Return to the Cloudy Nights Telescope Reviews home pageAstronomics discounts for Cloudy Nights members
· Get a Cloudy Nights T-Shirt · Submit a Review / Article

Click here if you are having trouble logging into the forums

Privacy Policy | Please read our Terms of Service | Signup and Troubleshooting FAQ | Problems? PM a Red or a Green Gu… uh, User

General Astronomy >> Light Pollution

Pages: 1
ion
professor emeritus


Reged: 04/26/08

Loc: Bortle Scale 2
Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new
      #6104857 - 09/27/13 07:58 PM

"The Scottish Dark Sky Observatory is composing a response to the South Kyle wind farm consultation voicing concerns about light pollution, which could spoil precious star views. "

http://www.troontimes.com/news/roundup/articles/2013/09/27/473184-massive-win...


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Tonk
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 08/19/04

Loc: Leeds, UK, 54N
Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: ion]
      #6108082 - 09/29/13 07:48 PM

Galloway Forest Park has only had its gold level dark sky park status for 3 years or so and then this comes along!!

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Tonk
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 08/19/04

Loc: Leeds, UK, 54N
Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies [Re: Tonk]
      #6108644 - 09/30/13 03:26 AM

The story has now made todays front page on the BBC News website

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-south-scotland-24325181

The proposals have received a strong comment from Scotland's Astronomer Royal (Prof Brown) no less

This BBC link contains quotes from Alex Salmond (Scotland's First Minister) when he opened the dark sky park last October including

"Most importantly, it is also a huge economic asset for the local community - attracting direct employment, encouraging visitors to come here and providing an inspirational resource for local children and adults alike"


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
CelestronDaddy
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 08/22/09

Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: Tonk]
      #6108919 - 09/30/13 09:29 AM

Progress?? Sometimes it's not! We have precious little dark sky left here in the states. I was lucky and grew up living in a dark sky area. Not so now living near Austin...

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
wavecloud
sage


Reged: 09/22/13

Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: CelestronDaddy]
      #6111795 - 10/01/13 07:20 PM

I note that wind farms do not help the environment in any way whatsoever, resource wise, energy wise, sky wise, migration wise, hapitat wise etc.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
darknesss
super member


Reged: 09/05/13

Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: wavecloud]
      #6119878 - 10/06/13 12:26 AM

Tell them it will endanger Bald Eagles or whatever kind of eagles they have there.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
bdc52
member
*****

Reged: 01/26/13

Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: darknesss]
      #6120020 - 10/06/13 03:24 AM

None of the wind farms I've seen contribute appreciably to light pollution once construction is finished, especially compared to regular power plants. And the idea that wind farms harm wildlife is, in the most polite terms possible, an exaggeration.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
BrooksObs
professor emeritus


Reged: 12/08/12

Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: bdc52]
      #6120171 - 10/06/13 08:15 AM

Sadly, nowhere on Earth is immune from encroaching light pollution these days. Likewise, "the evironment be damned as long as the project results in employment" seems to have become the battle cry of humanity. While the environmental community made great strides in the 80's and 90's, I'm seeing more and more of their gains fall by the wayside in the name of jobs. Only the environs surrounding major astronomical observatories seems able to hold their ground currently. I wish our colleagues across the pond luck in fighting this new intruder, but fear the ultimate outcome.

BrooksObs


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
obin robinson
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 10/25/12

Loc: League City, TX
Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: bdc52]
      #6120248 - 10/06/13 09:27 AM

Quote:

None of the wind farms I've seen contribute appreciably to light pollution once construction is finished, especially compared to regular power plants. And the idea that wind farms harm wildlife is, in the most polite terms possible, an exaggeration.




If you are a company seeking to build wind turbines you will release dozens of company-sponsored studies that say they don't kill birds. If you are an independent group studying how many birds are killed by wind turbines you will produce evidence as to how live birds aren't as common around wind turbines... but dead ones are.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/aug/6/wind-energy-tax-credits-fund-b...

Quote:

The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service and other experts estimate that more than 500,000 birds and countless bats are killed annually by turbines. The slaughter “could easily be over 500” golden eagles a year in our western states, says Save the Eagles International biologist Jim Wiegand. Bald eagles are also being butchered. The two species’ body count could soon reach 1,000 per year.

In the 86-square-mile area blanketed by California’s Altamont Pass wind turbines, no eagles have nested for more than 20 years, and golden eagle nest sites have declined by half in surrounding areas, even though both are prime habitats, Mr. Wiegand notes. Wildlife specialist Shawn Smallwood estimates that 2,300 golden eagles have been killed by Altamont turbines in the past 25 years.


Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/aug/6/wind-energy-tax-credits-fund-b...
Follow us: @washtimes on Twitter




obin


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Footbag
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 04/13/09

Loc: Scranton, PA
Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: obin robinson]
      #6120390 - 10/06/13 10:56 AM

You do have to look at how many birds are killed by other sources.

Powerlines, skyscrapers, automobiles, etc... All kill tens to humdreds of times more birds then wind turbines.

Coal plants kill more people then wind turbines kill eagles.

