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Equipment Discussions >> Cats & Casses

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jimb1001
sage
*****

Reged: 11/14/09

Loc: Florida
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: Spacetravelerx]
      #5988877 - 07/25/13 01:28 AM

We've finally reached the point where there is nothing but hate keeping this thread alive.

Thank god! No need to waste any more time reading it, let alone posting to it.

Feed the haters if you want but that doesn't sound much like fun.


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Starhawk
Space Ranger
*****

Reged: 09/16/08

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: Spacetravelerx]
      #5988879 - 07/25/13 01:30 AM

Exactly what sort of "Large project" would a large company be buying Meade IP for?

-Rich

Quote:

Quote:

Well, for starters it was a guy from ES/ JOC who called several folks to put the David Shen/ Sunny story out and suggest the FTC should be interested.

No real telling what any of that's all about. It's pretty clear MITC didn't think the company was worth more than $3.65/ share, so there seems to be a consensus on very low value here- we're talking substantively less value than a car dealership at this point. So, I'm not sure where the motivation is to get into something which, in a wildly optimistic scenario, has the demonstrated potential to absorb vast amounts of attention and reward you with a 4% rate of return.

It would make more sense to spend the money opening a few laundromats.

-Rich





Though purchasing Meade at a low price could bring some capacity/IP/capabilities to a company that wants to leverage if for a large contract/project. The astronomy sales would be a fun side hobby.




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Spacetravelerx
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 12/23/12

Loc: New Mexico
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: Alph]
      #5988882 - 07/25/13 01:32 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

On a potentially ironic note, if Meade actually goes all the way to Bankruptcy, if Spacetravelerx has a problem with his LX850, Ed's about the only person he'll be able to call.



Rich, That irony wasn't lost on everyone. I'm glad you put it in the thread ... I needed a good chuckle.




I am sure that Spacetravelerx would be able to lubricate the mount all by himself.





Lol, touche Alph, touche.

Yeah, I did see those earlier posts. Very funny...ha ha.

So you guys are curious, what would I do? A fascinating concept!

First I would avoid Deep Space Products like the plague. Grouchy folks there! No bacon for them! Meade - very nice people I spoken with there. Woodland Hills, very friendly and informative. Astronomics, sharp bunch. Heck, I am liking the ES folks a lot - very friendly and very bright!

So if Meade evaporated off the face of the Earth, what is left if the LX850 dies? Lots of options!
-- Contact others in the biz for help
-- Maybe hire a few Meade engineers
-- Fix it myself in my free time in my lab/shop.
-- Salvage what is left. Heck the OTA is wonderful. I would likely eat crow and then get the Paramount ME 2 or AP1100GTO (Boy, you guys would have a field day with this last item...I can see the posts now!).


One last item - I have offered a shoot out against the LX850. No one wants to take me up on it so far. I will still likely do something during the Balloon Fiesta. If no one is up to the challenge, then there will still be a party and observing session.


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Alph
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 11/23/06

Loc: Melmac
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: Starhawk]
      #5988890 - 07/25/13 01:41 AM

Quote:

Dude, you really haven't been keeping up.

-Rich




Yes I admit, dude. it is hard to keep up with all that mumbling.


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Spacetravelerx
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 12/23/12

Loc: New Mexico
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: Starhawk]
      #5988899 - 07/25/13 01:49 AM

Quote:

Exactly what sort of "Large project" would a large company be buying Meade IP for?

-Rich

Quote:

Quote:

Well, for starters it was a guy from ES/ JOC who called several folks to put the David Shen/ Sunny story out and suggest the FTC should be interested.

No real telling what any of that's all about. It's pretty clear MITC didn't think the company was worth more than $3.65/ share, so there seems to be a consensus on very low value here- we're talking substantively less value than a car dealership at this point. So, I'm not sure where the motivation is to get into something which, in a wildly optimistic scenario, has the demonstrated potential to absorb vast amounts of attention and reward you with a 4% rate of return.

It would make more sense to spend the money opening a few laundromats.

-Rich





Though purchasing Meade at a low price could bring some capacity/IP/capabilities to a company that wants to leverage if for a large contract/project. The astronomy sales would be a fun side hobby.







Doesn't have to be a large company. It could be a small or medium company.

I can think of a few projects which uses their optics expertise, mechanical and electrical expertise. I am certain there is a degree of smarts and some valuable technology at Meade. A small/medium business purchases them for dirt cheap which then fills a missing gap for the purchasing business. This leverages a larger contract and wallah - you make some money. When I speak of large, I don't mean $1 Billion dollar space projects. Though there are many in the $30m - $300m range. I can think of applications in aviation too. Lots of ideas...

