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Equipment Discussions >> Refractors

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azure1961p
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Loc: USA
Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: CollinofAlabama]
      #5945600 - 06/28/13 09:13 PM

Quote:

. If you've never seen the Eskimo Nebula in Gemini in a finder, you're long tube "gun barrel sight" is going to be much less useful than a shorter tube "gun barrel sight" with a wide field eyepiece in the focuser for that "wait a second" moment of catching the Eskimo for the first time in a low power eyepiece.

It is important for we more experienced astronomers to listen to the OP. He started the post. Let's try and address his needs above our own predilections.




I'm not sure that's a strong point. A low power eye piece for finding small planetary nebula? I'm more on board with at least 60x as a finder ocular and I never but never actually sight in on a planetary with my finder. I locate the star field, star hop at 60x-70x which even at that magnification still leaves many challengingly small. There's a lot to be said for star hopping skills and on invisible objects where only a field is known for finder purposes. I fear GOTO has a backlash effect of astronomers with weak skills in these areas. I also cannot sign onto the notion that Uranus is difficult for any experienced observer with any telescope. Nor Neptune for that matter. I like a lot of your points but have exception with a couple.

Pete


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CollinofAlabama
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Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: mrelliot]
      #5945744 - 06/28/13 10:38 PM

On July 3rd, Venus buzzes the Beehive cluster. Sky and Telescope recommends a 30x view to start. The C80ED with a 25mm Plossl yields 24x in just over a 2* TFOV. In short, it'll be excellent, mrelliot, and you won't need anything else but the scope and a mount. Now you'll certainly need to add a 2" dialectic diagonal and more eyepieces over time, but there'll be time enough for all that later. Get the scope and get started. There are many places to start. But given your own predilections, I'd say get started wih the C80ED and a Portamount. You'll be glad you did. Good luck.

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BigC
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Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: mrelliot]
      #5945796 - 06/28/13 11:17 PM

Quote:

Is it easier to learn the night sky with a dob or an 80mm refractor?



The refractor has the advantage that you need merely to lift your eye from the ocular to see the same part of the sky ,alkbeit reversed in the scope view.I wonder if that is why many Japanese refractor users apparently didn't use diagonals?Note also many old pictures of refractors have no diagonal.

Although most ,including myself, do use diagonals these days(or nights actually;I have a correct image lens for daytime).

Perhaps a trifecta of 80mm f15 OTA carrying a 9x50 finder plus a Telrad ?

If I had to settle on just one refractor telescope I think my C6R with 8x50 finder because aperture rules!(Well,really gold rules,..but that is another story.)


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REC
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Reged: 10/20/10

Loc: NC
Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: Jay_Bird]
      #5946472 - 06/29/13 12:11 PM

Great description and my 80ED is my most "used" scope. Look for one used for under $500.

Good luck and have fun!

Bob


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CollinofAlabama
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Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: REC]
      #5947407 - 06/30/13 12:48 AM

Quote:

Great description and my 80ED is my most "used" scope. Look for one used for under $500.

Good luck and have fun!

Bob




I agree Jay Bird did a good job sizing things up earlier in the thread. Now, one note, REC writes of finding an 80mm ED scope used for under $500, but the Celestron 80ED I linked to in my first post in this thread is for $349 shipped, brand new with a Celestron 1 year warranty to boot! I have no affiliation with Celestron or this vendor. Just saw this great deal and thought I'd pass on the love. Happy 4th, mis estadounidenses.


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REC
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Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: CollinofAlabama]
      #5947661 - 06/30/13 08:30 AM

Wow, if you can find that Celestron 80ED for new at $350 shipped, I'd grab that. I paid that for mine used, great performer!

Bob


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stevenf
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Reged: 10/11/09

Loc: Vancouver, BC
Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: REC]
      #5948281 - 06/30/13 04:06 PM

I thought that Celestron 80ED was discontinued (I would love to have one and have been looking for a used one)so I'm just a little suspicious of this ad.

edited to add: ha, but not so suspicious that I didn't order it anyways after looking into it more Awesome deal!

Edited by stevenf (06/30/13 04:18 PM)


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mrelliot
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Reged: 05/17/13

Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: stevenf]
      #5948378 - 06/30/13 05:16 PM

On Celestron's website, it says that the C80ED is discontinued.

