quote:

Well, certainly the correlation is strong, but it would be interesting to see where it varied and wasn't correlated.

I think you will find more LP in low population areas in the future as more gas and oil drilling takes place. Even after the drilling is over the owners insist on lighting the gas line pumping stations. Also, companies like Google are locating their data centers in dark, cold, dry locations on purpose to save on power cost and taxes, plus to take advantage of cool temps to help with cooling their servers. The result: massive lighting increases in remote locations.

In contrast, LP seems to be declining in areas of the rural areas of the Northeast where population is declining and the tax base no longer supports lighting cost. The NY rural counties in central NY have been steadily declining in population for the past 30 years. I recently read a book showing photos taken about a 100 years ago in central NY and I was surprised to see many of the familiar hills that are today covered with forest that were back then agricultural fields. Also, the small towns were much larger then.

Post Extras:

csrlice12
Post Laureate

Reged: 05/22/12

Loc: Denver, CO

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: Mr. Bill]
#5610487 - 01/07/13 04:05 PM

Quote:

Don't think you need to overlay...obviously a high correlation between people and LP.

That's why I seek out places without cell service, like central Nevada to observe.

You'd love Alexandria, Indiana then....it's like the black hole of cell phone service.....

Post Extras:

Mr. Bill
Postmaster

Reged: 02/09/05

Loc: Northeastern Cal

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: csrlice12]
#5610618 - 01/07/13 05:40 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Don't think you need to overlay...obviously a high correlation between people and LP.

That's why I seek out places without cell service, like central Nevada to observe.

You'd love Alexandria, Indiana then....it's like the black hole of cell phone service.....

Post Extras:

Mary B
Vendor - Echo Astronomy and Electronics

Reged: 05/21/10

Loc: Minnesota

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: Mr. Bill]
#5612376 - 01/08/13 05:34 PM

My area went blank too, granted there are only 13 people per square mile here...

Post Extras:

Mr. Bill
Postmaster

Reged: 02/09/05

Loc: Northeastern Cal

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: Mary B]
#5612422 - 01/08/13 06:09 PM

In Lassen County, NE Calf, we have 5.3 people/sq mile....probably 10 times more cattle and sheep.

25000 people, 4720 sq miles if you count the people walking around. 10000 more people are in prisons within the county so I don't count them, but the prisons contribute a lot to LP.

OBTW, if you Google Lassen, it says that the population of Susanville (county seat) is 17,500. What they don't mention is that the 10000 prisoners locked up in state prisons are counted in that, obviously for state/federal funding.

Kinda a local joke...

Edited by Mr. Bill (01/08/13 06:25 PM)

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sonny.barile
sage

Reged: 10/19/10

Loc: In the middle of the glow.

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: Mr. Bill]
#5633805 - 01/20/13 07:20 PM

I live in what is considered a small town in NJ with2766 people per square mile. I bet we have more mpm's (muggings per mile) than you have people...

The lp is so bad here you can read outside at night.

Post Extras:

Darenwh
Carpal Tunnel

Reged: 05/11/06

Loc: Covington, GA

Re: I wish I knew how to overlay this on LP map new

[Re: sonny.barile]
#5636875 - 01/22/13 01:05 PM

Ok, how do I find my dot?

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