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Equipment Discussions >> Binoculars

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Eric63
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 06/16/12

Loc: Ottawa, Ontario
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: JustaBoy]
      #6187866 - 11/11/13 12:45 AM

Yes, I agree, the 4.4 is from the technical specs. I get roughly 4, which is fine by me.

I knew I was going to hear from you chuck After writing my post I thought "hmm, perhaps I should double check those figures."

Eric


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JustaBoy
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Reged: 06/19/12

Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Eric63]
      #6187932 - 11/11/13 02:26 AM

Yeah Eric - It's not easy being me - I'm just so predictable:-)

On the bright side, your focal ratio has gone from apx F/5.4 to apx F/6. - This makes things somewhat easier on eyepieces, as they don't have to deal with as steep of a light cone. - Also there will be less false color. - Darker sky background...

Hey! - It sounds like you Won!

Take care,

-Chuck


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Eric63
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 06/16/12

Loc: Ottawa, Ontario
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: JustaBoy]
      #6188067 - 11/11/13 07:04 AM

Thanks Chuck.

I'll be sure to report back once I have tested them.

Eric


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Rich56
member


Reged: 06/02/12

Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Eric63]
      #6188228 - 11/11/13 09:40 AM

I know from my own bino experiences that A LOT can be said for 45 degree eyepiece viewing, especially when mounted on a sturdy tripod.

Hopefully you'll get them in time for ISON if it shows up.

Rich


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Mr. Bill
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Reged: 02/09/05

Loc: Northeastern Cal
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Rich56]
      #6189331 - 11/11/13 07:57 PM

IIRC....I measured less than 60mm clear aperture on the BT-70s 45s with both 19mm and 24mm Panoptic eps. The BT-70s 45s had very noticeably less contrast and image brightness than the 16x70 Fujis that I compared side by side.

For those "sitting on the fence" I suggest thinking about the APM 100 Semi APO 45s which measure the advertised 100mm.

For $1100 you also get 2 sets of very good eyepieces (I suggest the 12mm and 19mm) which are unbranded Astro Tech Flat Field.

That's a 270% increase in light gathering for less than 30% price increase.

Your money, your choice.



Edited by Mr. Bill (11/12/13 12:53 AM)


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JustaBoy
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Reged: 06/19/12

Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Mr. Bill]
      #6189475 - 11/11/13 09:08 PM

And that would be this one: http://www.apm-telescopes.de/en/product.html?info=1893

Is that correct, Bill?

Thanks,

-Chuck


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Mr. Bill
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Reged: 02/09/05

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Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: JustaBoy]
      #6189502 - 11/11/13 09:25 PM

That's it, Chuck...Rich V and I did a "shootout" with the Oberwerk BT 100 45 this last summer. Check my past postings.



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GlennLeDrew
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Reged: 06/18/08

Loc: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Mr. Bill]
      #6189717 - 11/11/13 11:06 PM

I don't know about the 45 degree variant, but the newer 90 degree BT-70 MK II does operate at or very nearly the full 70mm aperture. The original did operate at 60mm. It's easy to distinguish between the two, the newer one has an enlarged rear casting to accommodate the larger pentaprism.

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Stacy
Star Partyer
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Reged: 09/15/02

Loc: Seattle, WA
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Mr. Bill]
      #6189818 - 11/12/13 12:38 AM

Nice read!

Never did see the white comparison of the Kowa and the APM Glen wanted. Anybody ever figure it out? (the dimmer 100mm vs. 80mm)

How does the Obie BT70 45 compare to the Vixen BT81S-A?

Edited by Stacy (11/12/13 12:43 AM)


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Mr. Bill
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Reged: 02/09/05

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Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Stacy]
      #6189831 - 11/12/13 12:47 AM

Quote:


How does the Obie BT70 45 compare to the Vixen BT81S-A?




Had reviews on both....check my previous posts for relevant threads...



