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Equipment Discussions >> Equipment

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rmollise
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Reged: 07/06/07

Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: Sarkikos]
      #5648360 - 01/28/13 02:32 PM

Quote:

Rod,

Quote:

The Telrad isn't perfect--just better than anything else.




Give me time ... I'm working on that.


Mike




Go got it!


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beatlejuice
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Reged: 04/05/11

Loc: Hamilton, ON,Canada
Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: Sarkikos]
      #5648375 - 01/28/13 02:39 PM

Quote:

I wouldn't be surprised if someone hasn't mounted a Telrad on an ST80 or binoculars!




Guilty, I am a 'Telradista'



Eric


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t.r.
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Reged: 02/14/08

Loc: Upstate NY
Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: rmollise]
      #5648378 - 01/28/13 02:40 PM

Quote:

Man, you'll really cringe when you learn that there's a Telrad on the 48" UK Schmidt at Siding Spring Observatory, and on the 60" at Mount Wilson




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6GuEswXOXo


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demiles
professor emeritus
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Reged: 11/07/06

Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: t.r.]
      #5648402 - 01/28/13 02:52 PM

As you may know Mike I use the Telrad exclusively on my Dob,no optical finder for me. Having to add two more dew heaters and more battery power for the optical is the only reason I don't use one. FYI I have no issues finding objects/star hopping, red dots are all I ever used. I do use the Rigel finder on small refractor.

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Jon Isaacs
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Reged: 06/16/04

Loc: San Diego and Boulevard, CA
Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: Tom Polakis]
      #5648547 - 01/28/13 03:52 PM

Quote:

If you don't care for the three rings, the high-profile Rigel Quickfinder seems like it would be the preferred option.




The Rigel appears to be taller than the Telrad but if you measure the height of the reticule, they are within 1/8" of each other.

I have 4 scopes with Telrads, they all have magnifying finders as well. When the skies are dark and clear, I use the Telrad most of the time. It's particularly handy for identifying unknown objects.

I suspect the ES finder won't be a replacement for the Telrad. The TFoV of the Telrad is huge.

Jon

Edited by Jon Isaacs (01/28/13 03:56 PM)


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mountain monk
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 11/06/09

Loc: Grand Teton National Park
Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: Jon Isaacs]
      #5648649 - 01/28/13 04:35 PM

I tried to love the Telrad; I failed. The mounting plate is still on my Dob because when it is really cold, below zero, it keeps on working like a champ when everything else gets too sluggish (Sky Commander) or fails (GLP). I do use lithium batteries.

Dark skies.

Jack


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Jon Isaacs
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Reged: 06/16/04

Loc: San Diego and Boulevard, CA
Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: mountain monk]
      #5648736 - 01/28/13 05:12 PM

Quote:

I tried to love the Telrad; I failed. The mounting plate is still on my Dob because when it is really cold, below zero, it keeps on working like a champ when everything else gets too sluggish (Sky Commander) or fails (GLP). I do use lithium batteries.

Dark skies.

Jack




It took me a while to warm up to the Telrad. I had a few scopes with Telrads and I replaced them with magnifying finders and I was happy with that. Then I purchased a scope with both a Telrad and a magnifying finder and learned how to use the Telrad effectively because I had the magnifying finder as a backup.

These days, unless the scope has a short enough focal length that it can serve as a magnifying finder, Telrads are still accompanied by magnifying finders but the Telrads do most of the work when the skies are dark.

Jon


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Sarkikos
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Reged: 12/18/07

Loc: Suburban Maryland, USA
Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: beatlejuice]
      #5648778 - 01/28/13 05:30 PM

Quote:

Quote:

I wouldn't be surprised if someone hasn't mounted a Telrad on an ST80 or binoculars!




Guilty, I am a 'Telradista'



Eric




Yes, I've seen this syndrome before ...


Mike


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Sarkikos
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Reged: 12/18/07

Loc: Suburban Maryland, USA
Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: demiles]
      #5648804 - 01/28/13 05:39 PM

Dwane,

Quote:

As you may know Mike I use the Telrad exclusively on my Dob,no optical finder for me. Having to add two more dew heaters and more battery power for the optical is the only reason I don't use one. FYI I have no issues finding objects/star hopping, red dots are all I ever used. I do use the Rigel finder on small refractor.




Come on now, even though you don't use an optical finder, I know you use something besides the Telrad to star hop. Don't you have SkySafari on a SmartPhone or other gizmo? Then you put in a nice wide-field low-power finder eyepiece to star hop before you go to a higher power EP? The only difference is that I use my optical finder as the finder.

Telrads might be nice, but they can't do it all.


Mike


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demiles
professor emeritus
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Reged: 11/07/06

Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: Sarkikos]
      #5648820 - 01/28/13 05:46 PM

Yes I use Sky Safari on a smartphone, with its telrad circles it makes finding things easy. The longest focal length EP I have is 22mm and it hasn't been used in but made 3-4 times last year. One night I was finding objects at 380x because I was too lazy to remove the barlow under the 14mm, it was cold that night. My 14mm is my finder EP.

