Return to the Cloudy Nights Telescope Reviews home pageAstronomics discounts for Cloudy Nights members
· Get a Cloudy Nights T-Shirt · Submit a Review / Article

Click here if you are having trouble logging into the forums

Privacy Policy | Please read our Terms of Service | Signup and Troubleshooting FAQ | Problems? PM a Red or a Green Gu… uh, User

Observing >> Deep Sky Observing

Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | (show all)
Bakes
member


Reged: 01/06/09

Loc: Stratford, CT
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: REC]
      #6071909 - 09/09/13 07:05 PM

I observe from a white zone backyard with no filters. Using my 10" dob, I can find 52 Cygni and see not even a hint of the Veil.

Using the same scope/eyepiece at Stellafane, the Veil shines like a neon light! A darker sky really makes a difference.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
beatlejuice
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 04/05/11

Loc: Hamilton, ON,Canada
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: Bakes]
      #6072205 - 09/09/13 10:06 PM

I think it can be a mistake to start your search for the Veil with 52 Cygni in light polluted skies.
Better to start with the brighter part of the Veil which is conveniently located midway between 2.46 mag. Epsilon Cygni and 3.18 mag. Zeta Cygni forming the apex of a very flat triangle about 1.5 degrees south of these 2 stars.
With a telrad or red dot just aim at this position with your widest FOV eyepiece and an 0III filter and there is a good chance it will be there if it is in fact visible from your location. Of course a little nudging of the eyepiece may be necessary but I think that is your best bet.

Eric


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Erik Bakker
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 08/10/06

Loc: The Netherlands, Europe
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: beatlejuice]
      #6072720 - 09/10/13 07:40 AM

Good advice Eric!

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
REC
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 10/20/10

Loc: NC
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: Erik Bakker]
      #6073363 - 09/10/13 02:49 PM

Ok all, thanks for the encouragement! Yes it would be great to get to a darker site no doubt and I will look around my area that's not to far from my house and find a darker place, probably an Orange zone with no lights at all and would be better than my Red zone with street lights in the area and a light dome from a big city to the east.

I did see hints of it with the 10" Dob and a filter, but Very faint. Cygnus is now getting up at my zenith and on a very good transparent sky I can see magnitude 5...so just have to wait until such a night comes along. Same thing with the NA nebula.

Oh and when such a night comes along, I'm also going to try them with my 80ED with a low power EP and a 4* FOV.

Clear skies to all:)

Bob


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Jon_Doh
professor emeritus


Reged: 09/16/11

Loc: On a receiver's back
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: REC]
      #6074760 - 09/11/13 10:23 AM

Quote:

Really, you bagged it with your SCT and narrow FOV? I was out looking for it in my 8" SCT as low power from a 40mm EP and a nebula filter and could not see it. I panned around 52cyg as I know it was there, but just not visable in my scope.

I'll try it again with a dedicated SCT OIII filter and see if I can see it there. Otherwise have to hunt it down with my 10" Dob at low power....still looking for the NA one too!

BTW, what kind of sky do you have there, I'm in a red zone, so lot's of LP.




I bagged it with my 8" SCT with an OIII filter and 6.3 focal reducer from my driveway on a dark night. It wasn't fully visible, but I was happy to see it.

Edited by Jon_Doh (09/11/13 10:25 AM)


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Kraus
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 03/10/12

Loc: Georgia.
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: Jon_Doh]
      #6080890 - 09/14/13 06:41 PM


Alrighty folks.

My Middle Georgia skies are looking just perfect. Humidity feels low. I'll see the Veil's glory and spend all night staring at it. Nebulae do that to me.

I'll let y'all know.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Kraus
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 03/10/12

Loc: Georgia.
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: Kraus]
      #6082571 - 09/15/13 06:26 PM


I did as expected. The Veil, east and west loops kept me up till midnight. I didn't see Pickering's Triangle simply because I didn't know it wasn't part of the two loops-it's somewhere in between. Next weekend when the moon is rising later, I'll take a gander.

