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Equipment Discussions >> Mounts

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tboconnor
member


Reged: 01/14/10

Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: gmartin02]
      #5816572 - 04/22/13 11:35 PM

This is really great news - I have one of the older hand controllers - will I be able to update it with this firmware?

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wolfman_4_ever
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 07/15/11

Loc: El Segundo, Ca, So. Cal
Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: tboconnor]
      #5816629 - 04/23/13 12:14 AM

looks like Derik just released 31.11 beta and it for the cgem's and cge-pro's..

Go join the beta team!


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gmartin02
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 04/11/05

Loc: Santa Clarita, CA
Re: CGEM motor cogging [Re: tboconnor]
      #5817755 - 04/23/13 03:11 PM

Quote:

This is really great news - I have one of the older hand controllers - will I be able to update it with this firmware?



I am pretty sure the answer is "Yes". I think any of the CGEM supplied HCs can be used to upgrade the newest HC or MC firmware. It's best to upgrade to the most recent "official release" HC (4.21) & MC (6.17) versions and make sure those work on your mount before trying a beta MC version.

You can check your firmware versions by using the Version option on the Utility menu in the HC.


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svtdoug
sage


Reged: 02/07/11

Loc: Gig Harbor, WA, USA
Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: gmartin02]
      #5832603 - 04/30/13 03:37 PM

Beta testing going well, now have third version this month. Only remaining small bug is we are getting some bumps in dec guiding when using anti-backlash settings, if the dec changes directions. No reports of any dec cogging from about a dozen testers.

Jointly, Derik from Celestron is testing the same firmware version for CGE Pro mount. If you have a CGE Pro mount, Derik needs beta testers badly. If you can test - please go to TeamCelestron.com, register and follow the thread on Firmware/MotorControl/Version 31.15.

Thanks,
Doug


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WesC
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 02/06/13

Loc: La Crescenta, CA
Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: svtdoug]
      #5832813 - 04/30/13 05:23 PM

Cool, thanks for the update. I haven't started AP with my CGEM, but I have a feeling this will be a must have when I do.

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TimP
member


Reged: 02/24/09

Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: svtdoug]
      #5832891 - 04/30/13 05:57 PM

This is great news. Thanks for updating the post.

Tim


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tboconnor
member


Reged: 01/14/10

Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: TimP]
      #5832967 - 04/30/13 06:39 PM

I've been using the beta for a few days. I haven't really

Y been able to properly test it for AP, but I like the way the. Motors behave when slewing. Seems a lot more precise for some reason.


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svtdoug
sage


Reged: 02/07/11

Loc: Gig Harbor, WA, USA
Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: tboconnor]
      #5881172 - 05/23/13 09:39 PM Attachment (41 downloads)

We thought the new motor control firmware would be released by now, but there have been several users with strange results, and Derik is exploring whether they are due to hardware issues or the firmware.

But here is proof that the new firmware solves the dec cogging issue. This image is my first with my C8 at the full 2000mm fl. I never was able to guide well enough to attempt before.

This image consists of 23, 5min frames, with no throw-outs. It was shot 3 days before a full moon, on 4/22/13, so it did have some gradient issues, but I was pretty pleased with the guiding.

M-51
CGEM with 31.17 beta MC firmware
C8 OTA
ST80 and SSAG for guiding
Modified Canon XSi
Captured with Backyard EOS, stacked with DSS, processed with PS-3.

Doug


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Raginar
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 10/19/10

Loc: Rapid CIty, SD
Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: svtdoug]
      #5881602 - 05/24/13 03:36 AM

Wow Doug, gorgeous

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Stew57
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 05/03/09

Loc: Silsbee Texas
Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: svtdoug]
      #5881843 - 05/24/13 09:36 AM

I wish they would have just fitted the VX motors into the CGEM/DX. Would solve the 8/3 error and the cogging. Seems a waste to spend all this time developing firmware that will have to be replaced if motors and control board are changed. I hope they are still going to do the change. I do hope they have not changed their mind.

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gmartin02
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 04/11/05

Loc: Santa Clarita, CA
Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: svtdoug]
      #5882255 - 05/24/13 12:59 PM Attachment (27 downloads)

Nice shot Doug (I think I have seen it before on a TeamCelestron post).

Here is more proof that the Dec cogging issue is fixed. The attached picture is of M92

Specifics:

Scope: AT8RC w/AP CCDT67 focal reducer - f/l about 1090mm
Camera: Canon T2i w/Astronomik CLS clip-in filter @ISO 1600
Guiding: Tak FS-60 w/Orion SSAG guide camera
Set of 13 - 4 minute stacked subs combined with set of 13 - 45 seconds stacked subs.

I could never do 4 minute guided subs with the CGEM at this focal length & weight without massive star trailing until using the new beta firmware.


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gmartin02
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 04/11/05

Loc: Santa Clarita, CA
Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: gmartin02]
      #5882270 - 05/24/13 01:05 PM Attachment (22 downloads)

Here is another image with the new beta firmware on the CGEM.

Same scope/guiding setup as above.