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mountain monk
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 11/06/09

Loc: Grand Teton National Park
Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: demiles]
      #5648862 - 01/28/13 06:03 PM

Jon,

Well, we both have NP-101s and 31mm Naglers, and with those you barely need a finder. I've even used an old cardboard tube (the remains of a roll of TP) when my laser battery failed. I find that a GLP makes everything fast any easy. With the Dob...well, I am still learning and I will use anything that helps, so I won't be getting rid of the Telrad anytime soon.

Dark skies.

Jack


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mikey cee
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Reged: 01/18/07

Loc: bellevue ne.
Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: t.r.]
      #5648882 - 01/28/13 06:16 PM

Quote:

I hate the Telrad! I have turned down the purchase of used scopes because it was mounted to them. In my mind it devalues them. I think for dobs they may be the right choice, but when I see these slapped on top other scope types...I cringe!!! Just me and my own hang-up!


I'm of the same belief. They add nothing to a scope's looks especially classics. Only possible exception would be a dob. Mike

Edited by mikey cee (01/28/13 06:21 PM)


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Jaimo!
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Reged: 10/11/07

Loc: Exit 135 / 40° North
Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: mikey cee]
      #5648992 - 01/28/13 07:08 PM

I have resisted using a telrad for years, thinking they look klunky... But then I got one. Used in conjunction with my Stellarvue F50 RACI on the Z12, I don't have much trouble finding many things. I find it very useful.

Also you can leave it on for months and the batteries will still be working... If not, it is usually easy to find an AA lying around somewhere.
Jaimo!


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Sarkikos
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Reged: 12/18/07

Loc: Suburban Maryland, USA
Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: demiles]
      #5649050 - 01/28/13 07:35 PM

Quote:

Yes I use Sky Safari on a smartphone, with its telrad circles it makes finding things easy. The longest focal length EP I have is 22mm and it hasn't been used in but made 3-4 times last year. One night I was finding objects at 380x because I was too lazy to remove the barlow under the 14mm, it was cold that night. My 14mm is my finder EP.




Going from Telrad and Sky Safari straight to star hopping at 380x is pretty impressive. I have done something similar except I have a good optical finder as intermediary. Usually, though, my Baader Zoom is in the main scope so I can avoid switching eyepieces.

Mike


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Mike B
Starstruck
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Reged: 04/06/05

Loc: shake, rattle, & roll, CA
Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: mountain monk]
      #5649078 - 01/28/13 07:47 PM Attachment (4 downloads)

Quote:

when it is really cold, below zero, it keeps on working like a champ when everything else gets too sluggish (Sky Commander) or fails (GLP)




In discussing this with the owner of Z-bolt Lasers (John), he supposedly has a new GLP out that handles the cold better... he's had requests for such from MORE than just the astro community.

Perhaps this, plus some type of quick-release cover for between-use insulation, might enable the year-round use of the GLP. I totally agree, tho- the Z-Bolt i use is so quick, easy, and intuitive, that i don't generally even use an optical finder; the GLP, good charts, DSC's, and 2/3 degree in the main scope, and i'm rockin'!

Guess i should add to that list *typically mild night-time weather*... which i am VERY thankful for- make no mistake about THAT!

Yes, i used a Telrad for a brief period... in between the since-forever optical finder period, and now the GLP phase. In fact, my GLP rides on a base-plate that mounts in my scope's Telrad shoe. The Telrad was okay... in darker skies where there were more stars visible to work with. Still, i was generally unimpressed. Even rigged mine with the pulse-mode & dew-hood (yeah, they dew over faster than ANYthing else on the whole scope!)... and now it sits in a box.


Personally, i'd be makin' efforts toward getting a cold-weather GLP functional... but that's me. YMMV.


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Sarkikos
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Reged: 12/18/07

Loc: Suburban Maryland, USA
Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: Jon Isaacs]
      #5649081 - 01/28/13 07:49 PM

Jon,

Quote:

I suspect the ES finder won't be a replacement for the Telrad. The TFoV of the Telrad is huge.




One of the great features of both the Telrad and the ES finder is that they are straight-through erect-image non-reversing. The natural orientation is the easiest and simplest for getting one's initial bearings in the sky and beginning the process of star hopping to the intended object. And because of the natural orientation, both Telrad and ES finder have a large surrounding skyview beyond the window or eyepiece that blends into the view of the finder. The advantage of the ES finder is that the section of sky shown in the eyepiece is magnified and shows dimmer stars than can be see with the naked eye - or Telrad.

