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faltered
professor emeritus


Reged: 04/01/05

Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: budman1961]
      #6149897 - 10/21/13 01:31 PM

Quote:

I agree with John C., this is an ANNOUNCEMENT forum, not one to engage the manufacturer. I can only imaging the slaughter that would occur if that happened.

When was the last time Celestron directly addressed individual support questions on ANY public forum? C'mon guys......give them a chance to get going at least!





Exactly. Well said.


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gmartin02
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 04/11/05

Loc: Santa Clarita, CA
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: faltered]
      #6150081 - 10/21/13 03:37 PM

Quote:

Quote:

I agree with John C., this is an ANNOUNCEMENT forum, not one to engage the manufacturer. I can only imaging the slaughter that would occur if that happened.

When was the last time Celestron directly addressed individual support questions on ANY public forum? C'mon guys......give them a chance to get going at least!





Exactly. Well said.




faltered:

In the following thread:

http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=vendorann&...

You asked a vendor (APT) this direct question:

"I am just a couple of issues away from buying your software, i really like it but I am running into an issue I cant figure out. How do you take images longer than 30 seconds? When I try to use the "bulb" option, and I try to take an image, I get a message telling me to turn off mirror lock. I have a 450D/Xsi. I am connecting via the USB cable. I can get most everything else to work perfectly, LiveView works great, I can take images in any of the levels in the drop down, but just cant seem to figure out how to take images longer than 30 seconds. If I can get this figured out, I will buy your software for sure! Thanks for making such a great tool!"

To which the vendor responded:

"Hi Faltered, Thank you for the kind words! To make longer than 30s exposures, you have to define a plan. Click on the Edit button in lower right and you will get in the Plan Editor. There you can define all the parameters for a multiple sets of exposures and to group then in a plan. When you are ready select one plan in the main window and hit Start"

To which you responded:

"Cool! I didnt play around with the "plan" area at all. Currious, why cant you just have other options in the pull down like "1min" and "2min" I will be placing my order for full version tonight! Thank you!!"


I see a little "double standard" from you on this one


I just reviewed the TOS, and there is no rule stating vendors cannot be asked questions in the Vendor and Group Announcements forums. The vendor has no obligation to reply, but the CN users are within their right to ask questions.

I guess no one read this in my previous post, so I will write it again, this time in bold text:

Most of the original posts in the Vendor and Group Announcements forum have comments and questions from CN users to the vendor in response to the announcement, and most vendors do respond directly in these forums to the those CN users comments/questions.

If you don't believe me, take a look at a handful of other announcements on this forum - vendors are constantly responding to questions by CN posters about their products (and in many cases, increasing their sales, like in the example for faltered above).


John C and budman1961: Just because you don't feel it is OK to ask vendors questions in this forum does not give you the right to tell other CN users what they should or shouldn't do in this forum. Last time I checked, neither one of you are moderators of this forum. faltered - I didn't include you in this because you already have asked a vendor a question in this forum (see example above).


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gmartin02
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 04/11/05

Loc: Santa Clarita, CA
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: gmartin02]
      #6150084 - 10/21/13 03:38 PM

Moderators (Brian, Sedat): Could you please comment on the practice of asking vendors questions in this forum? As I said before, most announcements have questions from CNers, and most of the time the vendors respond to the CNers questions.

Is there a new rule that has not been added to the TOS that now forbids this practice?

Thanks


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jonbosley
professor emeritus


Reged: 10/19/05

Loc: Texas
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: gmartin02]
      #6150112 - 10/21/13 03:52 PM

Cool, maybe the new Meade Team will throw the hot glue gun away when putting its electronics together.

Jon


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jrcrillyAdministrator
Refractor wienie no more
*****

Reged: 04/30/03

Loc: NE Ohio
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: gmartin02]
      #6150139 - 10/21/13 04:06 PM

Quote:

I see a little "double standard" from you on this one


I just reviewed the TOS, and there is no rule stating vendors cannot be asked questions in the Vendor and Group Announcements forums. The vendor has no obligation to reply, but the CN users are within their right to ask questions.




There's a big difference between "How do I do invoke a particular function when using your product" questions such as the one quoted above and some of the questions that had been posted in this thread. The "Play nice" rule covers these situations.

The one about glossy v. pebble finish paint was a good example of an appropriate question.


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gmartin02
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 04/11/05

Loc: Santa Clarita, CA
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: jrcrilly]
      #6150219 - 10/21/13 04:56 PM

John,

Your statement above says this: "This forum is for announcements. Folks wanting to establish a dialog with a vendor will do better to contact the vendor directly."

You said nothing in your statement about what type of question was asked, or the "play nice" rule (which is a different issue, and a rule that should be adhered to).

In my post, I was also referring to the comment by budman1961 (and the endorsement of this statement by faltered): "I agree with John C., this is an ANNOUNCEMENT forum, not one to engage the manufacturer."