Edited by Footbag (10/06/13 10:57 AM)


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
SporQ
member


Reged: 09/03/13

Loc: Indiana, USA
Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: Footbag]
      #6120583 - 10/06/13 01:11 PM

I think the only Blue Zone in Indiana is on a wind farm according to the LP map. Can't be that many lights from them if so.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
brianb11213
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 02/25/09

Loc: 55.215N 6.554W
Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: bdc52]
      #6120639 - 10/06/13 01:47 PM

Quote:

None of the wind farms I've seen contribute appreciably to light pollution once construction is finished, especially compared to regular power plants.



I tend to agree but nevertheless there is significant light pollution from some wind turbine farms. There seems to be some sort of regulation here in the UK that the things have to be illuminated in the infra red for the benefit of collision avoidance by low flying aircraft (mostly military) and that wind turbines in search & rescue training areas have to be illuminated in visible light too. Why can't they just have blinking red anti-collision lights like other tall structures? Beats me....

Edited by brianb11213 (10/06/13 01:48 PM)


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Tonk
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 08/19/04

Loc: Leeds, UK, 54N
Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: brianb11213]
      #6120663 - 10/06/13 02:05 PM

And whats the in the room regarding all these underlying issues .... To many of these

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
wavecloud
sage


Reged: 09/22/13

Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: BrooksObs]
      #6121467 - 10/06/13 10:52 PM

Quote:

Sadly, nowhere on Earth is immune from encroaching light pollution these days. Likewise, "the evironment be damned as long as the project results in employment" seems to have become the battle cry of humanity. While the environmental community made great strides in the 80's and 90's, I'm seeing more and more of their gains fall by the wayside in the name of jobs. Only the environs surrounding major astronomical observatories seems able to hold their ground currently. I wish our colleagues across the pond luck in fighting this new intruder, but fear the ultimate outcome.
BrooksObs




We are part of the environment. The "battlecrh" of humanity is hypocritical and terribly self defeating.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
darknesss
super member


Reged: 09/05/13

Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: Footbag]
      #6123010 - 10/07/13 04:46 PM

Quote:

You do have to look at how many birds are killed by other sources.

Powerlines, skyscrapers, automobiles, etc... All kill tens to humdreds of times more birds then wind turbines.

Coal plants kill more people then wind turbines kill eagles.




Your quote about 500 eagles didn't fit, but that'd be like $100 million in fines if they were golden eagles.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/03/31/nevada-wind-farm-could-face-hefty-...
A windfarm would suddenly become unprofitable or even operate at a loss if it had to pay a lot of fines.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
orion61

*****

Reged: 10/20/07

Loc: Birthplace James T Kirk
Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: wavecloud]
      #6123351 - 10/07/13 06:49 PM

Quote:

I note that wind farms do not help the environment in any way whatsoever, resource wise, energy wise, sky wise, migration wise, hapitat wise etc.



I'm sorry but I disagree, they are ugly but provide a lot of energy...every watt they make saves that much oil. I live in Iowa and have seen those things popping up all over.. They are honestly trying to stay away from Migratory routs.
They have provided many much needed jobs both construction wise and Permanent maintenance wise.
Farm land is selling for Premium money.
I would not worry about reduced Agriculture, The State of Texas could provide all the grain if it were all used...
It is just too bad all the cheap energy is going to the coasts and big citys..


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Tonk
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 08/19/04

Loc: Leeds, UK, 54N
Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: orion61]
      #6124619 - 10/08/13 11:07 AM

Quote:

I'm sorry but I disagree, they are ugly but provide a lot of energy...every watt they make saves that much oil.




+ 1

Plus the foorprint of each windmill is small so when we advance and find some other renewable source - taking away a wind farm leaves less scars on the land than full blown powerstations would


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Qwickdraw
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 03/03/12

Loc: Ann Arbor, MI
Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: wavecloud]
      #6124724 - 10/08/13 11:47 AM

Quote:

I note that wind farms do not help the environment in any way whatsoever, resource wise, energy wise, sky wise, migration wise, hapitat wise etc.



Sometimes it is a choice between which one is worse.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
barasits
sage


Reged: 06/12/11

Loc: Chicago
Re: Massive windfarm could hit dark skies new [Re: Qwickdraw]
      #6124906 - 10/08/13 01:09 PM

Agreed. Everything we do has some impact. We can't live like Jainist monks, but we can minimize the damage by choosing the lesser of two or more evils. Wind power, solar, geothermal, etc. are all far and away the better choices. No one is saying that alternative energy generation is impact-free, it's simply better than what we've been doing. Conservation is another better choice.

Regarding stories about the downside of wind turbines, beware of the sources of these stories. Some have a very poor track record of reporting when it comes to science and politically loaded issues like green energy.

For a more objective assessment, see the link below:
http://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/green-science/wind-turbine-kil...

Geoff


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Pages: 1


Extra information
1 registered and 2 anonymous users are browsing this forum.

Moderator:  LivingNDixie, richard7 

Print Thread

Forum Permissions
      You cannot start new topics
      You cannot reply to topics
      HTML is disabled
      UBBCode is enabled


Thread views: 884

Jump to

CN Forums Home


Cloudy Nights LLC
Cloudy Nights Sponsor: Astronomics