I let you know.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Jon Isaacs
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 06/16/04

Loc: San Diego and Boulevard, CA
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: REC]
      #6083121 - 09/16/13 01:05 AM

Quote:

I did see hints of it with the 10" Dob and a filter, but Very faint




Bob:

My two cents:

- If there is significant light pollution, I find a O-III filter is definitely superior to my Orion Ultra-Block, which is a UHC filter. I think most of the light from the Veil is in the O-III, no need to let in any more light pollution than is necessary.

- I have been getting some good views from my red zone front driveway with my 13.1 F/5.5, I figure its about Mag 4.5 directly overhead. I can see it with Ultrablock but it's definitely better with the O-III. I see details in structure. I have seen it with my 10 inch and 4 inch refractor but this is the best from the city.

- It does really help to have seen it before from dark skies. My dark sky location is on the desert side of the Laguna Mountains in San Diego county. The air is generally very dry and the skies are blue zone and sometimes darker. From that location I can see the Veil in 10x50s without filters, I have viewed it many times with scopes of pretty much every size.

So, when I am searching for it here in the city, I know exactly what I am looking for, that makes it easier, I pickup the nebulosity around 52, I am looking for the arc that signifies the eastern half.

For you, now that you have caught a glimpse of it, you are the way, you will be learning what it looks like and you will be able to recognize it under more trying situations.

And then, one night, you will out there where the skies are dark and you will see it like it lit up with a light bulb.

Jon


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
hottr6
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 06/28/09

Loc: 7,500', Magdalena Mtns, NM
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: REC]
      #6084510 - 09/16/13 06:49 PM

The Veil is pretty clear in my C80ED with OIII/1.25" 24mm 68-deg. It is pretty big. Sure would be nice to have a 2" OIII so I could fit the whole thing in a single FOV.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
azure1961p
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 01/17/09

Loc: USA
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: Bakes]
      #6084516 - 09/16/13 06:55 PM

Quote:

I observe from a white zone backyard with no filters. Using my 10" dob, I can find 52 Cygni and see not even a hint of the Veil.

Using the same scope/eyepiece at Stellafane, the Veil shines like a neon light! A darker sky really makes a difference.




Stratfords a nice little seaside town but that light dome out thre from Bridgeport is huge!!!!

Pete


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
REC
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 10/20/10

Loc: NC
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: hottr6]
      #6085581 - 09/17/13 09:38 AM

I have the same scope and will try it out next week after the moon is gone. I have a 2" NPB filter that I can use in a 2" EP and get 3* FOV, so will try that out.

Bob


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
REC
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 10/20/10

Loc: NC
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: Jon Isaacs]
      #6085587 - 09/17/13 09:41 AM

Thanks for the comments Jon. The only OIII filter I have is a SCT type and if I use a 40mm EP I can get 1.2* FOV in it, so will try that on the next good dark, transparent night.

Bob


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Philler
sage


Reged: 07/15/13

Loc: Kansas, USA
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: REC]
      #6086056 - 09/17/13 01:48 PM

I've seen the Veil Neb. in my 10" Reflector at about 44x and I was using a Lumicron Deep Sky LP filter from pretty good dark skies. Cygnus was pretty high in the sky about 70 degrees. I don't remember any distinct details other than a series of streaks with a soft white faint glow and it was fairly easy to see.
I am sure some of you are aware of this, but these LP eyepiece filters also enhances views of Jupiter's belts and Saturn.

Edited by Philler (09/17/13 09:36 PM)


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Gil V
sage


Reged: 09/09/12

Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: Philler]
      #6086218 - 09/17/13 03:12 PM

With a 3 degree FOV in my Tascoscan, I can see both portions of the Veil with a UHC filter. amazing sight. I've onlu tried that on really clear nights, I don't think I'd bother on marginal evenings.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Astrodj
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 08/24/11

Loc: Missouri
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: REC]
      #6098558 - 09/24/13 01:57 PM

Bob,

I live in a red zone bordering on white, on the best nights I can reach 5.3 ZLM. I haven't ever tried for the Veil from home before, but this thread made me want to see what I could do. I have seen it well from dark skies with my 5" RFT and UHC (I don't have an OIII). My 10" dob from the dark site showed good structure in the eastern arc and around 52 Cygni, and the central portion was visible as well.

