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Equipment Discussions >> Eyepieces

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russell23
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 05/31/09

Loc: Upstate NY
Re: ES 28mm 68 degree new [Re: Starman81]
      #5787939 - 04/09/13 12:20 PM

Quote:

RD doesn't bother me either, but really surprised to here about noticeable dimming in the Pan 27 vs ES68 28.

BTW, another ES68 28 hit the used market, but on that other site...




Just to be clear. I never did a direct side-by-side between a 27mm Pan and a 28mm ES68. What I was saying is that when I did have a 27mm Pan, one of the reasons I sold it was that I felt like I was losing light. I do not feel the same with the 28mm ES68. BillP reported similar results when comparing the 24mm Pan to the 24mm ES68 if I am remembering correctly.

As for RD, it was so bad in the 27mm Pan that I don't need to do a side-by-side to know that the 28mm ES68 is significantly better in that aspect.

Dave


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Schaden
sage


Reged: 06/30/08

Loc: Sonoran Desert
Re: ES 28mm 68 degree new [Re: CollinofAlabama]
      #5789049 - 04/09/13 08:13 PM

Quote:



It's been said before by Jim Barnett and others, as the exit pupil gets larger, finer distinctions between eyepieces of 90% equivalence, differences that can and do show up at the planetary focal lengths (i.e., sub 1.5mm exit pupil views), are less pronounced and so subtle they become somewhat negligible. That's my take




This is interesting. Does that apply to all ep designs like orthos and plossels? So if you're on a budget, it's better to splurge on the shorter focal lengths ? So if I were buying some new ep, like an 8mm for planetary and a 20-25mm for DSO, it would be smarter to get an 8mm TV plossel or Brandon and go more generic with the 20-25mm, assuming budget wouldn't allow top of the line for both sizes ?

That is especially good news on widefield ep, since the longer focal lengths are always more expensive. Those 24 and 30mm ES82's are a real bargain compared to the equivalent Naglers.


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CollinofAlabama
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 11/24/03

Loc: Lubbock, Texas, USA
Re: ES 28mm 68 degrees new [Re: Schaden]
      #5789276 - 04/09/13 10:38 PM

Jim Barnett once wrote he felt the ES 82* line were essentially 86% as good as the Nagler line. I'd say this is somewhat variable, again, depending on the exit pupil, and therefore focal length. The lower focal length models perform closer to 80%, while the longer focal length models perform closer to 90%. So, even tho I found the Pan 27 to frame things slightly better than the corresponding Meade 28mm SWA, the difference was genuinely very, very close, and certainly not $100 (or $200+) better, IMHO.

A personal revelation was here. And once something like that happens to you, you just can't ignore it. I'm now a big Brandon and Nagler T6 fan for planetary. I have a weight restriction regarding eyepieces, so I don't personally want to own a 1.25" that weighs over 10 oz. But I do believe from reading here on CN that the Pentax XW, TV Delos, and, tho not in the same weight category, Baader Classic Ortho lines of eyepieces would perform very well. I have a friend who's owned a number of TV Ethos, so I know they perform very well first hand. When I was younger, I loved the shorter focal length TV Plossls, but age and experience caught up with their über short eye relief, and, tho optically very good performers, are just too much for me to own, nowadays. Any of these, should perform very well, however. I'd splurge in the lower focal lengths on them, tho the BCOs are hardly hardly expensive.

Additionally, I can strongly recommend a good Barlow. I own an old school Orion made in Japan, 4.5" long 1.25". These are no longer sold by Orion, tho there may be others still selling the longer, i.e., non-shorty barlows. I know the TeleVue 2x and 3x barlows are not shorty types. Get one of those to turn your mid-focal lengths into longer eye relief high performance short focal length equivalents. With very good glass (and a good Barlow) this works very well. Absolutely love my Brandon 12mm model barlowed. Don't use it stand alone very often (I have the Nagler T6 11 & 13mm's), but paired with my old school Orion Barlow, planets, the moon, and tight double stars, look out!


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BDS316
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 09/16/09

Loc: Sol 3
Re: ES 28mm 68 degrees new [Re: CollinofAlabama]
      #5790211 - 04/10/13 12:28 PM

Quote:

Jim Barnett once wrote he felt the ES 82* line were essentially 86% as good as the Nagler line. I'd say this is somewhat variable, again, depending on the exit pupil, and therefore focal length. The lower focal length models perform closer to 80%, while the longer focal length models perform closer to 90%. So, even tho I found the Pan 27 to frame things slightly better than the corresponding Meade 28mm SWA, the difference was genuinely very, very close, and certainly not $100 (or $200+) better, IMHO.