Again, no mention of the type of question or the "play nice" rule - just a statement that questions should not be asked of manufactures in this forum.

Since you you didn't refute either one of those posts using your name, I naturally assumed that this was your position.


So you are saying now that you think it IS OK to post questions to vendors as long as the questions adhere to the "play nice" rule? I'm glad that is all cleared up.

Note: Since you are not a moderator of this forum, your opinion is just that - an opinion, no more or less valid than any other persons opinion (except for an opinion by a moderator).


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csa/montana
Den Mama
*****

Reged: 05/14/05

Loc: montana
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: gmartin02]
      #6150244 - 10/21/13 05:09 PM

Quote:

Note: Since you are not a moderator of this forum, your opinion is just that - an opinion, no more or less valid than any other persons opinion (except for an opinion by a moderator).




No, John's not a Moderator, rather an Administrator of the site!


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gmartin02
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 04/11/05

Loc: Santa Clarita, CA
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: csa/montana]
      #6150261 - 10/21/13 05:21 PM

So John, I guess your opinion matters even more than a moderator

Just to be crystal clear: It is OK to post questions to vendors, as long as the TOS rules are adhered to?


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MDavid
super member


Reged: 11/15/11

Loc: 29N (Texas)
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: jrcrilly]
      #6150291 - 10/21/13 05:38 PM

Quote:

Quote:

I see a little "double standard" from you on this one


I just reviewed the TOS, and there is no rule stating vendors cannot be asked questions in the Vendor and Group Announcements forums. The vendor has no obligation to reply, but the CN users are within their right to ask questions.




There's a big difference between "How do I do invoke a particular function when using your product" questions such as the one quoted above and some of the questions that had been posted in this thread. The "Play nice" rule covers these situations.

The one about glossy v. pebble finish paint was a good example of an appropriate question.




I like the textured finish. It is distictive and modern.

I'm really hoping starlock ends up working as advertised...I've got an LX600 on my wish list.


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jrcrillyAdministrator
Refractor wienie no more
*****

Reged: 04/30/03

Loc: NE Ohio
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: gmartin02]
      #6150484 - 10/21/13 07:49 PM

Quote:

So you are saying now that you think it IS OK to post questions to vendors as long as the questions adhere to the "play nice" rule?




Yes. And please don't tell us how to run our website.


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jrcrillyAdministrator
Refractor wienie no more
*****

Reged: 04/30/03

Loc: NE Ohio
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: MDavid]
      #6150489 - 10/21/13 07:53 PM

Quote:

I like the textured finish. It is distictive and modern.

I'm really hoping starlock ends up working as advertised...I've got an LX600 on my wish list.




I didn't like the new finish when I first saw it, but I think that was just resistance to change. It seems normal now, and I think it looks nice - and no fingerprints.

Starlock has been working as advertised on mine ever since I received it last Spring.


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budman1961
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 02/25/11

Loc: Springfield, MO
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: jrcrilly]
      #6150910 - 10/22/13 12:09 AM

Greg,

I'd respond, but it just isn't worth the waste of time.

Edited by budman1961 (10/22/13 12:32 AM)


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Tophat3
super member


Reged: 07/20/10

Loc: Columbus,Ohio
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: budman1961]
      #6152868 - 10/23/13 02:08 AM

Yep, I like the change to the textured finish.

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Whichwayisnorth
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 07/04/11

Loc: Southern California
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: Tophat3]
      #6153957 - 10/23/13 03:46 PM

The textured finish has grown on me. I really like the pearl white color that the EdgeHD scopes come in now too. Since I own both I get the best of both worlds.

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faltered
professor emeritus


Reged: 04/01/05

Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: gmartin02]
      #6162988 - 10/28/13 05:10 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

I agree with John C., this is an ANNOUNCEMENT forum, not one to engage the manufacturer. I can only imaging the slaughter that would occur if that happened.

When was the last time Celestron directly addressed individual support questions on ANY public forum? C'mon guys......give them a chance to get going at least!





Exactly. Well said.




faltered:

In the following thread:

http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=vendorann&...

You asked a vendor (APT) this direct question:

"I am just a couple of issues away from buying your software, i really like it but I am running into an issue I cant figure out. How do you take images longer than 30 seconds? When I try to use the "bulb" option, and I try to take an image, I get a message telling me to turn off mirror lock. I have a 450D/Xsi. I am connecting via the USB cable. I can get most everything else to work perfectly, LiveView works great, I can take images in any of the levels in the drop down, but just cant seem to figure out how to take images longer than 30 seconds. If I can get this figured out, I will buy your software for sure! Thanks for making such a great tool!"

To which the vendor responded:

"Hi Faltered, Thank you for the kind words! To make longer than 30s exposures, you have to define a plan. Click on the Edit button in lower right and you will get in the Plan Editor. There you can define all the parameters for a multiple sets of exposures and to group then in a plan. When you are ready select one plan in the main window and hit Start"

To which you responded:

"Cool! I didnt play around with the "plan" area at all. Currious, why cant you just have other options in the pull down like "1min" and "2min" I will be placing my order for full version tonight! Thank you!!"


