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milby
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: Arthur Dent]
      #5632548 - 01/20/13 01:25 AM

Art, you are far, far too kind, but thanks. The feedback from this board has been SO helpful in my struggles with this marvelous, frustrating technology!

Tel, I used the Maxim DL mosaic program, which in my limited experience seems to be pretty effective provided the images are photographed with very similar circumstances (these were the same night, same parameters, etc.) I will have to look into the one you mentioned. Shame about the rodent problem lol!

Clear skies!

Edited by milby (01/20/13 01:28 AM)


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Maverick199
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: Tel]
      #5632609 - 01/20/13 03:52 AM Attachment (28 downloads)

Milby, your image are stunning as usual, gettin' used to them now, so don't drop your guard, we are expecting more of these, be warned.

Lovely image of the Moon Tel, glad ICE was helpful.

Had a chance yesterday to take in some views and felt the transparency was good enough for a quick imaging session of 20 minutes with M 42. Nothing to compare to Milby's and others but from my yard, I am happy.


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Tel
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: Maverick199]
      #5632716 - 01/20/13 07:53 AM

It's fine Haseeb ! You are even incorporating the area of sky occupied by the "Running Man" !

Perhaps next time you get the opportunity to image the same though, try taking one set of images at, say, this exposure and another set at, say, a quarter of the time ? (Obviously you'd need to adjust exposure times as you think best for the prevailing conditions).

The result of each individual stack could then be overlayed to give both details of the gaseous filaments, while not overexposing the region around the "Trapezium" in the final image. Indeed it should be quite possible to retain the "Trapezium" stars themselves within the image.

If you think you might have any difficulties in producing and/or processing along these lines, (and of course only if you've a mind to attempt this), let me know and I'll try to help.

Best regards,
Tel


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Skip
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: Tel]
      #5633042 - 01/20/13 11:48 AM

Hi Tel,

Hey buddy, it looks like you need a "better mousetrap"!!


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Arthur Dent
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: milby]
      #5633043 - 01/20/13 11:48 AM

Quote:

Art, you are far, far too kind, but thanks.




On the contrary, credit where credit is due

These are images that I would be proud to have taken (and I'm a perfectionist)!

Art


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Maverick199
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: Tel]
      #5634565 - 01/21/13 09:33 AM

Hi Tel, now that you mentioned it, I did take some 15 secs images to. Only when I try to blend the outcome is a disaster or perhaps I am doing this wrong. I used the quick tool to cut the core and try to paste the one with the 15 secs. Is this correct? I am sure it can be as simple as this.

Thank you.


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milby
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: Maverick199]
      #5635834 - 01/21/13 10:16 PM

Haseeb, this is a useful video tutorial on layer masks in photoshop:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=THlwDf4zDDo


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Maverick199
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: milby]
      #5636277 - 01/22/13 06:18 AM

Thanks Milby. I have seen a couple of tutorials and need to study them more carefully step by step.

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Tel
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: Maverick199]
      #5636316 - 01/22/13 07:13 AM

Hi Hasseb, Hi Milby,

That's an excellent tutorial, Milby. Mind you, I think I'll have to watch it a few times in order to digest its content fully !

But as Doug remarks on this "Youtube" video, there are many ways of effecting layering; this way being prefered by him.

As mentioned, I found it very informative, but I also believe that the quality of the image will ultimately dictate the best method to employ, in turn, to get the best out of it. I once heard once that apparently there are 17 Photoshop ways of tackling any processing task ! How true that is, I don't know but I do know that there are quite a few "wrinkles" one can use to get around processing problems !

Sorry, Haseeb, but could you refresh my memory; did you say at one juncture you were using Photoshop Elements ? In any event, what you describe you did with your 15 second exposures, sounds to be on the right track.

Is there however any possibility you could post your stacked 15 second exposures here in jpeg format so that I could take a shot myself at layering them, in order to possibly allow "Trapezium" visibilty ?

Best regards,
Tel

Edited by Tel (01/22/13 09:26 AM)


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milby
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: Tel]
      #5637092 - 01/22/13 02:57 PM Attachment (20 downloads)

well, the skies are clear here but it's 7 degrees F and blustery so in the interest of keeping my digits I'm foregoing data acquisition!

Still tinkering with M42. I've had a go in Pixinsight, which has an HDR composition program that is somewhat more sophisticated than the PSE layer masks I'd used before. These are two sets of images ( 20x100s subs plus 20x5s) integrated at the linear stage via that program, then after stretching I used the HDR wavelets tool to bring out the details in the core. If anyone is interested in the full workflow in Pixinsight I'd be happy to provide it.