A personal revelation was here. And once something like that happens to you, you just can't ignore it. I'm now a big Brandon and Nagler T6 fan for planetary. I have a weight restriction regarding eyepieces, so I don't personally want to own a 1.25" that weighs over 10 oz. But I do believe from reading here on CN that the Pentax XW, TV Delos, and, tho not in the same weight category, Baader Classic Ortho lines of eyepieces would perform very well. I have a friend who's owned a number of TV Ethos, so I know they perform very well first hand. When I was younger, I loved the shorter focal length TV Plossls, but age and experience caught up with their über short eye relief, and, tho optically very good performers, are just too much for me to own, nowadays. Any of these, should perform very well, however. I'd splurge in the lower focal lengths on them, tho the BCOs are hardly hardly expensive.

Additionally, I can strongly recommend a good Barlow. I own an old school Orion made in Japan, 4.5" long 1.25". These are no longer sold by Orion, tho there may be others still selling the longer, i.e., non-shorty barlows. I know the TeleVue 2x and 3x barlows are not shorty types. Get one of those to turn your mid-focal lengths into longer eye relief high performance short focal length equivalents. With very good glass (and a good Barlow) this works very well. Absolutely love my Brandon 12mm model barlowed. Don't use it stand alone very often (I have the Nagler T6 11 & 13mm's), but paired with my old school Orion Barlow, planets, the moon, and tight double stars, look out!




Is your old school Japanese Orion barlow the ultrascopic or the "fully baffled" version? Both have been highly recommended in the past


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CollinofAlabama
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 11/24/03

Loc: Lubbock, Texas, USA
Re: ES 28mm 68 degree new [Re: Tim D]
      #5791346 - 04/10/13 09:36 PM

Tim, duh, forgot to mention about the 2" filters. Honestly, haven't put one on the ES yet, but I also owned the Meade predecessor of this one and it accepted my 2" Orion O-III filter no problem. This summer I'm sure to put in the O-3 on the Veil, but just hasn't happened yet.

Bryan, mine is one of the "FULLY BAFFLED" ones. I'd attach an image but on the iPhone, I can't do it. For shame.


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Tim D
super member


Reged: 10/08/10

Loc: Temecula, CA
Re: ES 28mm 68 degree new [Re: CollinofAlabama]
      #5791383 - 04/10/13 09:57 PM

That's good news, I have problems with the threads on my Hyperion Zoom in the 2in mode with my Orion 2in filter. The fix I use is the Orion Centering Adapter that has threads for 2in filters.
Tim


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Schaden
sage


Reged: 06/30/08

Loc: Sonoran Desert
Re: ES 28mm 68 degrees [Re: CollinofAlabama]
      #5791499 - 04/10/13 10:42 PM

Quote:

  I'd splurge in the lower focal lengths on them, tho the BCOs are hardly hardly expensive.

Additionally, I can strongly recommend a good Barlow. I own an old school Orion made in Japan, 4.5" long 1.25". These are no longer sold by Orion, tho there may be others still selling the longer, i.e., non-shorty barlows. I know the TeleVue 2x and 3x barlows are not shorty types. Get one of those to turn your mid-focal lengths into longer eye relief high performance short focal length equivalents. With very good glass (and a good Barlow) this works very well. Absolutely love my Brandon 12mm model barlowed. Don't use it stand alone very often (I have the Nagler T6 11 & 13mm's), but paired with my old school Orion Barlow, planets, the moon, and tight double stars, look out!




Thanks again for the tips. A good barlow is on my list. Currently using the generic that was included as a promotion when I bought my C8 nexstar. I'm leaning towards the TV x2.

Yeah I originally planned to get the 6.7 ES82 next but hanging around the ep forum has made me want to try a "less glass is more" approach. I don't get to truly dark skies often, so I really like observing Saturn and Jupiter. I still remember Mars in 2003. I saw Syrtis Major and the ice caps with only a C8 during a public outreach at the local university.

I'd love to get a 12mm Brandon like yours, along with an 8mm TV plossel. And maybe a 10mm BCO or wait for one of the new UO HD orthos to round things out. Those 3 eyepieces with a good barlow would have me covered for high power observing.


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CollinofAlabama
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 11/24/03

Loc: Lubbock, Texas, USA
Re: ES 28mm 68 degrees new [Re: Schaden]
      #5792008 - 04/11/13 09:45 AM Attachment (11 downloads)

If you can find one of these on CN Classifieds, AM, or now the new S&T Classifieds, I'd get it. Excellent for smaller, low weight 1.25" eyepieces. Wouldn't want to put an Ethos on it, but handles TV Plossls, Brandons, orthos without a hitch.

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