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Astrophotography and Sketching >> Beginning and Intermediate Imaging

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DaemonGPF
Redonkulous
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Reged: 03/22/08

Loc: Aurora Colorado
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: proteus5]
      #5865969 - 05/16/13 10:01 PM

Quote:

C-14 in a permanent observatory at a dark site, or my wife???

Boy I'd miss my wife!!!

(hope she doesn't see this)




Well, I can see I better budget just a tad extra for a very cozy couch in the warm room of the ROR...


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shawnhar
Postmaster
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Reged: 06/25/10

Loc: Knoxville, TN
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: DaemonGPF]
      #5866022 - 05/16/13 10:34 PM

...and back to reality for just a moment....
What is the benefit of the C14 if you are going to use hyperstar on it? I get all "muddy in the brain" when it comes to oversampling and per-pixel resolution but is there any advantage for a 14" scope at 700mm vs. a 5" apo at 700mm? Wouldn't it depend on the pixel size of the camera you plan to use and the average seeing? C14 would do me NO good for planetary or high focal length at my "seeing handicapped" location.
I am really asking, not being facetious.


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DaemonGPF
Redonkulous
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Reged: 03/22/08

Loc: Aurora Colorado
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: shawnhar]
      #5866546 - 05/17/13 07:44 AM

A fair question. Simply put - light. Some things that you can put on a Hyperstar can create a fair amount of obstruction. Which is why I'm not going with an 8" again for sure. I already have DSLRs, and I already have a standard QHY-8. Neither are optimal on a C8. A C92.5 and up is recommended. The C14 in all reality is only going to happen if it is as good of a deal as it appears to be. I'll know before end of day today. Most likely I'll be landing on a C11 if the C14 doesn't happen, but I'd be content with a C9.25.

Also the aperture comes with other benefits. If you think about it - F/2 C8 vs. F/2 C14? All things being equal, who wouldn't take more aperture?

Pushing a C14 to the max is challenging at best. You already outlined why. I'm sure I'd enjoy glances through it, but think of it with a 2x barlow... WOW, but tough to pull off in sub-optimal conditions.


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korborh
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 01/29/11

Loc: Arizona
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: shawnhar]
      #5866909 - 05/17/13 11:21 AM

Quote:

C14 would do me NO good for planetary or high focal length at my "seeing handicapped" location.




How do you know this? Can you not do lucky imaging to get around seeing?

I am also looking for justifying a C14 HD - although as an upgrade from current C11 HD in light-polluted skies.


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DaemonGPF
Redonkulous
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Reged: 03/22/08

Loc: Aurora Colorado
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: korborh]
      #5866967 - 05/17/13 11:57 AM

I think defeating seeing with a high speed camera is a given for any planetary imaging. With a C14 the bigger impactor will be thermal variances and tube currents I believe. Reaching equilibrium will be more time consuming with that big of a scope, unless permanently mounted in or near ambient temps. Following that is the issue I'll have to contend with - no atmosphere and highly variable night time temps. That means the temp can fall faster than the scope might be able to cool.

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shawnhar
Postmaster
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Reged: 06/25/10

Loc: Knoxville, TN
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: DaemonGPF]
      #5867061 - 05/17/13 12:40 PM

Ahhh, didn't even think about the CO issue, that's a pretty big plus!
As for how I know the C14's focal length would not work for my location, it's a guess, I have only had 2 or 3 planetary sessions where the seeing was good enough for the 10" at around 5000mm, although this is only with a dslr at 21 fps. Don't get me wrong, I would LOVE to give a C14 a try with a fast camera!


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PhilCo126
Post Laureate


Reged: 01/14/05

Loc: coastline of Belgium
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: shawnhar]
      #5867171 - 05/17/13 01:12 PM

The EQ-8 might become available in July/August 2013

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michael hester
professor emeritus


Reged: 11/28/08

Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: PhilCo126]
      #5867194 - 05/17/13 01:28 PM

Oooooooo I forgot about hyperstar

If you get Hyperstar in that C14 you'd be set.


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DaemonGPF
Redonkulous
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Reged: 03/22/08

Loc: Aurora Colorado
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: PhilCo126]
      #5867195 - 05/17/13 01:29 PM

You have to admit though, when you see people resolving surface details on Jovian moons like this:

http://celestronsites.com/engineering/files/2012/07/C14_jupiter2010_gany_io_a...

