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Equipment Discussions >> Mounts

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cn register 5
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 12/26/12

Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: Stew57]
      #6059791 - 09/02/13 06:29 PM

Quote:

Not adressing PA at all but actuall pointinh accuracy. The goto pointing on my CGEM runs from +-2 arc minutes to +-5 arc minutes depending upon how carefully I do a 2+4. I am wanting to know how the SS compares.

Thanks



From what I can see it gives about the same accuracy as a good 2+n alignment will give you, about the same as you are reporting.

Chris


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HowardK
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 10/20/10

Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: cn register 5]
      #6059845 - 09/02/13 07:05 PM

Chris

How many calibration points did u add after the auto align...or did u not bother?


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palmer570
super member
*****

Reged: 09/04/12

Loc: Scranton, Pennsylvania
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: rmollise]
      #6060027 - 09/02/13 09:21 PM

Quote:

Quote:


The basis for GEM's is correct polar alignment. The farther its off the worse they perform.




For tracking? Yeah. For go-to? Not so much. Not the Celestrons, anyway. A fellow club member accidentally polar aligned on Kochab one night and his go-tos were great, though his tracking was lousy, of course.




I can see how the go-tos would be good if you are constantly re-centering before each slew or at least had the object in the FOV. However if you let the mount go for say an hour and the object drifts out of the FOV say 20*, just random values for this, then the next go-to would be off by 20*. Even returning to first object would put the FOV 20* from object, back to the same spot as before. Would it not?

Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't see how the mount can tell how to correct this on its own. If the go-to are good no matter what then it should track fine but with field rotation. But then it would have to use Dec without a autoguider.

I'm still new to GEMs and maybe I'm thinking of this wrong?


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jrcrillyAdministrator
Refractor wienie no more
*****

Reged: 04/30/03

Loc: NE Ohio
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: palmer570]
      #6060050 - 09/02/13 09:34 PM

Quote:

I can see how the go-tos would be good if you are constantly re-centering before each slew or at least had the object in the FOV. However if you let the mount go for say an hour and the object drifts out of the FOV say 20*, just random values for this, then the next go-to would be off by 20*. Even returning to first object would put the FOV 20* from object, back to the same spot as before. Would it not?




No. The object will drift in an hour because tracking is only in RA. All it takes to get the object back in the center, though, is to press "go to" again. The mount knows the coordinates of the object and it knows how to slew there using both axes.


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Stew57
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 05/03/09

Loc: Silsbee Texas
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: cn register 5]
      #6060073 - 09/02/13 09:48 PM

Thanks but my question seems moot now. I had contemplated cancelling my order but I was surprised by the SS being at the door when I arrived home from vacation. They had told me when I called last week I was down the list and not to hold my breath. Looks like some fun ahead.

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palmer570
super member
*****

Reged: 09/04/12

Loc: Scranton, Pennsylvania
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: jrcrilly]
      #6060075 - 09/02/13 09:48 PM

I stand corrected.

I thought the mount would act as though the current position of the FOV is at the correct coordinates although its not from drift.


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aberrs
member


Reged: 08/23/11

Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: cn register 5]
      #6060102 - 09/02/13 10:03 PM

I too just set up my StarSense, and would like to add my concurrence with the reviews above.

I powered it up, went through the date/location procedure, and it started searching through the sky. After a few images (perhaps 5?) it said it was ready.

I got a little turned around (not sure the manual is entirely accurate) when setting the center point of the scope-view with the center point of the StarSense, but once that was done, and it power-cycled, every go-to was almost dead on--without adding calibration points. As soon as I added some calibration points, the go-tos were absolutely spot-on every time.

I would like also to add that the second search-through-the-sky alignment routine (on second power up) was notably faster than the first.

I did this with my 6SE, as the clouds were coming in quickly, but I plan to give it a whirl on my CGEM soon (only wish they had shipped a second bracket!!).

One thing I noticed on the new HC-- a lack of some pretty big players in the 'named-stars' section:

Vega
Albireo,
Deneb


However, what's odd, is that now that I look at the HC back inside, not aligned, etc. the names appear in the list. They didn't once the machine had gotten its alignment, and I was cruising around the sky.

This seems like a pretty big miss... But perhaps I am missing something? any ideas?

But in any case, at first blush, it seems like Celestron has really done this right. I really think this will make winter setups much more enjoyable. Seems like in less than 2 minutes you will be up and running.

