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Equipment Discussions >> Mounts

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jrcrillyAdministrator
Refractor wienie no more
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Reged: 04/30/03

Loc: NE Ohio
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: Mkofski]
      #5777351 - 04/04/13 10:47 AM

Quote:

I assumed that the design was done in the US because Meade is located here not because of the inferior quality of the design.




That is how I read Chris's comment.


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dscarpa
Post Laureate
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Reged: 03/15/08

Loc: San Diego Ca.
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: Mkofski]
      #5777384 - 04/04/13 10:58 AM

Given how heavy the tripod is I would have expected more from it. I've done the same thing as you did with my CG5 using my overweight C9.25 with no problems. Which OTA did you have on it? David

Edited by dscarpa (04/04/13 11:04 AM)


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EFT
Vendor - Deep Space Products
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Reged: 05/07/07

Loc: Phoenix, AZ
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: Mkofski]
      #5777416 - 04/04/13 11:07 AM

Quote:

Cliff,

I received a call late today from Jose at Meade. His supervisor decided that they should pay for the return shipping. I would much rather that the tripod did not fail but Meade has decided to take care of it the way they should have.

I still think that it is a great mount for under $1000. If I'd had $2500 or more for a mount I guess I would have looked elsewhere.




Thank goodness for that. Making you pay return shipping would be silly. I would consider this a major problem at this point. One unit failing could be a fluke, but it is clearly no longer a fluke. I think that we all move our fully loaded units on occasion so you should not feel that you contributed to the problem in any way.


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Jmax
professor emeritus
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Reged: 09/28/10

Loc: Alabama
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: Mkofski]
      #5777427 - 04/04/13 11:11 AM

Mine, which I got in November, has a black hub, not gray. Is it possible that they have changed something since you got yours, perhaps because of the other failures? When you get your replacement, please let us know if it is black as well.

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Mkofski
Pooh-Bah
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Reged: 07/19/11

Loc: Greenfield, Indiana, USA
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: Jmax]
      #5777446 - 04/04/13 11:18 AM

Jmax,

I received mine last September. As soon and I get the replacement I'll see if there are any obvious changes in the design.


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Mkofski
Pooh-Bah
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Reged: 07/19/11

Loc: Greenfield, Indiana, USA
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: EFT]
      #5777471 - 04/04/13 11:35 AM

Quote:

I think that we all move our fully loaded units on occasion so you should not feel that you contributed to the problem in any way.




Thanks Ed... Moving the mount shouldn't have caused the failure but, unless there is a design change, I won't be doing it again!


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Mkofski
Pooh-Bah
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Reged: 07/19/11

Loc: Greenfield, Indiana, USA
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: dscarpa]
      #5777479 - 04/04/13 11:39 AM

David,

I had 2 80mm refractors a finder and a DSLR on it at the time. I don't think the load was over 20 pounds. That plus the 70 pounds of mount, tripod and 1 counterweight is a bit much for me to pick up and move. It wouldn't have been a problem 20 or 30 years ago!


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JimMo
I'd Rather Do It Myself


Reged: 01/08/07

Loc: Under the SE Michigan lightdom...
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: Mkofski]
      #5777579 - 04/04/13 12:32 PM

Quote:

David,

I had 2 80mm refractors a finder and a DSLR on it at the time. I don't think the load was over 20 pounds. That plus the 70 pounds of mount, tripod and 1 counterweight is a bit much for me to pick up and move. It wouldn't have been a problem 20 or 30 years ago!




Yes, this is a heavy load which is why I'm making a rolling platform to easily get it out of the garage to the patio. I can pick up and move just the mount and tripod but it is still heavy and unwieldy.

I solved the tripod hub problem by buying a replacement from Jack H. made out of aluminum. I think he only made two or three before abandoning the LX80. Mine still works amazingly well in alt/az and it'll be a good "grab and go" when wheeled out and I can choose between a few different OTA's to use on it. I figure I'm stuck with it so I better make the best of it.


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Mkofski
Pooh-Bah
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Reged: 07/19/11

Loc: Greenfield, Indiana, USA
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: JimMo]
      #5777620 - 04/04/13 12:50 PM

JimMo,

In retrospect I should have ordered one of Jack's replacement heades for the tripod but couldn't see spending over $200 to fix a problem on an $800 mount.

I have a 3 wheel cart for the mount but it won't roll in my gravel driveway. I still need to carry the whole set up another 50 to 200 feet. I think a pier would solve a few problems.


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Starhawk
Space Ranger
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Reged: 09/16/08

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: Mkofski]
      #5777698 - 04/04/13 01:16 PM

Mike,

You are not at fault.

While 70 lbs. is a lot for a human being to move around, it is not a lot for a component this large made from an engineered material to support. It should be able to take several hundred pounds before failure.

There are two problems with this part:

(1) the material is unusually brittle. They really should have something more ductile than this, which would result in bending before breaking. Look for signs of bending before the break happened. I am guessing there are none- it looks like a brittle failure. Common aluminum castings should have much better ductility.

(2) The tray shaped part of the casting is shallow- and irrationally so. See where the bolt standoffs are? It would have been almost exactly the same cost to make a part with the entire rim flange going to that depth, and including webs which attached to those features at the full depth. Even with the inferior material choice, that would have likely yielded a trouble-free part. The sharp interior corners aren't just stress concentrations- they cause casting imperfections due to flow entraining bubbles and rapid cooling at these locations. Another option would have been to use the king of cheap but ductile materials: steel. However, given the way tripods are an off-the-shelf component, there is some reason to ask why the heck Meade would get caught up in designing one, anyway.

