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Equipment Discussions >> Mounts

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jrcrillyAdministrator
Refractor wienie no more
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Reged: 04/30/03

Loc: NE Ohio
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: kepler22]
      #5641426 - 01/24/13 08:40 PM

Quote:

anyone and i mean anyone even first timers can buy
a very large mount like Cge pro and C-11 Edge HD
and start no problems first time.




Probably not. Alignments have grown ever more automatic for alt/az mounts and this one goes a long way (appears to be a more effective implementation than Meade's LS series). An EQ mount does require a reasonable accurate initial polar alignment, though, before any star alignment can be effective. Automating that would be a far more complicated (and expensive) project.


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FoxTrot
sage


Reged: 06/01/06

Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: cn register 5]
      #5642195 - 01/25/13 09:37 AM

Chris, and JRCrilly - I don't quite get it. I can see how Starsense will help out for an AltAz'muth mount - but for a GEM? Are we assuming you don't bother with an initial polar alignment, and just let Starsense do its thing first (with poor polar alignment) - and then how does the mount maintain tracking thereafter? Without reasonable polar alignment, both the RA and Dec need constant driving to maintain tracking...? Or maybe as other said above, ASPA is still required thereafter...? Fox

Quote:

From what I've seen looking at a SkyProdigy HC the display is different, it seems to have a four line display, the lowest line has help information.

There's a SP manual on the Celestron site, I doubt the StarSense manual will be put there until after it's released.

We can only speculate about what the SS will do, especially with an equatorial mount, because so far the SP has been alt az only. There's all sorts of possibilities - polar align helper where the scope tells you how far to move each axis - multiple align stars - auto precise goto where the scope moves, has a look to see how it's doing and then does a final update. Possibly guiding although that may be more challenging.

I guess that the first version will not have everything but that additional features will be added later.

Chris




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FoxTrot
sage


Reged: 06/01/06

Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: cn register 5]
      #5642196 - 01/25/13 09:37 AM

Chris, and JRCrilly - I don't quite get it. I can see how Starsense will help out for an AltAz'muth mount - but for a GEM? Are we assuming you don't bother with an initial polar alignment, and just let Starsense do its thing first (with poor polar alignment) - and then how does the mount maintain tracking thereafter? Without reasonable polar alignment, both the RA and Dec need constant driving to maintain tracking...? Or maybe as other said above, ASPA is still required thereafter...? Fox

Quote:

From what I've seen looking at a SkyProdigy HC the display is different, it seems to have a four line display, the lowest line has help information.

There's a SP manual on the Celestron site, I doubt the StarSense manual will be put there until after it's released.

We can only speculate about what the SS will do, especially with an equatorial mount, because so far the SP has been alt az only. There's all sorts of possibilities - polar align helper where the scope tells you how far to move each axis - multiple align stars - auto precise goto where the scope moves, has a look to see how it's doing and then does a final update. Possibly guiding although that may be more challenging.

I guess that the first version will not have everything but that additional features will be added later.

Chris




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jrcrillyAdministrator
Refractor wienie no more
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Reged: 04/30/03

Loc: NE Ohio
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: FoxTrot]
      #5642205 - 01/25/13 09:41 AM

Quote:

Chris, and JRCrilly - I don't quite get it. I can see how Starsense will help out for an AltAz'muth mount - but for a GEM? Are we assuming you don't bother with an initial polar alignment, and just let Starsense do its thing first (with poor polar alignment) - and then how does the mount maintain tracking thereafter? Without reasonable polar alignment, both the RA and Dec need constant driving to maintain tracking...? Or maybe as other said above, ASPA is still required thereafter...? Fox




Yes, it can automate the star alignment, but as I mention above the polar alignment will remain a manual process.


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HowardK
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Reged: 10/20/10

Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: jrcrilly]
      #5642458 - 01/25/13 12:08 PM

So you hit enter ...wait 3 minutes whilst starsense aligns the CGE PRO, for example, mount really accurately......then do a normal aspa routine if you need to.

Sounds great to me


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ghataa
professor emeritus


Reged: 06/20/11

Loc: Central, NJ
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: HowardK]
      #5642827 - 01/25/13 03:37 PM

Does this assume all stars are available for alignment? I would guess there are many folks who have blocked views of certain sections of the sky.

Or can you pick what stars it can align on based on user input?

George


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HowardK
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Reged: 10/20/10

Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: ghataa]
      #5643150 - 01/25/13 06:50 PM

It can be allowed to pick its own regions of sky or you can manually point it to different locations that are unobstructed.

Got that from looking at SkyProdigy manual on Celestrons website


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palmer570
super member
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Reged: 09/04/12

Loc: Scranton, Pennsylvania
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: HowardK]
      #5644467 - 01/26/13 02:07 PM

I got on the pre-order list yesterday, sounds like it will make my setup a little easier.

I wouldn't be surprised if someone eventually made a Eq. mount with motors in it to make small adjustments to polar alignment. Doesn't seem like it would be terribly hard to do.


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wolfman_4_ever
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 07/15/11

Loc: El Segundo, Ca, So. Cal
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: palmer570]
      #5644655 - 01/26/13 04:08 PM

Would be a whole lot easier than trying to turn knobs that just roll over some plate..