I am very, very impressed.

A

Edited by aberrs (09/02/13 10:14 PM)


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core
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 02/23/08

Loc: Mostly in Norman, OK
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: aberrs]
      #6060142 - 09/02/13 10:23 PM

Quote:

One thing I noticed on the new HC-- a lack of some pretty big players in the 'named-stars' section:

Vega
Albireo,
Deneb


However, what's odd, is that now that I look at the HC back inside, not aligned, etc. the names appear in the list. They didn't once the machine had gotten its alignment, and I was cruising around the sky.





I think as mentioned, out of the box there's a 70° slew limit (post #6057724) - at this time of the year those stars are quite high overhead (hence they would be filtered out by the limits set on the HC). I'd presume the DSO's in the same area would not be 'listed' in the HC as well after alignment. Edit the slew limits?


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aberrs
member


Reged: 08/23/11

Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: core]
      #6060162 - 09/02/13 10:35 PM

Possibly. Thanks, Peter. I will try it. Altair was in there, oddly enough...

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scopenitout
member


Reged: 08/24/13

Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: aberrs]
      #6060310 - 09/03/13 12:10 AM

Thx. for the useful review, aberrs.

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scopenitout
member


Reged: 08/24/13

Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: scopenitout]
      #6060316 - 09/03/13 12:15 AM

Reading the SS manual, there seems to be many similarities between the SS HC and the one for my 6se. You should be able to adjust the slew limits through the Utilities menu.

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neilson
professor emeritus


Reged: 08/22/10

Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: aberrs]
      #6060324 - 09/03/13 12:23 AM

Hi,
Very good review aberrs. I was very happy to hear your results of the accuracy of your gotos before and after adding calibration stars. That information cleared up all my worries about its accuracy. Your results are exactly what I was hoping for.

Neilson


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C8er
super member


Reged: 09/15/12

Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: core]
      #6060376 - 09/03/13 01:19 AM

I had a very brief try with my newly unboxed unit last night (on an 8SE mount) and was impressed that it managed to get an initial alignment with a lot of the sky obscured by scattered cloud, trees, and house/tv aerials. After it had the initial alignment I then went to calibrate the unit to the OTA but my only area of clear sky by then was up near the zenith and like aberrs I couldn't find any of the named stars in that area in the list on the HC. At that point it clouded over completely and stayed that way all evening so I couldn't explore any further or even finish my calibration.

Today I found that the alt slew limit defaults to 70 deg so I imagine like aberrs that explained the named stars near the zenith missing from the list. I have changed that slew limit setting and (fingers crossed) will try again in an hour or so at dusk (we have a wonderful clear sky right now, but....). Southern hemisphere here (37 S and UTC+12 timezone) so it will be interesting to see if it copes with that.

I have to say I was mightily impressed that it said it had successfuly obtained an initial aligmment with all the cloud around last night. I will try it out with my CG-5 Eq mount later once I have seen how it goes on the SE mount.

Cheers.


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cn register 5
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 12/26/12

Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: HowardK]
      #6060433 - 09/03/13 03:10 AM

Quote:

Chris

How many calibration points did u add after the auto align...or did u not bother?



None. That got us to Albeiro, M13, M27, M57, one or two other things. Went to the Veil and wasn't sure it was in the field so added a calib position. It didn't make a difference.

Went to the Swan Nebula and it was just on the edge so added a calibration position, did another slew and it was centred.

We were observing, so that's what we did. The SS helped us do that.

Chris


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rmollise
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 07/06/07

Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: palmer570]
      #6060657 - 09/03/13 09:05 AM

Quote:



I can see how the go-tos would be good if you are constantly re-centering before each slew or at least had the object in the FOV. However if you let the mount go for say an hour and the object drifts out of the FOV say 20*, just random values for this, then the next go-to would be off by 20*. Even returning to first object would put the FOV 20* from object, back to the same spot as before. Would it not?

Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't see how the mount can tell how to correct this on its own. If the go-to are good no matter what then it should track fine but with field rotation. But then it would have to use Dec without a autoguider.

I'm still new to GEMs and maybe I'm thinking of this wrong?




No. Because of the nature of the system, it doesn't matter how much the object drifts, the go-tos will be the same.