-Rich

Edited by Starhawk (04/04/13 01:28 PM)


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Footbag
Postmaster
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Reged: 04/13/09

Loc: Scranton, PA
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: cn register 5]
      #5777711 - 04/04/13 01:20 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:


Where was it designed? Probably the USA.
Chris



Ya might wanna keep comments like that to yourself....



It looks like a poor design to me, for the reasons I stated, and so it seems just as relevant to consider where it was designed as well as where it was manufactured. If the location of either activity matters at all.

It might take nothing more than a modification to the mould to fix it, radius the sharp edges.




Remember when items were designed and manufactured in the same facilities. That way the actual engineers could confirm the parts are working off the line as they are supposed to? It wasn't that long ago.

Now, it seems like companies receive numerous containers of product before realizing it has flaws and at that point it is too late. Seems like an easy way to have a product launch destroy your business.


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OzAndrewJ
scholastic sledgehammer
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Reged: 11/30/10

Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: cn register 5]
      #5777965 - 04/04/13 03:36 PM

Gday ???

Quote:

It might take nothing more than a modification to the mould to fix it, radius the sharp edges.





There was a huge thread a few months back on this when David D broke his.
Lots of other piccies in there as well.
Three glaring problems i saw ( based on the load the unit is supposed to support ) are
a) The side flange/skirt is not deep enough.
b) The underneath stiffeners should be going to a point behind each of the outer leg support lugs, not the centre point between them.
c) If the top isnt strengthened, then the legs should have a lower spreader unit so that the top of the legs do not act like a crowbar at the upper connection when under load.

What you are seeing here is a classic tearing shear failure.

Andrew Johansen Melbourne Australia


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Mkofski
Pooh-Bah
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Reged: 07/19/11

Loc: Greenfield, Indiana, USA
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: OzAndrewJ]
      #5777969 - 04/04/13 03:39 PM

Yes Andrew, it is still a Gday... After weeks of cloudy nights, I was finally going to get back to the mount to give AP another try. Maybe in a week or so.

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Mkofski
Pooh-Bah
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Reged: 07/19/11

Loc: Greenfield, Indiana, USA
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: Starhawk]
      #5777976 - 04/04/13 03:43 PM

Quote:

Mike,

You are not at fault.

-Rich




Rich,

Thanks... I really thought it should have handles the stress I put on it.

I do hope Meade takes what they have learned and make the necessary changes in the mount/tripod.


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Daud
sage


Reged: 08/05/06

Loc: AZ, Scottsdale
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: Mkofski]
      #5778004 - 04/04/13 03:58 PM

The mount is on $800 closeout sale at OPT. Change (=LX85?) coming ?

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Jmax
professor emeritus
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Reged: 09/28/10

Loc: Alabama
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: Mkofski]
      #5778060 - 04/04/13 04:23 PM

After looking at your picture again, and unless I am badly mistaken, mine is definitely different. I'm fairly sure that mine does not have a bubble level on the hub at all. I know mine has one on the side of the actual mount itself. I am not at home right now to take an actual look, but I am pretty sure this is one difference. I know the hub is still very thin, but I am hoping that the material it is made from has changed along with the color. I'll let you know more when I actually get home and can look at mine.

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Mkofski
Pooh-Bah
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Reged: 07/19/11

Loc: Greenfield, Indiana, USA
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: Daud]
      #5778096 - 04/04/13 04:37 PM

Quote:

The mount is on $800 closeout sale at OPT. Change (=LX85?) coming ?




Dave,

Do you know if OPT is charging shipping at the $800 price. Hands On Optics had a "new" open box mount for sale at $750.

Hope that an 85 is in the offing and that Meade makes upgrading feasible. That last part may be a bit too much to hope for.


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Mkofski
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Reged: 07/19/11

Loc: Greenfield, Indiana, USA
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: Jmax]
      #5778119 - 04/04/13 04:48 PM

Quote:

After looking at your picture again, and unless I am badly mistaken, mine is definitely different. I'm fairly sure that mine does not have a bubble level on the hub at all. I know mine has one on the side of the actual mount itself. I am not at home right now to take an actual look, but I am pretty sure this is one difference. I know the hub is still very thin, but I am hoping that the material it is made from has changed along with the color. I'll let you know more when I actually get home and can look at mine.




John,

Hope the difference is more than cosmetic. I just got an email from Meade stating that my replacement will ship next week. I kind of expected it to be a bit faster than that.

If this mount had met the published specs, I think it would have been a real boost for Meade. I can't believe that it wouldn't make at least as much difference to their bottom line as the LX850.

I'm about ready to save up for a second mount to cover times like this. Maybe a Celestron AVX or one of the lighter offerings from iOptron. I REALLY wanted the LX80 to work out but I'm about ready to give up on it. I had a CG5 for a while and liked it a lot. Don't ever see myself spending $2,500 our more on a mount. Of course things can change. 5 years ago I couldn't imagine spending $1,000 on a book but that changed...


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ur7x
sage


Reged: 01/08/12

Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: dscarpa]
      #5778175 - 04/04/13 05:23 PM

I agree, my CG5 has been bumped, soaked, frozen and overloaded and like a Timex watch from the 70's it just takes it and comes looking for more.

If a 2 degree twist, with a completely loaded mount is all it took for this failure that is a shockingly bad design. Lucky no OTA was injured here.


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budman1961
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Reged: 02/25/11

Loc: Springfield, MO
Re: LX80 tripod failure (another) new [Re: ur7x]
      #5778191 - 04/04/13 05:35 PM

In another thread, Jack Huercamp had a heavier-duty tripod head made custom. You might take a look through the long LX80 thread, and see if that better suits you.

Andy


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