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CollinofAlabama
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Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: stevenf]
      #5948389 - 06/30/13 05:23 PM

Stevenf,

I think you're right, it has been discontinued, but Astronomers Without Borders (never heard of them before now) is indeed selling them for $349 shipped, new! That's why I wrote its the best deal in refractors right now, cause it is. I think Celestron did some deal with them regarding excess, discontinued inventory, because they're not being produced any more, but they do come with a manufacturers warranty and are one fantastic deal. This is why I've recommended it so to mrelliot.


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stevenf
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Reged: 10/11/09

Loc: Vancouver, BC
Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: CollinofAlabama]
      #5948404 - 06/30/13 05:32 PM

Thanks very much for pointing out that deal Collin. My first ED refractor! And free shipping to Canada! I already can't wait to get it into my hands

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CollinofAlabama
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Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: mrelliot]
      #5948414 - 06/30/13 05:45 PM

Mrelliot,

See my above post. You're right, they are no longer being produced and are, in fact, a discontinued item. For that matter, my AT80ED is a discontinued item, too, but every night I take it out, do you think it performs more poorly because of that fact? The C80ED was a great scope and it's still being sold while supplies last by Astronomers Without Borders, with a Celestron warranty. Once they're gone, they shall not be sold new anywhere else again.

However, the CN sponsor, Astronomics, does sell the AT72ED, with a 2 year warranty, and it's still in production as far as I know. Although this one may not have quite the aperture grasp of the C80ED, it will have an even greater TFOV and comes with a hard aluminum carrying case, which is nice. And it only costs $30 more, so still a good deal if you prefer something still in production.

In early 2008, my wife had just gotten her PhD, a new management job, and was looking for a new car. We accidentally drove into the local Mercury dealership (she was absolutely convinced she wanted a Nissan, Toyota, Mazda, etc, because "Japanese were better"). We had a Corolla budget, and we test drove a used Camry with 60000 miles on it. But, finally, the salesman got her to try a 2007 model Mercury Milan (same as the Ford Fusion), they had on the lot because it was a standard and we live in a lazy part of Texas where the locals don't want to be bothered by such, but my wife and I are completely comfortable driving. She fell in love with it. As we test drove the Corolla, Sentra, Hyundai-style cars in this class, she was struck by the price and features of the last year's model Milan. Five years later, she is convinced that when we replace my car, it should be with a Mercury! The C80ED from AWB is an excellent, rare-find deal.


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mrelliot
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Reged: 05/17/13

Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: CollinofAlabama]
      #5948435 - 06/30/13 06:00 PM

I don't really care if a scope is in production or not, there just harder to find then new ones.

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CollinofAlabama
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Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: stevenf]
      #5948493 - 06/30/13 06:50 PM

Stevenf,

Glad I could help. I remember a few years back when Meade blew out their 80mm doublet line for a similarly low priced offer -- I told all our Club members about it and the President picked one up. He's been very happy with it since. These deals come along once in a blue moon. Fortunately Astronomics has the AT72ED so even if someone misses the killer deal, this one is always available, and it has its own charms, indeed. Glad things have worked out for you, tho, Stevef.


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pdxmoon
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Reged: 06/27/13

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Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: KWB]
      #5949876 - 07/01/13 03:18 PM

Quote:

Kinda like this one,Collin?




Kenny, what is this scope?


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pdxmoon
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Reged: 06/27/13

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Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: pdxmoon]
      #5949976 - 07/01/13 04:08 PM

Can you point me to some links as to what I'd need to mount the The C80ED on a tripod? I'd rather use an altar than an eq. I'm interested in this package as a lunar grab and go scope. (Also I'm a newbie, so links and pictures help!)

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azure1961p
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Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: pdxmoon]
      #5950359 - 07/01/13 09:16 PM

I haven't a link but my 70mm anyway does great on its video tripod 15 yrs or more old, as well as a BOGEN. When they get this compact its amazing what'll work. What doesn't work however are Quantaray tripods. There's a flimsy limit to how light a light grab n go can go and the flexure in even a more *costly* (heh) Quanta is just beyond reason and any measure of patience. Light in one thing , plastic springboard is another.