I see a little "double standard" from you on this one


I just reviewed the TOS, and there is no rule stating vendors cannot be asked questions in the Vendor and Group Announcements forums. The vendor has no obligation to reply, but the CN users are within their right to ask questions.

I guess no one read this in my previous post, so I will write it again, this time in bold text:

Most of the original posts in the Vendor and Group Announcements forum have comments and questions from CN users to the vendor in response to the announcement, and most vendors do respond directly in these forums to the those CN users comments/questions.

If you don't believe me, take a look at a handful of other announcements on this forum - vendors are constantly responding to questions by CN posters about their products (and in many cases, increasing their sales, like in the example for faltered above).


John C and budman1961: Just because you don't feel it is OK to ask vendors questions in this forum does not give you the right to tell other CN users what they should or shouldn't do in this forum. Last time I checked, neither one of you are moderators of this forum. faltered - I didn't include you in this because you already have asked a vendor a question in this forum (see example above).




Ok. Consider me called out. Cant argue with that. However, I think there is a pretty big difference between APT and Meade Instruments. APT is a very active contributor to this site - and engages in hundreds of discussions here. Granted, yes they are both vendors, but I do think there is a big difference.

Edited by faltered (10/28/13 05:12 PM)


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Stacy
Star Partyer
*****

Reged: 09/15/02

Loc: Seattle, WA
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: faltered]
      #6163875 - 10/29/13 02:32 AM

Meade "pebbled" finish.

I'm going to put a pebbled finish on my car. I'm sure I'll get used to it after awhile!


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mclewis1
Thread Killer
*****

Reged: 02/25/06

Loc: New Brunswick, Canada
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: Stacy]
      #6164783 - 10/29/13 03:11 PM

A lot of folks who regularly drive the highways in the summer (aka road work season) already have a "pebbled" finish on their cars.

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Brian RisleyModerator
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 09/04/06

Loc: SW Florida
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: mclewis1]
      #6165513 - 10/29/13 10:44 PM

Ok, lets keep this train on the track. The OP deals with an announcement about the merger agreement. You have asked questions, Meade has not responded, which is their right. CN's recommendation is you take issues with vendor's private.
Per the Terms of Service:
Quote:

Vendor disagreements should be dealt with via the vendor - we don't want to be used as leverage. Attempts to use the forum in such a fashion will be subject to immediate removal at moderator discretion. Feel free to discuss things here, but please don't beat it to death. Stating your viewpoint once, on-topic and in a civil manner, in a thread is sufficient.




Posts of the above nature should occur in the regular forum appropriate to the issue.

From the sticky post about the clarification of what the Vendor forum is for:
Quote:


The Vendor Forum is for the use of Vendors to post announcements of up coming products, special sales and promotions, and any other information the vendor may feel is of use to the members of CN concerning their products or business. It is also for the use of members to post questions concerning said posts.

The Vendor forum is not, for the use of members to post complaints or request for guidance for settling issues with vendors.




Note, the clarification is specific. Vendors may post announcements etc. and the regular users may make posts specifically concerning the vendor's original post or their subsequent posts in that thread.
It is not a forum for you to complain about vendor's actions or inactions.

Please remember the main TOS theme: do unto others as you would have them do unto you

Thanks,
Brian Risley CN Vendor Moderating Team


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Relativist
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 10/11/03

Loc: OC, CA, USA
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: Brian Risley]
      #6166230 - 10/30/13 11:44 AM

Meade, any chance you can make your dob base lighter, see the aftermarket kits for example. Does solid wood really cost that much more such that you can't use it?

Also a tracking add on option using nexstar would be very nice.


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pdfermat
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 11/12/07

Loc: Wisconsin
Re: Meade Instruments Corp. Completes Merger Agreement new [Re: Relativist]
      #6168162 - 10/31/13 10:41 AM

Quote:

Meade, any chance you can make your dob base lighter, see the aftermarket kits for example. Does solid wood really cost that much more such that you can't use it?

Also a tracking add on option using nexstar would be very nice.




I don't know how cost-feasible this could be for a company like Meade, but you've got a good point here. They could take the market share they've got with their LB line and take it to the next level.

If you want a bargain (new scope) dob at 16", the LB is (was? - are they still offering it new?) the only game in town for right around $2000. The next step up would be something like an Orion and then Dobstuff/Telekeit/and so on (all admirable scopes in their own rights), but now you're up around $3500.

Maybe it's just because I've been a "dob guy" for quite some time, but I feel like if Meade "tweaked" their LB line a bit to make the base a bit lighter/more portable, offered a range of sizes from 16" to perhaps 20" or 22", and could keep the price range to < $3500 for the big boys, they could attract a good customer base here.

I'm sure this is a tough, tough business to operate in, though and turn a profit.


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