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aa6ww
scholastic sledgehammer
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Reged: 10/23/11

Loc: Sacramento, Calif.
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Mr. Bill]
      #6189909 - 11/12/13 02:23 AM

1095 ERO = 1468.18 US Dollar, throw in shipping from Germany and your talking closer to $1600, nearly twice as much as the Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars.

I have these when they were selling for $1100. They are nice but I prefer using my 70mm Oberwerk Ultra's because as Eric was finding out, especially in his Mag 6.5 skies with his 70mm Skymasters, 70mm of aperture is plenty.
With many people, sometimes bigger isn't always better.
Sacrifices in field of view, weight, cost, all factor in.
If he loves his Skymaster 15x70's, I have no doubt he's gonna love his new Oberwerk 45į 70mm Binocular Telescope.

Superb optics, high-quality workmanship, and interchangeable eyepieces make this product a winner.
....Phil Harrington

..pretty good credentials!!

...Ralph



Quote:

IIRC....I measured less than 60mm clear aperture on the BT-70s 45s with both 19mm and 24mm Panoptic eps. The BT-70s 45s had very noticeably less contrast and image brightness than the 16x70 Fujis that I compared side by side.

For those "sitting on the fence" I suggest thinking about the APM 100 Semi APO 45s which measure the advertised 100mm.

For $1100 you also get 2 sets of very good eyepieces (I suggest the 12mm and 19mm) which are unbranded Astro Tech Flat Field.

That's a 270% increase in light gathering for less than 30% price increase.

Your money, your choice.






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JustaBoy
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Reged: 06/19/12

Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: aa6ww]
      #6189920 - 11/12/13 02:37 AM

Ralph,

From the APM website:

1.095,00 EUR
incl. 19 % VAT excl. shipping costs
Netto Export Preis: 920,17 EUR

Don't forget about the VAT...

-Chuck


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Eric63
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 06/16/12

Loc: Ottawa, Ontario
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: aa6ww]
      #6190131 - 11/12/13 08:27 AM

I fully agree with you Ralph.

Thank you all for your input but I think what is being lost here is the reason for the BT70. Iím looking for a light grab and go setup that will give me a bit more flexibility than my current 15X70. When the temperature goes below freezing here, I really donít want to mess with complicated setups. Thatís why I used my 15X70ís last winter. And as I noted earlier, I found my 15X70 to be actually quite nice, therefore these will be even better. Unfortunately many get lost in the details and forget the other reason come into play when choosing an instrument. In my case, ease of setup, less neck strain, light, portable and good for daytime use also all come into play.

Last year after having bought my 127Mak I became obsessed with the fact that it only had 118mm of aperture and hence a larger CO. Fortunately wise and experienced members of the Cat forum urged me to forget the numbers and simply look through them. They were right, the views were simply amazing and the portability and ease of setup made them that much more enjoyable. I even compared them to my 150mm reflector and to be honest, the difference was not enough to make me regret my choice. I am fortunate to have access to dark skies, which more than make up for a few mmís here and there.

I am not buying these for detailed DSO viewing; I simply want to enjoy how DSOís are framed under dark skies. I am also not buying them for resolution; I have my telescopes for that. I am buying these because of the reasons noted above.

I also agree with Ralph's comment about cost. Even without the VAT, the cost of the APM is over $1400 with shipping. And letís add the beefier mount that will be required. So I am now looking at a significant investment for something that no longer fits the bill as a light grab and go instrument. In the end I am very happy with this choice and very fortunate to have a wife that wants to give me such a nice present.

I appreciate the enthusiastic and dedicated input from the more experienced members of this forum , but letís also not forget the big picture.

Eric


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Mr. Bill
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Reged: 02/09/05

Loc: Northeastern Cal
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Stacy]
      #6190409 - 11/12/13 11:05 AM

Quote:

Nice read!