Last night I tried it from home with the 10" dob. ZLM was about 5.1 at best, seeing was just average. I used a 32mm Plossl which provided about a 1.3 degree TOV and the Lumicon UHC. The brightest portion visible was the lower section of the eastern arc. The top section of the eastern arc was easily visible but not a bright as the bottom section. The middle section was faintly visible but sketchy. The western arc at 52 Cygni was only a barely hinted at ghost of nebulosity, if that. Pickering's Triangle between the two loops was undetectable.

Clear Skies!


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Kraus
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 03/10/12

Loc: Georgia.
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: Astrodj]
      #6100709 - 09/25/13 03:46 PM


DJ,

What? No OIII? That's like a sandwich without Hellamn's.

But nebula can shine one night and disappear the next night. So how much does a filter really matter. If I had black skies like in North Korea, I wouldn't need any filters.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
blb
Post Laureate


Reged: 11/25/05

Loc: Piedmont NC
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: Kraus]
      #6100885 - 09/25/13 05:05 PM

Quote:

...If I had black skies like in North Korea, I wouldn't need any filters.



That's true but how much more would you be able see with filters? Many things can be seem from dark sky sites that can't be seen with light pollution and filters still enhance the view.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
David Knisely
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 04/19/04

Loc: southeastern Nebraska
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: Kraus]
      #6101027 - 09/25/13 06:25 PM

Quote:


DJ,

What? No OIII? That's like a sandwich without Hellamn's.

But nebula can shine one night and disappear the next night. So how much does a filter really matter. If I had black skies like in North Korea, I wouldn't need any filters.




Actually, yes, you would still need a good filter. Even under the darkest skies on Earth, there is still residual skyglow from the airglow emission lines/bands (Oxygen, Sodium, and the Hydroxyl radical) as well as the faint glow from interplanetary dust in the solar system and the even fainter continuum glow from unresolved background stars/galaxies which are too faint to see directly. A filter is needed to get rid of that last little bit of glow and render the view with the maximum contrast possible. At the Nebraska Star Party (Zenith Limiting magnitude 7.5 to 8.0; SQM 21.8 to 22.0), most amateurs continued to use their filters on the Veil, as they provided notably more contrast than without the filters in-place. Clear skies to you.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Astrodj
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 08/24/11

Loc: Missouri
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: Kraus]
      #6102603 - 09/26/13 04:06 PM

Quote:


DJ,

What? No OIII? That's like a sandwich without Hellamn's.





Ya, someday maybe. I love my old trusty Lumicon UHC from the early 90's, but an OIII would be a nice addition for some objects.

BTW- I also find my UHC to help from a grey zone.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Kraus
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 03/10/12

Loc: Georgia.
Re: Still Can't See the Veil new [Re: Astrodj]
      #6102934 - 09/26/13 07:31 PM


I just received my new 2 inch OIII and UHC filters. Lumicon seems to have improved their formula. My five year old 1.25 inch OIII and UHC filters are tired and just ain't performing. Good thing they thread into my 2" diagonal as I can use either filter with all three Naglers.

Next, a 2" hydrogen-Beta filter. Soon comes the Horse Head.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | (show all)


Extra information
5 registered and 3 anonymous users are browsing this forum.

Moderator:  Dave Mitsky, Phillip Creed, okieav8r 

Print Thread

Forum Permissions
      You cannot start new topics
      You cannot reply to topics
      HTML is disabled
      UBBCode is enabled


Thread views: 3104

Jump to

CN Forums Home


Cloudy Nights LLC
Cloudy Nights Sponsor: Astronomics