M81, 16 - 400 second subs stacked


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Ron (Lubbock)
sage


Reged: 08/17/12

Loc: West TX
Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: gmartin02]
      #5882387 - 05/24/13 01:57 PM

You guys are killing me with your nice images. I can't download the new MC firmware due to a communication issue with the hand controller port. I upgraded the HC firmware successfully to 4.21, and something suddenly stopped working (probably a bad cable or driver issue). Can't connect to the HC at all, even with NexRemote. I'm waiting for replacement cables from AstroGadgets.com to arrive. I hope it's just a bad electrical connector and I can install the new firmware. Until then, I have to get perfect Dec. alignment to avoid the dreaded sawtooth pattern. Oh well, it's a full moon week anyway.

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Raginar
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 10/19/10

Loc: Rapid CIty, SD
Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: Ron (Lubbock)]
      #5882397 - 05/24/13 02:01 PM

Don't we need to see pictures over 480secs to prove that it's actually gone? Without it, you've just confirmed that it works within a worm gear cycle. I always had success at 5 minutes or so, I never got much beyond that.

Can you guys remove your reducers too? It'd be nice to see long focal length shots. 1000mm and longer exposures would be great .

Chris


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WesC
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 02/06/13

Loc: La Crescenta, CA
Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: Stew57]
      #5882448 - 05/24/13 02:32 PM

Yeah, I'd buy a retrofit kit of that, Stew57!

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WesC
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 02/06/13

Loc: La Crescenta, CA
Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: Raginar]
      #5882453 - 05/24/13 02:34 PM

Quote:

Don't we need to see pictures over 480secs to prove that it's actually gone? Without it, you've just confirmed that it works within a worm gear cycle. I always had success at 5 minutes or so, I never got much beyond that.

Can you guys remove your reducers too? It'd be nice to see long focal length shots. 1000mm and longer exposures would be great .

Chris




Well, both of them said that they were never able to do exposures of this length before, so its definitely a huge improvement!


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EFT
Vendor - Deep Space Products
*****

Reged: 05/07/07

Loc: Phoenix, AZ
Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: WesC]
      #5882496 - 05/24/13 02:58 PM

Quote:

Yeah, I'd buy a retrofit kit of that, Stew57!




That's exactly why they have to take care of the issue with firmware. If there is a retrofit, it will not be free because it is not absolutely required. Thus, the most sensible way to handle things is to get the existing units fixed with an "easy" no-cost to the consumer firmware upgrade. Then, they can either sell a retrofit package or service for people that want that and change the future mounts if that ends up being desirable. The wisest choice was to come up with a firmware fix first that would cost the existing owners nothing to implement.


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Ron (Lubbock)
sage


Reged: 08/17/12

Loc: West TX
Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: WesC]
      #5882506 - 05/24/13 03:02 PM

This image is a recent M101 comprised of 43 x 15 minute (900s) subs at 1280 mm. I have not upgraded to the new version of MC firmware- this was taken with the old software. You've just got to absolutely eliminate Dec. drift to get long subs. with a CGEM. I would also be suspicious of anyone who uses a guide scope and blames their CGEM for elongated stars. Some of these people may be disappointed when they upgrade the MC firmware and find out that their stars are still elongated.



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gmartin02
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 04/11/05

Loc: Santa Clarita, CA
Re: CGEM motor cogging new [Re: Raginar]
      #5882741 - 05/24/13 05:22 PM

Quote:

Don't we need to see pictures over 480secs to prove that it's actually gone? Without it, you've just confirmed that it works within a worm gear cycle. I always had success at 5 minutes or so, I never got much beyond that.




Chris, The firmware fix is to correct an issue with Dec guiding. Dec guiding issues have nothing to do with worm gear cycles.

Quote:


Can you guys remove your reducers too? It'd be nice to see long focal length shots. 1000mm and longer exposures would be great .

Chris



My picture of M81 above was shot with a reducer on a telescope with a native 1625mm focal length - the reducer effectively shortens the focal length to about 1090mm (over 1000mm). The pictures were 400 seconds (6 minutes & 40 seconds), which are the longest I have tried so far, but I plan to try longer images in the future.

Greg


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Ron (Lubbock)
sage


Reged: 08/17/12

Loc: West TX
Re: CGEM motor cogging [Re: gmartin02]
      #5882795 - 05/24/13 05:49 PM

The M101 image above was taken at about 1280 mm, which is easy on my mount with proper polar alignment. I have done imaging at 2000 mm with the old firmware, but it was difficult, with frequent lost guide stars in Ph.D. guiding. I hope the new MC will make 2000 mm a reality for me so I can do more small targets.

Good news: I was able to upgrade to MC v 31.15 this afternoon, and I will try it out this weekend. The problem was an Ativa USB-RS232 adapter that had trouble communicating with the hand controller. I am told there are many of these USB-serial cables out there that won't work for the firmware update because the drivers don't talk to the CGEM hand controller properly. Be aware of that before buying one online. I got the other adapter from AstroGadgets.com and it works fine. The Ativa cable is going back to the local store where I bought it.


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