Of course, I have no clue fully what Meade has in internal secrets, IP, etc, so due diligence would need to be done. But I am guessing there is a nugget or two there that would require further investigation. I know I have 2 or 3 things I could use them on. Though yes, there are other companies to work with in the Tucson area, AP, Questar, ES, etc. All would have to be State side...


BTW - I am quite certain the FTC has been called. Who knows, maybe a Congressman or Senator or two. The FTC is likely aware. It is the smart play. And the logical one.


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Starhawk
Space Ranger
*****

Reged: 09/16/08

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: Spacetravelerx]
      #5988910 - 07/25/13 01:58 AM

Too bad you heard about DOORS from another poster so now that you've looked up what it is you're all busy entering requirements when you aren't buzzing around on southwest, flying your own plane, or climbing up sheer rock faces between sailboat races. I'm surprised something so mundane as astronomy can even get on the schedule!

Your recovery plan for the mount is interesting. I'm sure the Meade folks faced with losing their jobs will sleep a little better knowing There's someone out there who'll give them a job to keep a single LX 850 running. Wait- oh snap!- those things are perfect! He'll never call about a job!

Oh well, back to the grandiose challenge to get set up for video astronomy with exactly the same functions as an LX 850, apparently to be conducted while 300 hot air balloons float by. Luckily, there's an out for someone plopping down a Mach 1 GTO and using the RAPAS finder to be polar aligned immediately, thus winning the challenge: the Mach 1 costs too much! Whoa- you outsmarted me there again! The RAPAS finder is useless if balloons block the view of the North Star!

You've got it all covered!

-Rich


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Spacetravelerx
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 12/23/12

Loc: New Mexico
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: Starhawk]
      #5988941 - 07/25/13 02:44 AM Attachment (31 downloads)

Quote:

Too bad you heard about DOORS from another poster so now that you've looked up what it is you're all busy entering requirements when you aren't buzzing around on southwest, flying your own plane, or climbing up sheer rock faces between sailboat races. I'm surprised something so mundane as astronomy can even get on the schedule!

Your recovery plan for the mount is interesting. I'm sure the Meade folks faced with losing their jobs will sleep a little better knowing There's someone out there who'll give them a job to keep a single LX 850 running. Wait- oh snap!- those things are perfect! He'll never call about a job!

Oh well, back to the grandiose challenge to get set up for video astronomy with exactly the same functions as an LX 850, apparently to be conducted while 300 hot air balloons float by. Luckily, there's an out for someone plopping down a Mach 1 GTO and using the RAPAS finder to be polar aligned immediately, thus winning the challenge: the Mach 1 costs too much! Whoa- you outsmarted me there again! The RAPAS finder is useless if balloons block the view of the North Star!

You've got it all covered!

-Rich





Sigh....

No matter what I say, I will never be right.

So I will keep it real easy...real easy...

* I merely suggested options for fixing the LX850. There are many, which might surprise some! Maybe the issue is there are options outside of DSP? I bet though my LX850 will work for 20+ years like my LX200. Who knows? I might tinker with the thing. I might do a frankenscope like Andrew down under in a few years.
* We have several contracts coming on board between December and February. In some of the embedded work I support their are shortages. We will be hiring.
* Astronomy is not mundane. Is it for you?
* Yes, we work with requirements. I figured the cat was out of the bag last time, and folks knew of DOORS, so why not say something. FYI, my team and I work with DO178B levels A-D in aviation. Requirements are all consuming on any project and DOORS is ubiquitous. We are also developing tools to assist smaller organizations which cannot afford or want to deal with DOORS. Though ALL of my large customers work with DOORS. Yes, I we work with the FAA and DERs.
* Sold my own plane - no time to fly it and stay safely proficient in my book. I love flying, but tough to get time to do it. Plus dealing with weather out west is not pleasant. Icing out in the midwest is not pleasant.
* Southwest Airlines - I love them.
* I don't do sheer face climbs. Too chicken. I love hiking and climbing around the Sandias, the Rockies, Sierras and of course the Pacific Northwest. I hope to do some fun climbing in the Three Sisters Wilderness. BTW, you don't have to be rich to camp. It is simple, cheap and peaceful.
* Balloon Fiesta is a blast dude!
* You may have missed my challenge notice. No video astronomy...I will dig up the challenge info again.

Well enough defending myself.

This is clearly a HIGHLY emotional board.

