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Equipment Discussions >> Eyepieces

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rfic1
sage
*****

Reged: 10/25/05

Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: etsleds]
      #5848380 - 05/08/13 06:12 PM Attachment (35 downloads)

Another for scale. The 60mm SMC Kellner, 40mm SMC Kellner, 30 mm Pentax Kellner and the 5mm SMC ortho.

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jrbarnett
Eyepiece Hooligan
*****

Reged: 02/28/06

Loc: Petaluma, CA
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: rfic1]
      #5848475 - 05/08/13 06:56 PM

Hey, get that non-SMC 30mm "poseur" out of that shot! It's like putting a dollop of ketchup on haute cuisine!



- Jim


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Jim Curry
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 10/29/07

Loc: STL
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: rfic1]
      #5848537 - 05/08/13 07:33 PM

rfc1:

I fold!


Jim


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RodgerHouTex
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 06/02/09

Loc: Houston, Texas, USA
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: Jim Curry]
      #5848674 - 05/08/13 08:42 PM

OMG.

Those collections are "sick"!


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PJ Anway
Double-Star Observer
*****

Reged: 06/04/03

Loc: North Coast
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: Sarkikos]
      #5848702 - 05/08/13 08:53 PM

Quote:

Some observers prefer the XO to the Pentax Ortho. Some prefer the Pentax Ortho to the XO. Some say the XO is at the level of the ZAO. Some even prefer the XO to the ZAO!




I've owned a set of ZAO's, several Pentax SMC's and the 5mm XO. I still have the XO. Personally, I feel it's the best 5mm of those I've used.
As a further note: the 5mm XO was advertised to have "smc full-surface multi-layer lens coating". So I guess it's a Pentax SMC too.


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RodgerHouTex
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 06/02/09

Loc: Houston, Texas, USA
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: PJ Anway]
      #5848724 - 05/08/13 09:05 PM

Interesting. I never knew what SMC stood for.

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Jim Curry
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 10/29/07

Loc: STL
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: RodgerHouTex]
      #5849101 - 05/08/13 11:41 PM

Roger:

Yeah, we bad.

Jim


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Sarkikos
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 12/18/07

Loc: Suburban Maryland, USA
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: RodgerHouTex]
      #5849417 - 05/09/13 08:08 AM

Quote:

Interesting. I never knew what SMC stood for.




Super Multi Coatings.

Mike


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Sarkikos
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 12/18/07

Loc: Suburban Maryland, USA
Re: A Pentax ortho record? [Re: PJ Anway]
      #5849430 - 05/09/13 08:17 AM

PJ Anway,

Quote:

I've owned a set of ZAO's, several Pentax SMC's and the 5mm XO. I still have the XO. Personally, I feel it's the best 5mm of those I've used.




Sounds good to me! I've never owned a ZAO or Pentax SMC Ortho, but I do have the entire line of XO's ... both the 5.1 and the 2.5. I wish Pentax had produced XO's in a 10mm. They would have been great for binoviewing.

Quote:

As a further note: the 5mm XO was advertised to have "smc full-surface multi-layer lens coating". So I guess it's a Pentax SMC too.




Yes, says so right on the barrel.

XO Eyepieces

Mike


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RodgerHouTex
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 06/02/09

Loc: Houston, Texas, USA
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: Sarkikos]
      #5850775 - 05/09/13 07:40 PM

Ah who reads their eyepieces?

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johnnyha
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 11/12/06

Loc: Sherman Oaks, CA
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: etsleds]
      #5850790 - 05/09/13 07:46 PM Attachment (15 downloads)

Quote:

Yep, premium glass prices have been on a crazy tear in the past 5 years. Other than the Nagler zoom, everything here seems to have appreciated 50% in the 3 years since I started my long-term planetary optics comparo (making it bloody expensive to complete some of the sets!).


At this rate, this little set will be worth $1.2 million when I retire in 30 years. Sweet (insanity).




What no bino sets? Oh wait, I DO see a few!


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gnowellsct
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 06/24/09

Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: Sarkikos]
      #5865674 - 05/16/13 07:23 PM

Quote:


Some observers prefer the XO to the Pentax Ortho. Some prefer the Pentax Ortho to the XO. Some say the XO is at the level of the ZAO. Some even prefer the XO to the ZAO!

Mike




I prefer the XOs to the ZAO IIs in the 4 and 6mm range. The ZAO II 10 and 16 are wonderful though. I have yet to figure out why one needs any of this stuff with the XWs sitting there in the same box. The recreational value consists mostly, methinks, in being able to enter a discussion such as this. GN


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Jim Curry
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 10/29/07

Loc: STL
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: gnowellsct]
      #5866431 - 05/17/13 04:40 AM

Shhh.

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Sarkikos
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 12/18/07

Loc: Suburban Maryland, USA
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: gnowellsct]
      #5866602 - 05/17/13 08:23 AM

Greg,

Quote:

I prefer the XOs to the ZAO IIs in the 4 and 6mm range. The ZAO II 10 and 16 are wonderful though. I have yet to figure out why one needs any of this stuff with the XWs sitting there in the same box. The recreational value consists mostly, methinks, in being able to enter a discussion such as this. GN




Good to hear that you prefer the XO's to the ZAO-II 4 and 6. I had read that the ZAO-II 4 was the weakest of the series. I think I'll pass on the 10 and 16, also. Too long a focal length in my primary scopes for planet/lunar unless I Barlow, and then what's the point of simple glass?