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Skip
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: milby]
      #5637177 - 01/22/13 03:42 PM

Not to be a killjoy, Milby, but I thought the Trapezium came out clearer in your previous go at it.

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milby
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: Skip]
      #5637202 - 01/22/13 03:51 PM

Possibly in this compressed form. On my machine this original full size version is far superior to the Photoshop one and the trapezium is well resolved.

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Skip
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: milby]
      #5637492 - 01/22/13 06:21 PM

Anyway, it's a beautiful image!

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Maverick199
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: Tel]
      #5638256 - 01/23/13 05:28 AM

Hi Tel, I will post in Jpeg format as soon as I get home. Thanks. I use Photoshop Elements 9.

Milby, another great image, well done.


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Maverick199
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: Maverick199]
      #5638711 - 01/23/13 11:19 AM Attachment (19 downloads)

Hi Tel, here's the 15 sec stacked and converted to Jpeg. I had to reduce file size too. No processing done.

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Maverick199
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: Maverick199]
      #5638718 - 01/23/13 11:23 AM Attachment (16 downloads)

And this one by applying 'Auto levels'.

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Tel
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions new [Re: Maverick199]
      #5639093 - 01/23/13 03:20 PM

Thanks. Haseeb.

I've only just arrived home :20:15h. UT. Please gIve me therefore a little time to see what we've got here and what might be done.

Best regards,
Tel


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Tel
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions [Re: Tel]
      #5645457 - 01/27/13 04:22 AM Attachment (19 downloads)

Hi Haseeb,

Many apologies for taking so long in my attempt to layer your 30 second exposure image with its 15 second counterpart in order to try to preserve something of the core over that which was originally blown out.

I can tell you though, that I spent a few, (puzzling), hours on both Thursday and Friday in vain; trying to get an alignment of the two layers after which I did no more but consult my much more capable good friend and CN colleague, Tom, (Haytor), asking him to confirm that these two images would indeed not align.

True to form, Tom, demonstrated to me that he had had no problem aligning the two exposure times which obviously caused some head scratching on my part, leading me to the conclusion that I had been trying to align stars on each exposure which, although looking as if they should be aligned, clearly were not the same !

So, having been shown the error of my ways, (thanks to Tom), layering once again became its normal simple task and I was able to go on to process the composite image.

As you can see, I have been able to reduce the glare from the original blown out core to something approximating a reinstatement of the Trapezium and the three stars adjoining it, although the scale of the image precludes any greater detail. I have also made the image a little harsh which can be adjusted, but at least I think it gives you an overall idea of what can be achieved by layering two or more exposure times when and where necessary, as is the case with the extensive dynamic range of the Orion Nebula !

Best regards,
Tel

Edit: For the life of me, (Guinness perhaps ?), I couldn't understand why the spelling of "in vane", ( as was above), looked totally wrong but I could not fathom it until just now .....

Too much Don Quiote and his windmills perhaps ?

Edited by Tel (01/27/13 10:32 AM)


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Maverick199
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions [Re: Tel]
      #5647303 - 01/28/13 01:18 AM

That outcome is wonderful Tel and thank you for the same. I also thank Tom who helped out.

Did you use the first image ( without auto levels ) or the second one?

I assume you used Photoshop CS to do this as with Elements 9, I am not sure if the outcome will be as neat. As I informed you earlier, I tried doing the alignment with 'quick tool' and the outcome was murky ( I must have spent more than an hour for sure ). This one you did is really neat and does not even look as if the layer has been merged. No artifacts present.

Would it be appropriate to request listing down step by step process, if not a short video on youtube. Thanks again.

Don Quixote btw. ( too much guinness )


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haytor
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Re:NexStar AP Graduates Images and Discussions [Re: Maverick199]
      #5647483 - 01/28/13 06:54 AM

Hi Haseeb,

as Tel has already said, at his request, he asked me to download your original processed 30 second exposure image along with the 15 second exposure(without auto levels)and its always great to talk to him on the phone, to see if i had the same problem with layering the two images, i had no problem, and it soon became apparent to Tel why he had a problem, this he figured out for himself so kudos to Tel,so any input be me was slight if any.

Anyways ,as Tel had asked me to try this layering i did so, below is my take on your capture after layering.

I must admit, that my aim was to layer both images so as to hold the trap without blowing it, i think i have done that, however that came at a cost, yours and Tels images are brighter and has more contrast, i found in holding the trap cost me both those elements, also the colour is not exactly the same in my image compared to yours and Tels, but then again i`m not a colour processer.

BTW,i have rotated the image to the left, just a personal like though.Also i note in the top left of the image a hint of the running man.

Anyways for what its worth here my try.



best regards,

Tom.


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