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Equipment Discussions >> Classic Telescopes

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Steve_M_M
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 06/09/04

Loc: Moorpark, CA
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: turk123]
      #5870729 - 05/19/13 03:52 AM

Quote:

Here is where it is all happening.




Great looking shop. Incredible work you are doing on the Cave. It will be beautiful when it is done.


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Masvingo
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 01/10/12

Loc: Ayrshire, Scotland
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: Steve_M_M]
      #5871669 - 05/19/13 02:58 PM

Really enjoying this post, Turk. It's wonderful seeing the refurbishment process step by step. I wish I had your skill (and energy!)

James


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turk123
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 07/09/10

Loc: N.E. Ohio
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: Masvingo]
      #5871882 - 05/19/13 04:23 PM

Quote:

Really enjoying this post, Turk. It's wonderful seeing the refurbishment process step by step. I wish I had your skill (and energy!)

James




I don't know about skill. Most of the "skills" I learned right here reading other's restorations. Now the energy is another story. You really have to want to do this. Getting your hands greasy, burned, dirty, oily, cut, smashed, stained, painted, scraped, and bloodied has to be a fun thing for you. The results are your goal and it gives you a great feeling of accomplishment. Try it sometimes, James.


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starman876
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 04/28/08

Loc: VA
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: turk123]
      #5872698 - 05/19/13 10:26 PM

Sounds like you are working on a classic car

same results


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johnlynch
member
*****

Reged: 02/08/09

Loc: virginia
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: starman876]
      #5874199 - 05/20/13 04:36 PM

Incredible!

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Greg Eckes
member


Reged: 03/23/10

Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: turk123]
      #5875085 - 05/21/13 02:25 AM

Tom, I am going to clean and adjust my rings on my Cave 12.5" scope. 1. Are they attached to the tube with screws and nuts or only screws? 2. My rings allow the tube to be rotated. Do your rings rotate? 3. How did you get to rings apart? It looks like I have to take the whole scope apart to get them off.

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turk123
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 07/09/10

Loc: N.E. Ohio
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: Greg Eckes]
      #5875260 - 05/21/13 07:28 AM Attachment (21 downloads)

Quote:

Tom, I am going to clean and adjust my rings on my Cave 12.5" scope. 1. Are they attached to the tube with screws and nuts or only screws? 2. My rings allow the tube to be rotated. Do your rings rotate? 3. How did you get to rings apart? It looks like I have to take the whole scope apart to get them off.




Hi greg. Your rings are different than the Cassegrain's that do not rotate. Here is a picture of my 10" that does have the rotating rings. First you need to remove the support shafts running from ring to ring. The outer ring comes off by loosening the Hex head (large lower nut in the picture. Loosen the hex head not the nut.) There are four of these on mine. The shining outer aluminum ring has a large enough gap after removing the screws, to slip off one of the ends. You would have to remove the aluminum tube end to get it off. The inner ring is held by the small screws with nuts on the inside (small screw upper picture). If you want to remove them from the tube, it is important to choose the shortest distance from their location to the end of the tube to slip them off. Use either powder or soap underneath the inner ring to get it to slip without marring the painted tube surface. They are machined to fit quite close to the tube and need to be carefully slid down to the tube end that has the end ring removed.

The most important part of all this is mark your rings for position on the tube. 1st ring, 2nd ring, which small screw holes line up with on the tube, front back of each ring. The holes that are drilled in the tube and or the rings are all different and not symmetrical in any way.Mark them with tape at first and then add marks to the inside of the rings on the metal for alignment later (I use a hole punch to make marks especially, if you are going to polish or paint the rings causing you to cover any marks you've made).

Edited by turk123 (05/21/13 07:28 AM)


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turk123
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 07/09/10

Loc: N.E. Ohio
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: turk123]
      #5875264 - 05/21/13 07:34 AM Attachment (19 downloads)

You can see the gap between the inner and outer ring. There should be a white teflon or plastic piece that contacts the inner ring and allows it to slip. You can see it under the large hex screw in the picture. The hex screw is there to adjust the gap between inner and outer rings. The nut is used to lock your adjustment in place.

Edited by turk123 (05/21/13 07:38 AM)


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dgreyson
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 11/06/12

Loc: South Carolina
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: turk123]
      #5875809 - 05/21/13 12:47 PM

You know, as long as you have the tube standing on end, all you really need to do is back out the teflon plugs and you can take it off as a complete cage assy without messing with the connection rods at all. McMaster Carr has Teflon rod if any of the plugs are worn bad.

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turk123
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 07/09/10

Loc: N.E. Ohio
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: dgreyson]
      #5878946 - 05/22/13 07:46 PM Attachment (16 downloads)

Here is the large shaft as it came out of the housing very early on.

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turk123
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 07/09/10

Loc: N.E. Ohio
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: turk123]
      #5878954 - 05/22/13 07:48 PM Attachment (14 downloads)

I used the aircraft remover to remove all aircraft paint from it and then soaked it with rust remover. I then began wet sanding it.