So far I prefer the XO's to comparable XW's and Radians for planet/lunar and doubles. To my eye, the XO's have less scatter and an overall sharper image when the seeing allows. That's why I hang on to the XO's. But that doesn't mean I'm going to sell the XW's tomorrow.

Do you have an opinion on the Leica ASPH Zoom? IMO, if the Leica is as good as some observers say, it may replace my XW's. But I don't see it replacing my XO's or even my planet/lunar bino pairs. I can't help but think that the Leica enthusiasts have missed the mark when they consider it a top-tier planet eyepiece - unless perhaps the observer can afford a pair for binoviewing and has a wide enough IPD to accommodate them. I think the Leica's forte probably lies in deep sky.

Mike


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Paul G
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 05/08/03

Loc: Freedonia
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: Sarkikos]
      #5866670 - 05/17/13 09:11 AM

Quote:

I had read that the ZAO-II 4 was the weakest of the series.




Optically the 4 is just as good as any others in the series. However, the 4 has extremely short eye relief, seemed to be the least popular of the series here in the US. I trimmed my eyelashes to observe with it. In Europe the 4mm ZAO I was the most prized of the series, garnering better resale prices than even the 34. Different strokes.

Quote:

I think I'll pass on the 10 and 16, also. Too long a focal length in my primary scopes for planet/lunar unless I Barlow, and then what's the point of simple glass?




True, but a barlowed ZAO has 6 elements in 3 groups, six air-glass surfaces. The XO's unbarlowed have 5 or 6 elements depending on fl, 3 groups, and six air-glass surfaces as well.


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Sarkikos
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 12/18/07

Loc: Suburban Maryland, USA
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: Paul G]
      #5866688 - 05/17/13 09:26 AM

I believe it was BillP who said that he was not so impressed by the ZAO 4mm. From what I've heard, 4mm is a difficult focal length to do right, particularly for small simple glass. Witness the disappointment for the Brandon 4mm as compared to others in that line.

I think there is more to it than just the short eye relief. Personally, I don't let short eye relief deter me when there is a better image to be had. I really like the XO 5.1 at 3.6mm eye relief. The Brandon 6 at 3.6mm eye relief is very comfortable to me. I don't get the big deal about short eye relief unless it is ridiculously short to the point of being nonexistant, such as for the sphere eyepieces.

Mike


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Sarkikos
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 12/18/07

Loc: Suburban Maryland, USA
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: Paul G]
      #5866696 - 05/17/13 09:32 AM

Gus,

Quote:

Quote:

I think I'll pass on the 10 and 16, also. Too long a focal length in my primary scopes for planet/lunar unless I Barlow, and then what's the point of simple glass?




True, but a barlowed ZAO has 6 elements in 3 groups, six air-glass surfaces. The XO's unbarlowed have 5 or 6 elements depending on fl, 3 groups, and six air-glass surfaces as well.




Yes, true. But so far I prefer a well-designed eyepiece with built-in Barlowing to something added after the fact. Besides, I'm fishing for any excuse not to even think about buying the hyper-expensive ZAO's!


Mike


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Sarkikos
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 12/18/07

Loc: Suburban Maryland, USA
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: gnowellsct]
      #5866730 - 05/17/13 09:49 AM

Greg,

Quote:

I prefer the XOs to the ZAO IIs in the 4 and 6mm range.




Too bad the XO's only came in 2.58 and 5.1 flavors. A 4mm would have been nice, and I could have gone for a pair of XO 10mm's for binoviewing.

Mike


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dscarpa
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 03/15/08

Loc: San Diego Ca.
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: etsleds]
      #5866863 - 05/17/13 10:59 AM

Even when barlowed my 24 Brandon when it comes to scatter bests my Delos, XWs, and such native. The darker background and special quality of the image is still there as well. Having all of the 1.25" TV barlows and Powemates I could get enough mileage of a 18 SMC to make it well worth $300 provided it doesn't have icky stuff between the elements. What's their FOV? A 18 SMC would also slot in nicely with the unused 16 Brandon 50th I picked up on Amart for $150. Should be here today! My plan to get a 16 ZOA has been shelved, just too much money. David

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jrbarnett
Eyepiece Hooligan
*****

Reged: 02/28/06

Loc: Petaluma, CA
Re: A Pentax ortho record? new [Re: gnowellsct]
      #5866888 - 05/17/13 11:08 AM

That, or the fact that the XWs are pretty lousy large aperture DSO eyepieces compared to premium simple, low-element designs in some situations.

When I swap TMB Supermonos in for the XWs in the 16" f/5.1, for example, I gain about 5-10% (SOTP) more resolved stars on most globulars. The XWs are lovely eyepieces for casual, general purpose observing, but they don't go very deep compared even to the Ethoses or even the new Deloses, much less any premium simple eyepiece.

But for looky-loos, and fueling goofy Siddarthic posts, XWs are splendid. But for me, the LVWs are much better than the XWs for such purposes. So even in that use case, the XWs are somewhat lacking.

Regards,

Jim

Edited by jrbarnett (05/17/13 11:09 AM)


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