You can't help but be impressed with a C14 and want one. Granted that is Damian Peach and he's good at what he does, but he isn't the only one with that level of success in resolving such details meaning it's not a fluke thing. The C14 has that capacity within it if you know how to apply it properly.


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DaemonGPF
Redonkulous
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Reged: 03/22/08

Loc: Aurora Colorado
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: DaemonGPF]
      #5868218 - 05/17/13 09:51 PM

Update- the C14 didn't come through. TOTALLY trashed. It was sad. Looked at an NS11GPS which was also in fairly brutalized shape. I was feeling the pain for the scopes.

However, one door closes, several other open. I have a few other leads that came together this afternoon. The search continues.


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DaemonGPF
Redonkulous
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Reged: 03/22/08

Loc: Aurora Colorado
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: michael hester]
      #5868227 - 05/17/13 09:53 PM

Quote:

Oooooooo I forgot about hyperstar

If you get Hyperstar in that C14 you'd be set.




That was my first thought when I heard "C14". Too bad this fell through though.. Following the trail of a few more leads though.


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Domerman
Just Lucky, I Guess.
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Reged: 07/21/07

Loc: PA
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: DaemonGPF]
      #5868477 - 05/17/13 11:48 PM

C14s will take forever to cool. Definitely wont cool as quickly as a c11 with professionally installed fans in the back

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DaemonGPF
Redonkulous
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Reged: 03/22/08

Loc: Aurora Colorado
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: Domerman]
      #5869023 - 05/18/13 09:29 AM

Hint, hint? LOL

Just woke up - I'll drop you a PM in a just a few, Steve to follow up on our conversation.


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hytham
Pooh-Bah
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Reged: 12/25/12

Loc: Canadian in the US
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: DaemonGPF]
      #5869768 - 05/18/13 05:24 PM

Man, I have it made.

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DaemonGPF
Redonkulous
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Reged: 03/22/08

Loc: Aurora Colorado
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: hytham]
      #5869848 - 05/18/13 06:04 PM

Man... Terry H was just selling his C14 loaded up for a VERY good price on Amart. The CFO is now aware of the C14 scheme and thinks I've gone off the deep end a bit LOL.

I guess I better go back to my original thinking of C9.25-C11 and get off the "radar". I can wait a bit longer on a "big" setup. She is after all letting me build an Observatory next year and actually suggested that course of action so I can't complain. I figure with the image depth I was getting with my C8, I can't do any worse. That C8 Hyperstar went SERIOUSLY deep when dialed in.


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DaemonGPF
Redonkulous
*****

Reged: 03/22/08

Loc: Aurora Colorado
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: DaemonGPF]
      #5870027 - 05/18/13 07:56 PM

Back to reality - I'm working out a deal on a CGEM DX right now. Decided on a course of action and moving on the rest. Stay tuned!

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ghataa
professor emeritus


Reged: 06/20/11

Loc: Central, NJ
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: DaemonGPF]
      #5870088 - 05/18/13 08:18 PM

Josh,

9.25 or 11?

George


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DaemonGPF
Redonkulous
*****

Reged: 03/22/08

Loc: Aurora Colorado
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? [Re: ghataa]
      #5870517 - 05/18/13 11:41 PM

Closed deal on the DX, it should be here Wednesday.

George, working on that one. I have a few offers on the table. I honestly think at this point a 9.25 would be optimal, but something has me really looking at C11 OTAs.


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ghataa
professor emeritus


Reged: 06/20/11

Loc: Central, NJ
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: DaemonGPF]
      #5871606 - 05/19/13 02:24 PM

I've been plotting to do exactly the same but think the C9.25 is the sweet spot for the Hyperstar.

C8: 425 mm fl
C9.25: 540 mm
C11: 560mm

Given the weight difference between the C11 and the C9.25, the C9.25 seems easier on the mount for only 20 mm FL less than the C11.

George


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DaemonGPF
Redonkulous
*****

Reged: 03/22/08

Loc: Aurora Colorado
Re: Would I be insane going C14?? new [Re: ghataa]
      #5871707 - 05/19/13 03:12 PM

There was nothing wrong with my C8, I really liked how fast it cooled off, and the OTA was compact and light. Unfortunately it really constrains what you can use with it for Hyperstar cameras. When used natively it doesn't give the planetary views you'd get with a 9.25 or 11. The larger OTAs are challenging in a fork configuration because the weight is substantial. Trying to loft them onto a wedge is a tricky proposition. However, in EQ mode the OTA weight by itself is not that bad.

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