And I thought the debate of Republican/Democrat, Apple/Microsoft, iOS/Android, Fox/MSNBC, Michigan vs Ohio State (GO BLUE!) was hot. This has to be the most emotionally intense board I have ever witnessed.

Yet, I have met many astronomers around the country. We talk and talk and talk. The connection is instant and friendly. Like a great brotherhood/sisterhood. The minute two folks realize they are in the hobby, it is like being instant friends.

I refuse to believe the mean spirit of this board is indicative of our hobby. If it is, we my friends are toast.

Astronomy is soothing, and spiritually uplifting. I work long nights sometimes. It is wonderful to just step out and look at the heavens.

I am done with the negative mood and spirit, and will dispel it with a happy thought and image.

Attached is an image taken at the top of the Sandia Mountains (10,679') during last May's Annular Solar Eclipse. The picture is of me (the Venturing leader) with one of my students looking through telescopes with solar filters as the event unfolded. It was a wonderful experience for all. It brought tears to my eyes, and a big whoop once the Sun had set (my kids thought the old man was crazy!).

We are looking through a Meade 10" LX200 and the ETX125.

Thank-you very much Meade.

Whether you still exist or disappear, I will always cherish all the great experiences I have had with your instruments.


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bigj
member


Reged: 05/07/13

Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: Starhawk]
      #5988960 - 07/25/13 03:08 AM

AP pre peck trains their mounts no real skill (they call it calibrating). Why do you think they are worth the cost?

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KevH
sage
*****

Reged: 03/08/10

Loc: Maine
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: Pak]
      #5989088 - 07/25/13 07:48 AM

Quote:



The only photos I've seen that were not Jason's were done by GlenS and they were fine for a first attempt. I've seen some by a mysterious person who registered just to post the photos and then disappeared, and I have seen John's where it looks like it might be working out ok for him but not any better than his previous mount(my interpretation)





Pak,

Funny how you failed to mention that John's previous mount was a Tak NJP... I think you win the prize for the most misleading and absurd post in a thread that has become full of both.


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cn register 5
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 12/26/12

Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: bigj]
      #5989089 - 07/25/13 07:49 AM

There seems to be some news about the MITC offer
http://www.sacbee.com/2013/07/23/5589052/mit-capital-incs-tender-offer.html
It's withdrawn, Thanks to Chris Erickson for finding this.

Chris


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rcdk
super member


Reged: 11/13/10

Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: Spacetravelerx]
      #5989094 - 07/25/13 08:00 AM

Quote:


...
This is clearly a HIGHLY emotional board.
...





Try highly immature. There were some good discussions but all a few people managed to add was snark and sarcasm. Some can't even rise to just offering an uninformed opinion in a constructive way. And envy is alive and well, however much it may detract from the discussion.


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Jon Isaacs
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 06/16/04

Loc: San Diego and Boulevard, CA
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: starrancher]
      #5989109 - 07/25/13 08:19 AM

Quote:


Yep Ed . It's in the middle of nowhere alright . I'm 40 miles east of Kingman and 30 miles west of Seligman , five miles from the nearest piece of pavement .




That is out there pretty good. Know the Fort Rock exit well.. Not too many places to stop for the necessities of life along that stretch of the 40... Big, beautiful, open country with some small forest trees if I remember correctly..,

Just to keep this on topic.. Is the Fort Rock Meade dealer still in business?

Jon


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Jon Isaacs
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 06/16/04

Loc: San Diego and Boulevard, CA
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: Spacetravelerx]
      #5989121 - 07/25/13 08:32 AM

Quote:

This has to be the most emotionally intense board I have ever witnessed.




Honestly, I think you have a strong emotional attachment to Meade so I can see that reading this thread would be an emotionally intense experience for you.

But most of us don't have so much emotional invested in Meade and reading this thread is an intellectual experience. I own three Meade scopes and another one with Meade Optics, I like the scopes, they are good scopes but they all from the period when Meade was privately owned.

I follow this thread because I am learning from the likes of Dave and Edd and others. I also follow this thread because there is a certain sadness to see this once giant now floundering. And too, there is a lot of interesting information about Meade equipment that I did not know.

Jon Isaacs


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csrlice12
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 05/22/12

Loc: Denver, CO
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: EFT]
      #5989158 - 07/25/13 09:04 AM

Introducing...the Syntameade....it only takes a thousand steps to work........

Hey, I could be a Meade Developer!! Think of the money I could lose them!! (Sorry, but truthfully, they couldn't have run it into the ground so badly unintentionally. (It's what happens when profits are your only focus....and product/customer service don't matter.)