Never did see the white comparison of the Kowa and the APM Glen wanted. Anybody ever figure it out? (the dimmer 100mm vs. 80mm)






Think the upshot of that was the Kowa had better glass and coatings and that accounted for the difference.


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Mr. Bill
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Reged: 02/09/05

Loc: Northeastern Cal
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: aa6ww]
      #6190439 - 11/12/13 11:21 AM

Quote:


Superb optics, high-quality workmanship, and interchangeable eyepieces make this product a winner.
....Phil Harrington

..pretty good credentials!!

...Ralph






If you read my thread mentioned in an above post, I point out that I bought the BT-70 45s on the strength of Phil's S&T review. Unfortunately, he forgot to do his homework and check effective aperture.

Lessons learned.



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JustaBoy
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Reged: 06/19/12

Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Mr. Bill]
      #6190447 - 11/12/13 11:23 AM

Phil's review reads like an ad to me.

-Chuck


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Rich V.
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Reged: 01/02/05

Loc: Lake Tahoe area, Nevada, USA
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: JustaBoy]
      #6190468 - 11/12/13 11:34 AM

It struck a lot of us that way, Chuck.

One must usually take these cursory "reviews" with a grain of salt...

Rich


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Stacy
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Reged: 09/15/02

Loc: Seattle, WA
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Eric63]
      #6190651 - 11/12/13 12:58 PM

Quote:

I appreciate the enthusiastic and dedicated input from the more experienced members of this forum , but letís also not forget the big picture.

Eric




Your points are not lost. Of course you will enjoy your binoculars. But many others (especially us optical propeller-heads) like to digest and analyze the numbers as we may be considering a similar purchase, and have different criteria.

If/when I pop for another 70mm or higher bin, I have decided it will have to be a 45 or 90 for ease of setup and use. However I would not consider the Obie BT7045 at this point. Why pay for 70's when with certain ep's you are getting less than 60mm? If that's the best $800 can buy right now, I would just forgo it until something else comes along. Sure, $800 is a great price for a nice pair of 70mm 45 degree binos. But would you spend the same money on a BT-60-45, when for maybe $200 more you could get a true 80 or 90mm? Many will have different answers, but I know what mine is.


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Mr. Bill
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Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Stacy]
      #6190910 - 11/12/13 03:13 PM

A couple of comments....

I initially bought the BT81S-A looking for a lightweight relatively large aperture 45 or 90 degree ocular binocular with interchangable eps for a upcoming trip to Australia. After reviewing the 90 degree models available at the time, I decided that 45 degree was the only good option.

The BT81 seemed like an ideal choice (looking at the "shiny brochure.") Unfortunately, there are severe prism light leakage issues which manifest themselves as ghosting while sweeping MW starfields. Returned to OPT for refund.

When I saw the Harrington review, I decided to try the BT70s despite the fact that I considered the 80mm aperture to be the smallest acceptable...getting desperate at that point.

Well, unfortunately the 70mm turned out to be 60mm...totally unacceptable. I might as well take the Fuji 16x70s in spite of being straight thru and fixed eps. Reurned for refund to Big Binocular.

After some thought I decided that the APMs, although weighing more than I wanted to deal with traveling would work and give me an honest 100mm aperture.

Rolled the dice once more (especially considering the cost of international return) and lucked out...a reasonable package that gives me a carry on case for the binos and the Manfrotto 475B tripod and 501HDV head provides solid stability for the 16 pound binoculars. Throw the 24mm and 19mm Pans and 12mm Astro Tech eps in and you have a pretty formidable optical package for serious examination of the southern skies.

Anyway, that's my story and I'm sticking to it.


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Eric63
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 06/16/12

Loc: Ottawa, Ontario
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Mr. Bill]
      #6190975 - 11/12/13 03:34 PM

Gentlemen, you all have valid arguments. I guess it all comes down to perspectives and what best fits our needs.

Thank you again for your input.
Eric


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