I keep promising it a GOTO GEM but its so easy to use without tracking - well its still on a BOGEN or Zenith.

Good luck though.

Pete


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KWB
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Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: pdxmoon]
      #5950474 - 07/01/13 10:24 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Kinda like this one,Collin?




Kenny, what is this scope?




It's the Celestron 80 ED,the same scope that was mentioned earlier in this thread. Evidently it is available on a limited basis again,after being discontinued a couple of years ago. For the price of $350.00 new,it rates as a major bargain optically as in what can be purchased as of July,2013. This setup is a breeze getting outside and then back indoors fully assembled.

What it takes to mount this refractor to the Vixen Portamount is to also purchase the optional Vixen dovetail bar and a set of rings(which bolt to the dovetail bar) to clamp down the OTA(Optical Tube Assembly).


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sg80
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Reged: 07/29/07

Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: CounterWeight]
      #5969712 - 07/13/13 10:19 PM

More than you realize. I want a 120mm Eon or Skywatcher.but it,s not gonna happen. so I started using my 17year old Synta made Firstscope 80mm 11.4 refractor more than I use to.I see detail that is subtle that.I looked over before.I may not get a bigger scope.but I,m enjoy gazing more than ever.when I came find the time

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Brent Campbell
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Re: What can I see with a 80mm refractor? new [Re: Astrojensen]
      #5970059 - 07/14/13 08:22 AM

Quote:

Hi Colin

While I totally agree on your analysis of false color, I must respectfully disagree with you on a number of other points:

Quote:

But even finding Uranus, e.g., in an F/15 scope without go-to is a difficult task for an experienced observer




This is absolutely not true by any stretch of the imagination. First, finderscopes are invented for a reason, second, a long-focus refractor is often long enough to act like a sort of pointer on its own. I've used a 85mm f/19 (1600mm focal length) refractor for many, many years and have always been able to find what I wanted to see (if it was within the reach of the scope, of course). For most things, I just aim along the tube, like down a rifle barrel. This more than suffice for bright stars and planets, and for dimmer targets I starhop.

Quote:

And then we get to the ergonomic issues of tube length, wind sail, looking at zenith, etc. And for the record, I have ALWAYS employed chairs in my basic observation gear. Rather than a fancy adjustable one, I own two distinct chairs: one that sits rather low, and one that sits about "normal" height. But I have also had to employ my derrière on the ground when using F/9 and longer refractors, and only such long tube refractors have ever required such uncomfortable groveling in my decades of astronomical observations.




Funnily, I have only very occasionally needed to sit on the ground, while observing with one of my refractors, while on the other hand, I always find myself down in the grass, when I want to observe something low in the sky with my 12" dobsonian.




I had a Celestron Fistscope 80 MM F11 (made by Vixen) with a nice wooden tripod and an ALT ATZ mount for my first scope. This thing would do 180 X great optics. I regretted giving it away until I purchased my Orion Express 80. The Express 80 provided much better field of view and cleaner views. The field of view with my 24 mm eyepiece gives me a 4 degree field of view with a 2" 24 mm eyepiece. My larger SCT gives me magnification so the 80 mm is the wide field instrument.

Had I started with a wide field instrument as a first scope it would have avoided allot of frustration. The wide field allows for easier star hopping. The CG-4 mount that I purchased used is not expensive - I paid $125.00 for mine. The combination of my express 80 and CG-4 make for a very sturdy, easy to use, and economical solution. I have about $500.00 including the diagonal into my wide field rig. My only regret is not starting the hobby there. Because its a wide field instrument you don't need the most expensive mount to make it work. High magnification instruments need a sturdy mount to help the scope perform like it should, and real sturdy equitorial or tracking mounts cost money and weight.

I might add that whenever I am using this combination I feel like I am driving a ferari. It's just plain fun. I don't miss the dim high-powered views of the Celestron firstscope 80 mm at all. The first scope was a great instrument for what it was. It did things that an 80 mm shouldn't have been able to do, but it was always stressed when pushing to 180 X and my C8 will easily get there.

When you need high magnification either use barlows or better yet go with a larger instrument!


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