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csrlice12
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 05/22/12

Loc: Denver, CO
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: starrancher]
      #5989225 - 07/25/13 09:48 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:


I'm looking forward to getting up to Flagstaff next week myself. But I'm sure there won't be much of a chance for clear skies, less I don't bring a scope along.




Flagstaff!? I was just up in Bull Head/Havasu/Mojave doing another hobby. Ah Flagstaff.. wonderful snow hobby town too..




Bulkhead ! ? .... That's a hobby town for me too . It's the hobby of pulling building materials . That town has reaped a lot of revenue out of me . (Lowes) That's why I be so po .





Yep, Bullhead IS a hobby town....and it ain't Lowes....its where the people who work the casinos across the river in Laughlin NV live.....nice river walk though.


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ken svp120
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 12/19/04

Loc: Ohio
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: csrlice12]
      #5989254 - 07/25/13 10:09 AM

What I find most amazing about all of this is that this thread has over 35,000 views and is currently on page 73. This clearly shows there is great interest in this subject. Its an absolute shame we could not have had this discussion a year ago - perhaps in time for someone at Meade to take notice and prompt them to act.

Having this discussion after the fact pretty much makes it a meaningless discussion other than maybe it makes people aware of why it is important to know as much as you can find out about a product and the stability of the company making it. Its far too late for Meade to learn anything but hopefully some folks here have.

Will be interesting to see how the all winds up here over the next few weeks/months.


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Starhawk
Space Ranger
*****

Reged: 09/16/08

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: Spacetravelerx]
      #5989276 - 07/25/13 10:30 AM

I just read your post on hiring ex-Meade engineers for one mount, and my suspension of disbelief completely left me. It's not about being right; I'd settle for plausible at this point.

So, others of us do other things for hobbies. About as intrusive as that gets is as a one-time aside or maybe an avatar photo. Mentions of scuba, trains, spelunking, collecting, and nature photography, or aircraft photography don't get mentioned very often unless it is coincidently relevant to a discussion here, though just bout everyone here has second or third hobbies like those. But your every post follows a pattern of fairly obvious overstatement, time shifting events to make it sound like they are all going on, now, future events have happened, including ones with very specific technical outputs you've said you were going to post. The nicest thing I can think to say about such behavior is it's disingenuous.

As for work references, I mean, really? People on CN literally do everything. Software? Quite a few. Firemen? Yep. Truck drivers? Believe it or not. Engineering? Quite a few. Business owners? yes. Accountants? Yes. Aerospace? A large number. And there are more in a slew more fields. And they all have one thing in common: they're here to talk astronomy. And there are a lot of people here with a lot of competence in that area, compared to anyone. Assuming it's only based on their day job isn't just a mistake, the way it's being posted is an insult, and as often as I have seen it repeated, I have begun to wonder if that isn't the intent.

Your challenge reminds me of an incident years ago when I was in college and worked part time in a Wal-Mart electronics department (which paid just enough to cover expenses in exchange for every minute of my day being accounted for in an unending cycle of class, work, and homework with a couple meals and sleep thrown in). So yes, I worked at Wal-Mart once upon a time. I'm expect you and Alph will have something dismissive to say on that score. The store was right next to a Sam's Club. One day an elderly man came over from there and said, "I want to see you beat a deal at Sam's Club (no idea what he was thinking. Perhaps he was unaware the two sites are part of the same company). I saw a THREE-HUNDRED line 19" TV for $180, and I want to see you beat that price!"

I blinked. "We don't have that- we have TVs with NTSC" (I was going to say 525 line resolution but was cut off by).

No- I don't want something else- I want to see something with THREE HUNDRED LINES OF RESOLUTION at a better price!"

And the department manager touched my shoulder before I said anything else and said, "We just can't beat that. You've already found a deal. I might even head there after work to jump on it."

When he had left with a self satisfied expression on his face, my manager said to me, "You can give people like that all the information to show them what the best deal is, but the truth is, you can't tell them anything, they'll never get it, and they can't tell the difference in the result, anyway."

-Rich

Quote:

Quote:

Too bad you heard about DOORS from another poster so now that you've looked up what it is you're all busy entering requirements when you aren't buzzing around on southwest, flying your own plane, or climbing up sheer rock faces between sailboat races. I'm surprised something so mundane as astronomy can even get on the schedule!