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turk123
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 07/09/10

Loc: N.E. Ohio
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: turk123]
      #5878960 - 05/22/13 07:52 PM Attachment (15 downloads)

I was able to get it real smooth by continuing to sand with 220 then 600 grit wet sandpaper using the rust remover instead of water. There are still pits and scratches from the counter weights but some are very deep. Most of the damage will be covered by the weights. There are two weights, one 38 lbs. the other about 23 lbs. That's over 60 lbs. !

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turk123
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 07/09/10

Loc: N.E. Ohio
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: turk123]
      #5878991 - 05/22/13 08:10 PM Attachment (17 downloads)

Here are the counter weights. I removed all the paint (3 layers) I de-rusted them, and I wire brushed and sanded them. They just are not going to be what I want. They are pitted with rust (the rust is gone but the pits remain) and need about .005" taken off all sides to get them smooth again. I took them to a friend who has a nine inch lathe. We could not get them to quite fit in the chuck and he said he may have a better way to do this.

We took a ride to the Youngstown airport were my friend Ted had worked for 30 years as an airplane mechanic. He had a friend Rob that is a master machinist. At this location they have a Bridgeport milling machine. What I believe he is proposing is to lay the weight flat and mill off the .005" without turning them. He said he could get a smooth surface without the rough milling grooves that Cave's lathe left in the steel. I believe the curve surface will be done on a much larger lathe than my friend had, and it's surface will also be without the rough grooves.

While there I got to sit in a 34 million dollar corporate jet (one of 7 being worked on in their hanger). I think I'm in good hands.


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turk123
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 07/09/10

Loc: N.E. Ohio
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: turk123]
      #5879002 - 05/22/13 08:17 PM Attachment (16 downloads)

Rob pointed out as he looked at the larger weight, that he could see they tuned it it two steps. If you look closely in the picture, you can see a light area and a darker area on the curved surface of the larger weight. Rob even found the chuck marks left on the outside edge on both sides. "Not the best machining", was his comment, "But probably good enough for the job they do."

I will get pictures when I go back. I was so engrossed in looking at all the planes and engines being worked on, that I didn't get out my phone to take any pictures.


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chuck52
super member
*****

Reged: 12/03/09

Loc: Quartz Hill,California
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: turk123]
      #5879118 - 05/22/13 09:32 PM

Hi Turk,
Great work you are doing and Im really enjoying the rebuild.Some may speak up about this but in the past I have mounted the weights on a piece of bar stock appropriate to their bore(1 1/2 in your case)tightened down the setscrew and was able to turn all faces of the counterweight in one chucking.The counterweights I turned where a little smaller but it might work in your friends 9 inch lathe.What is the diameter of the weights? Again, just a thought.


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turk123
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 07/09/10

Loc: N.E. Ohio
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: chuck52]
      #5879222 - 05/22/13 10:39 PM

Hi Chuck

We thought of that but it would not be exactly centered. There is a little slop in the center hole. The chuck was a 1/16" too large to fit in the hole. The other solution was available and I think much better, so we went with it. Good idea though.


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terraclarke
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 05/29/12

Loc: Just South of the Mason-Dixon ...
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: turk123]
      #5879939 - 05/23/13 10:35 AM

Wow Tom, with each new post you put up about this project I am more amazed. You are making it like new! Absolutely beautiful, meticulous work. That diamond in the rough is certainly becoming a beautiful gem.

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turk123
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 07/09/10

Loc: N.E. Ohio
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: terraclarke]
      #5879999 - 05/23/13 11:12 AM

Quote:

Wow Tom, with each new post you put up about this project I am more amazed. You are making it like new! Absolutely beautiful, meticulous work. That diamond in the rough is certainly becoming a beautiful gem.




Thanks Terra. As my wife says, " Are you obsessing on your telescope again?".


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tim53
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 12/17/04

Loc: Highland Park, CA
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: terraclarke]
      #5880004 - 05/23/13 11:14 AM

Yeah, even if you COULD hold something that big in a 9" lathe, you'd have problems with chattering at that diameter of steel.

This is why I love wrinkle black paints, though!

-Tim.


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turk123
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 07/09/10

Loc: N.E. Ohio
Re: Elli Buk Cave 10" Cassegrain [Re: tim53]
      #5880026 - 05/23/13 11:26 AM

Quote:

Yeah, even if you COULD hold something that big in a 9" lathe, you'd have problems with chattering at that diameter of steel.

This is why I love wrinkle black paints, though!

-Tim.




Hi Tim

I'm going to experiment with wrinkle black for the finder rings and assorted hardware. I just wanted the counter weights to be shiny as shown in the catalog.

Question about paint. It says it has to go on heavy. Do you have to spray the entire part (example: finder rings inside and out) for the wrinkle to look even? Maybe you could give me some pointers.

Edited by turk123 (05/23/13 11:26 AM)


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