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CharlesW
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 11/02/12

Loc: Chula Vista & Indio, CA
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: rmollise]
      #6060822 - 09/03/13 10:46 AM

I imagine that when cars with automatic transmissions arrived, many people stuck with manual because they were less expensive or didn't trust the new-fangled technology. I drove manual when I was young and budget limited, but now at 51, I wouldn't dream of doing it on a daily basis.
Unfortunately, there is no level playing field in astronomy. I can't afford a Planewave but I don't complain that they are too expensive or begrudge those that can afford them.


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Ain Soph Aur
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 08/11/11

Loc: West Tennessee
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: CharlesW]
      #6062468 - 09/04/13 11:02 AM

I called around and found one in stock. It should arrive by next Monday at the latest. I am really looking forward to using this with the Nexstar SE and CGEM DX mounts!

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Ain Soph Aur
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 08/11/11

Loc: West Tennessee
Re: Celestron StarSense new [Re: Ain Soph Aur]
      #6062722 - 09/04/13 01:45 PM

Update on my last post. Due to a Paypal issue, I had to cancel and re-order and the Starsense will not ship until Monday. On my last call with Adorama, I verified that they do have a few of these in stock above my order. Just be aware they will be closed for Rosh Hashana, so any orders placed between now and Monday will not be shipped until Monday.

Also, I was unable to find any other vendor who had these in stock and all others I called had a large backorder list. If you want one sooner rather than later, call Adorama before thay run out.. and they close early today.

Shalom.


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gmartin02
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 04/11/05

Loc: Santa Clarita, CA
Re: Celestron StarSense [Re: CharlesW]
      #6062897 - 09/04/13 03:31 PM

Quote:

I imagine that when cars with automatic transmissions arrived, many people stuck with manual because they were less expensive or didn't trust the new-fangled technology. I drove manual when I was young and budget limited, but now at 51, I wouldn't dream of doing it on a daily basis.





That's funny - I am also 51, and I still drive a 2004 5 speed manual Elantra (150,000 miles on it) on a daily basis for commuting around town, and still enjoy the "manual" experience (except that the synchro is starting to go out in 2nd gear). The automatic SUV stays garage parked during the week and I only drive it on weekends or long trips. I am fortunate enough to be able to work at home, so I don't have to drive the manual in rush hour traffic, which would be a pain.

When I use my GEM mounts, it is always with GOTO, but when I use my Dob, it is manual star hopping


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JeffBosworth
member


Reged: 04/17/12

Loc: Ohio, USA
Re: Celestron StarSense [Re: Ain Soph Aur]
      #6062928 - 09/04/13 03:50 PM

I got my StarSense last week. I have it set up on my scope but have yet to do an alignment due to clouds and other issues. Some comments:

1. The manual is OK, but I sure wish they would give you the default values for the various settings. Of course, I can scroll through everything on the HC and get them, but... And in playing with the HC it seems as if there might be some menu items that were left out of the manual - for example I stumbled on a "Cord Wrap" item that isn't mentioned at all in the manual.

2. I have a CGE Pro and the GPS accessory. I don't understand why SS can't use that accessory to at least get the Lat/Long and time. Yeah, I can enter it manually, but...

3. I'm having some difficulty understanding the difference between the Home Position and the Switch Position in the context of the SS menus. NexStar automatically moved the mount to the switch position BEFORE an alignment - SS doesn't do that, I have to do it by selecting switch position from the scope settings, then go back to the align prompt. And there was a "Park" position that the SS seems to do when I select "Home" But the manual says that the Home position moves the mount to the switch position. Nope.

That said, I'm really encouraged by the comments I've read from first time users as to the accuracy of this device. The microUSB connection and the fact that the SS uses the Linux OS suggests that there may be some exciting things coming. wouldn't it be cool if this could also autoguide once alignment is done? My hope is to get the initial alignment done tonight - clouds permitting.

BTW, I got mine from Agena Astroproducts in just a few days. They may have more in stock, though I had my order in back when the unit was first announced and waited through all the postponements. I was actually pleased with those postponements hoping that they were beta testing and updating the unit so that it would be truly ready for the public. Oh, and in regard to some of the comments I've seen regarding the price of this, as an IT professor at a university I can really appreciate the programming required to make this unit do what it does. Programming takes time and money. Product design also takes time and money. So I do NOT begrudge Celestron in any way for the pricing on this unit. I want them to make a profit and stay in business to continue to provide us with the tools we want for this hobby. So those who think it's overpriced, shut up!

Jeff


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