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HowardK
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Reged: 10/20/10

Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: wolfman_4_ever]
      #5657550 - 02/02/13 03:24 AM

Anyone know when Starsense is available to buy?

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palmer570
super member
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Reged: 09/04/12

Loc: Scranton, Pennsylvania
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: HowardK]
      #5657556 - 02/02/13 03:39 AM

From what I read from vendors it will be out in April.

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CharlesW
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 11/02/12

Loc: Chula Vista & Indio, CA
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: palmer570]
      #5658138 - 02/02/13 01:19 PM

Maybe I'm missing something here but isn't it a necessity that the FOV of the Star Sense be centered on the same FOV as your scope? If you are setting up your system from scratch every time, wouldn't aligning the two take just as much time as just using a Telrad and a reticle? After the frustration I had the other night getting my scope aligned I'm dying for something like Star Sense, but it has to be easy to set up every time.

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rmollise
Postmaster
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Reged: 07/06/07

Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: CharlesW]
      #5658187 - 02/02/13 01:45 PM

Where was your frustration? It's possible we can save you some bucks.

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CharlesW
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 11/02/12

Loc: Chula Vista & Indio, CA
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: rmollise]
      #5658655 - 02/02/13 06:15 PM

I don't want to hijack this thread but my frustration was that I set up my scope in the dark and I didn't get the Telrad's dovetails inserted into the holder correctly. To answer my own question, I just read the March Sky and Telesope. There is a Celestron scope review in which the author says Starsense is good enough to get an object in the eyepiece, but not centered. You then go to a calibration page in the menu to get things centered up.

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SkipW
sage


Reged: 02/03/11

Loc: Oklahoma, USA
Re: Celestron StarSense [Re: CharlesW]
      #5659131 - 02/02/13 11:37 PM

Not to be insensitive, but it sounds like you're looking for technology to compensate for user error. StarSense may indeed be great, but only it it's set up right, which is probably fraught with its own complications. Please take a little more time to see if you really need it. Set up your rig correctly and try again. After all... "Courage is being scared to death, but saddling up anyway." If you stay with it you will probably learn to put everything together by feel; until then, set up in the day or use a red flashlight.

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Stew57
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 05/03/09

Loc: Silsbee Texas
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: SkipW]
      #5659557 - 02/03/13 09:14 AM

Accuracy is the break or make. I can't see a 20mm f2 with that camera being as accurate as using my mallincam through my C11 at f10. I hope I am wrong

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jrcrillyAdministrator
Refractor wienie no more
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Reged: 04/30/03

Loc: NE Ohio
Re: Celestron StarSense [Re: Stew57]
      #5659587 - 02/03/13 09:32 AM

Quote:

Accuracy is the break or make. I can't see a 20mm f2 with that camera being as accurate as using my mallincam through my C11 at f10. I hope I am wrong




If you refer to the accuracy of the alignment, the camera's focal length doesn't enter into it. Nothing about the image is measured in any way; only the relative star locations are used to match up a piece of sky. The accuracy will depend only on the accuracy of the star locations in the database used to plate solve the images, and the algorithms used.


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rmollise
Postmaster
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Reged: 07/06/07

Re: Celestron StarSense [Re: CharlesW]
      #5659591 - 02/03/13 09:34 AM

Quote:

I don't want to hijack this thread but my frustration was that I set up my scope in the dark and I didn't get the Telrad's dovetails inserted into the holder correctly. To answer my own question, I just read the March Sky and Telesope. There is a Celestron scope review in which the author says Starsense is good enough to get an object in the eyepiece, but not centered. You then go to a calibration page in the menu to get things centered up.




The answer, I think, is not the Celestron gadget, but tuning up your setup procedure. That's a lot cheaper, too.


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TimP
member


Reged: 02/24/09

Re: Celestron StarSense [Re: CharlesW]
      #5660225 - 02/03/13 03:46 PM

Calibrate – Your telescope’s camera may need to be calibrated if
the telescope cannot find objects after being successfully aligned.
To Calibrate the camera:
1. Slew the telescope to the bright star that you are trying to
find.
2. Select Calibrate from the StarSense menu option.
3. The hand control will display the current pixel position of the
center of the camera sensor.
4. Use the direction buttons to manually center the bright star
in the eyepiece. Press ENTER.
SkyProdigy will then take an image of the sky and calibrate the
center of the camera sensor with the star seen in the eyepiece.

Tim


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Whichwayisnorth
Pooh-Bah
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Reged: 07/04/11

Loc: Southern California
Re: Celestron StarSense [Re: TimP]
      #5660250 - 02/03/13 03:58 PM

I have one on pre-order too. All I can and will ask of it is to be able to put things as close to center of the eyepiece as is reasonable. For outreach I want to use either sky safari with the skyfi wireless adapter or SkyQ from Celestron. I want to tell it to go to an object while I discuss with those around what it is they can expect to see. I want it to be in the eyepiece once it gets there. Or even better, using something like the Mallincam to show the view on a projector screen. I don't have to say..hmm ok hold on a sec while I find it in the finder and center it. So if the StarSense can do that for me...

SOLD!


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