Your recovery plan for the mount is interesting. I'm sure the Meade folks faced with losing their jobs will sleep a little better knowing There's someone out there who'll give them a job to keep a single LX 850 running. Wait- oh snap!- those things are perfect! He'll never call about a job!

Oh well, back to the grandiose challenge to get set up for video astronomy with exactly the same functions as an LX 850, apparently to be conducted while 300 hot air balloons float by. Luckily, there's an out for someone plopping down a Mach 1 GTO and using the RAPAS finder to be polar aligned immediately, thus winning the challenge: the Mach 1 costs too much! Whoa- you outsmarted me there again! The RAPAS finder is useless if balloons block the view of the North Star!

You've got it all covered!

-Rich





Sigh....

No matter what I say, I will never be right.

So I will keep it real easy...real easy...

* I merely suggested options for fixing the LX850. There are many, which might surprise some! Maybe the issue is there are options outside of DSP? I bet though my LX850 will work for 20+ years like my LX200. Who knows? I might tinker with the thing. I might do a frankenscope like Andrew down under in a few years.
* We have several contracts coming on board between December and February. In some of the embedded work I support their are shortages. We will be hiring.
* Astronomy is not mundane. Is it for you?
* Yes, we work with requirements. I figured the cat was out of the bag last time, and folks knew of DOORS, so why not say something. FYI, my team and I work with DO178B levels A-D in aviation. Requirements are all consuming on any project and DOORS is ubiquitous. We are also developing tools to assist smaller organizations which cannot afford or want to deal with DOORS. Though ALL of my large customers work with DOORS. Yes, I we work with the FAA and DERs.
* Sold my own plane - no time to fly it and stay safely proficient in my book. I love flying, but tough to get time to do it. Plus dealing with weather out west is not pleasant. Icing out in the midwest is not pleasant.
* Southwest Airlines - I love them.
* I don't do sheer face climbs. Too chicken. I love hiking and climbing around the Sandias, the Rockies, Sierras and of course the Pacific Northwest. I hope to do some fun climbing in the Three Sisters Wilderness. BTW, you don't have to be rich to camp. It is simple, cheap and peaceful.
* Balloon Fiesta is a blast dude!
* You may have missed my challenge notice. No video astronomy...I will dig up the challenge info again.

Well enough defending myself.

This is clearly a HIGHLY emotional board.

And I thought the debate of Republican/Democrat, Apple/Microsoft, iOS/Android, Fox/MSNBC, Michigan vs Ohio State (GO BLUE!) was hot. This has to be the most emotionally intense board I have ever witnessed.

Yet, I have met many astronomers around the country. We talk and talk and talk. The connection is instant and friendly. Like a great brotherhood/sisterhood. The minute two folks realize they are in the hobby, it is like being instant friends.

I refuse to believe the mean spirit of this board is indicative of our hobby. If it is, we my friends are toast.

Astronomy is soothing, and spiritually uplifting. I work long nights sometimes. It is wonderful to just step out and look at the heavens.

I am done with the negative mood and spirit, and will dispel it with a happy thought and image.

Attached is an image taken at the top of the Sandia Mountains (10,679') during last May's Annular Solar Eclipse. The picture is of me (the Venturing leader) with one of my students looking through telescopes with solar filters as the event unfolded. It was a wonderful experience for all. It brought tears to my eyes, and a big whoop once the Sun had set (my kids thought the old man was crazy!).

We are looking through a Meade 10" LX200 and the ETX125.

Thank-you very much Meade.

Whether you still exist or disappear, I will always cherish all the great experiences I have had with your instruments.




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Stew57
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 05/03/09

Loc: Silsbee Texas
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: ken svp120]
      #5989283 - 07/25/13 10:34 AM

Sad thing is the LX800 thread had over 53000 views. Too bad it was not correct out of the box.

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CottsModerator
Just Wondering
*****

Reged: 10/10/05

Loc: Toronto, Ontario
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: Stew57]
      #5992637 - 07/27/13 09:24 AM

Hi, everyone. This thread has been re-opened after a 'cooling-off time out'.

Please, everyone, play nicely......

It should go without saying (but I will say it anyway) that the Mods and Admin are watching like a hawk..........

Dave


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mayidunk
Don't Ask...
*****

Reged: 02/17/10

Loc: Betwixt & Between...
Re: The plot thickens (Meade takeover) [Re: Cotts]
      #5993262 - 07/27/13 04:30 PM

Thanks, Dave, et al.! Aside from the snarking (though revealing in, and of itself...), this has been a very informative thread. Keeping the thread open will ensure that future remarks will be in context with what has gone before.

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