I have mounted 6x30 straight-through finders on my scopes when all I want to do is observe the Moon and bright planets. These little finders have an inverted image, but that's OK when the object is bright and easy. All I need to do is get it in the crosshairs and quickly switch to the main scope. For non-tracking scopes, these finders are superior to a Telrad/Red-Dot for lunar/planets, because the magnifying finder helps to recenter the lunar feature or planet when a high-power eyepiece is in the focuser.

However, when I'm observing DSO, I want that initial aid for star hopping to have the natural orientation. For me, this view is easiest when consulting printed star charts. It's also easier when using software like SkySafari with my Dobs. First, I have SkySafari in the natural orientation which matches the naked eye view and the view through Telrad or ES finder. It also matches the view in my 15x70 optical finder, which has an erecting Amici prism. When I look in the focuser of my main scope, all I need do is turn the tablet or star chart upside down to match the view in my Dob. I don't need to keep switching orientation settings in SkySafari.

Of course, when I use the ES finder with my C6, that will all change.

Mike


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faackanders2
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 03/28/11

Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: Sarkikos]
      #5649185 - 01/28/13 08:25 PM

There are several good telrad laminated finder charts that make it very easy to find DSO:
1. Messier Objects by Skyspot/Brent Watson
2. Overlooked Objects by Skyspot/Brent Watson
3. 300 best DSOs
4. Hershel 400
5. Off the Beaten Path by Jim Beliega
6. Muslitle DSOs four volume for each seacon by Jum Beliega

Plus others

With 3 circles it is easy to find some geometrical arrangement to allign scope (and remember some for the longterm also).


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faackanders2
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 03/28/11

Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: faackanders2]
      #5649204 - 01/28/13 08:37 PM

Even with dew or ice I can still use the telrad. Since we have two eyes I use one eye looking at the telrad circles and the other eye looking at the location in the sky (bypassing the telrad) and the brain superimposes both images, hence you can still use it to find objects. I only stop observing when all eyepieces dew or ice up (or I get tired or cold).

My 8x50 find almost always dews up and then I can't use it. 8x50 finder is only good when I can see object in it at 8x.

Telrad is good anytime.


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Starman1
Vendor (EyepiecesEtc.com)
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Reged: 06/24/03

Loc: Los Angeles
Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: Sarkikos]
      #5649224 - 01/28/13 08:46 PM

Comments on my favorite finders:
Telrad
I have one on my 12.5" and on my 5" Mak. The ultra-wide field of view, the ability to see faint stars through the reticle image, the 3-circle calibrated bullseye, the ultra-long life of the batteries, the ease of getting it aligned to the scope because of its longer length (when installing), its lightweight character, and the availability of replacement parts all make this the best 1-power finderscope, in my opinion. I don't find it too close to the tube--I find it perfect. It's also usable as a right-angle finder on mag.3 stars or brighter (perfect for planets and bright stars like Rigel and Sirius--the sky is reflected and the reticle seen directly (requires dimmest setting).
Issues: 1. looks cheap.

TeleVue StarBeam
Like the Telrad, and unlike other red dot finders, you can see extremely faint stars through the lens. The red dot gets dim enough, is calibrated in size, the finish and machining match the quality of high-end scopes like TeleVue's, the ease of alignment beats the heck out of the Telrad, and the blinker is nice. Slightly smaller field of view than the Telrad.
Issues: 1.too close to the tube--closer than the Telrad. 2.short battery life if you accidentally leave finder on.3.Price.(but it is well made).

Explore Scientific 8x50 straight-through correct image (STCI) finder.
The true field is wider than the claimed 6 degrees. The straight through nature makes it possible to easily aim the scope since the eye is looking in the same direction it's pointing. The image is fairly clean except out near the edge. The quality is high and it looks good enough for an expensive scope. The reticle's center circle is large enough to see some objects through it and has tick marks at intervals (nice).
Issues: 1.short eye relief. 2.Too close to the tube with the provided mounting.3. No mounts for flat finder boards. 4. Illuminated reticle WAY WAY too bright on dimmest setting (fixed with two drops of dark brown fingernail polish on the LED). 5.Short battery life in illuminator. 6.Tightening the focus retention ring forces the front lens out of focus, requiring several tries to achieve focus. I fixed this with plumber's tape on lens focus threads to increase friction and decrease slop, eliminated the focus retention ring, and now focus with no retention ring necessary.

I've used all 3 finders, and like them all. And, I recommend them all. I had a RACI finder on my Maksutov and got rid of it. RACI finders are just too difficult to aim, though they work fine if used in conjunction with some form of red dot 1-power finder.


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smallscopefanLeo
sage
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Reged: 01/23/11

Re: Should I Get Rid of the Telrad? new [Re: Starman1]
      #5649540 - 01/29/13 12:07 AM

Tsk, tsk. So much anti-Telrad blasphemy in here (sips some more Telraid)
I just ordered my third one two days ago ... I'll be Telradding till I die


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