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Equipment Discussions >> Binoculars

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Stacy
Star Partyer
*****

Reged: 09/15/02

Loc: Seattle, WA
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Mr. Bill]
      #6191244 - 11/12/13 05:53 PM

Quote:



Mr. Bill said:

A couple of comments....

....snip ....

Anyway, that's my story and I'm sticking to it.




Thanks Bill. That saves me another trip through your long and storied past.

So I see you have already traveled this path well and that information and experience is extremely valuable to me. Thanks so much for sharing.

What I gather, is that the APM-100, in your opinion (and it would seem a few others) despite it's minor flaws, is the best bank for the buck in this general price area. Although the price does seem to have gone up a bit, they do occasionally advertise on Astromart, special deals in US dollars that include shipping.

I sold the parallel bino mount, as just a bit too unwieldy. Bino chairs I have been able to find, also seem underdeveloped and over-priced. That leaves me with a 45 or 90 design if I want to go bigger. The price of admission on the APM-100 seems reasonable, but I would be biting my nails to see if my sample made it across the world in collimation. I think I may keep an eye on the used market to see if something pops up.

Thanks again.


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Vondragonnoggin
Post Laureate
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Reged: 02/21/10

Loc: Southern CA, USA
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Stacy]
      #6191259 - 11/12/13 06:02 PM

Congratulations. Owning the Garret BT70/90 has been satisfying for the most part. The Garret's are F/6.2 though with 22mm clear aperture at the ocular so using field stops in excess of about 24.5 mm will cause some vignetting. The most practical TFOV without light loss from vignetting has been about 3 degrees. The Obie's at F/5 should prove to have substantially wider views even if less clear aperture at the objective. Very nice.

I think you will find yourself using them all the time because of size and weight.


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KennyJ
The British Flash
*****

Reged: 04/27/03

Loc: Lancashire UK
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Vondragonnoggin]
      #6191312 - 11/12/13 06:24 PM

< I think you will find yourself using them all the time because of size and weight. >

I agree wholeheartedly!

While personal circumstances of location, financial clout and available free time affect all of us in different ways, for the majority of us, I suspect the "grab and go" aspect is probably the most important of all -- and let's face it, for two-eyed, night sky viewing, ANGLED binoculars just have to be preferable!

Kenny


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GlennLeDrew
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Reged: 06/18/08

Loc: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: KennyJ]
      #6191341 - 11/12/13 06:43 PM

I am somewhat surprised that the BT-70-45 works at 60mm. But the original BT-70-90 did also. However, the one I did check over (and tweak the collimation) for a friend did perform pretty well optically. I think that the stopping down of the aperture did improve at least the chromatic aberration. At higher power the diffraction pattern was rather clean.

To show that 60mm is no mean aperture, note that my current main instrument is a 50/60mm 'hybrid'. In the 20.8X60 mode I've discerned the needle of edge-on galaxy NGC 4565. Markarian's Chain of galaxies is well seen. The challenging Cocoon nebula is glimpsed without filtration. That's just the tip of the proverbial 'berg of subtle stuff within range. And of course the bigger things are often seen to better advantage than through larger instruments.


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JustaBoy
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 06/19/12

Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: KennyJ]
      #6191359 - 11/12/13 06:52 PM

Does anyone here remember when it was the the term "Quick Look Scope" morphed into "Grab and Go"?

It seems that the Quick Look Scope was a 60's sorta thing - I've built a few of them, mostly short focus 4.25" and 6" Nexts - Mountless Dobs, if you will. - AKA RFTs (Rich Field Scopes)

Binoculars are the Ultimate QLS/RFT!

Thanks,

-Chuck


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Eric63
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 06/16/12

Loc: Ottawa, Ontario
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: KennyJ]
      #6191387 - 11/12/13 07:06 PM

Kenny and Eric, I think you both hit the nail right on the head. In my situation, these will be my most used instrument.

Kind regards
Eric


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Mr. Bill
Postmaster
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Reged: 02/09/05

Loc: Northeastern Cal
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Stacy]
      #6192744 - 11/13/13 02:10 PM

Quote:


What I gather, is that the APM-100, in your opinion (and it would seem a few others) despite it's minor flaws, is the best bank for the buck in this general price area. Although the price does seem to have gone up a bit, they do occasionally advertise on Astromart, special deals in US dollars that include shipping.

I sold the parallel bino mount, as just a bit too unwieldy. Bino chairs I have been able to find, also seem underdeveloped and over-priced. That leaves me with a 45 or 90 design if I want to go bigger. The price of admission on the APM-100 seems reasonable, but I would be biting my nails to see if my sample made it across the world in collimation. I think I may keep an eye on the used market to see if something pops up.





I think the Euro price is the same....the exchange rate has changed.

IF you can find a used APM 100 45, make sure it is the most recent version that allows standard 1 1/4 eps. I bought a used one that turned out to be an earlier version that used factory eps but would not focus with my other eps. Returned to seller.



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Stacy
Star Partyer
*****

Reged: 09/15/02

Loc: Seattle, WA
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Mr. Bill]
      #6192762 - 11/13/13 02:18 PM

Quote:

Mr. Bill said:

I think the Euro price is the same....the exchange rate has changed.

IF you can find a used APM 100 45, make sure it is the most recent version that allows standard 1 1/4 eps. I bought a used one that turned out to be an earlier version that used factory eps but would not focus with my other eps. Returned to seller.






OK, thanks Bill, good point. Thanks again for all your hard work.


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JustaBoy
Post Laureate
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Reged: 06/19/12

Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Stacy]
      #6192776 - 11/13/13 02:27 PM

Actually, the USD has fallen a bit lately re: the EUR.

https://www.google.com/search?q=eru+usd&oq=eru+usd&aqs=chrome..69i57....

Thanks,

-Chuck


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Mr. Bill
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 02/09/05

Loc: Northeastern Cal
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: JustaBoy]
      #6192841 - 11/13/13 03:00 PM

Just pulled out paperwork...

June 21 2013 paid 947.54 Euros which tranlates into $1095 + $155 shipping or $1250 USD.

That works out to xchange of 1.319 in June...today's is 1.35.

Looks like today's USD price is $1197.38. Price has gone up about $100.

Maybe increase is due to Chinese prices to APM going up. I seem to remember Kevin B. at Big Binocular mentioning upcoming price increases during discussion of returning BT-70s this June.



Edited by Mr. Bill (11/14/13 02:42 PM)


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mattyfatz
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 12/27/06

Loc: Boise Idaho
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Eric63]
      #6192896 - 11/13/13 03:39 PM

congrats.. How will you mount them?
A nice smooth ALT-AZ mount I hope. What a sweet way to star hop!


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Eric63
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 06/16/12

Loc: Ottawa, Ontario
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: mattyfatz]
      #6192938 - 11/13/13 04:06 PM

In spirit of keeping these as grab and go as possible, I plan on using a Manfrotto 055XDB tripod with a MVH500AH head. I could also use an L bracket on my AZ4 if I want more stability.

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aa6ww
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 10/23/11

Loc: Sacramento, Calif.
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Eric63]
      #6264820 - 12/21/13 05:23 AM

have you tired them out yet Eric?

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Eric63
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 06/16/12

Loc: Ottawa, Ontario
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: aa6ww]
      #6265056 - 12/21/13 10:13 AM

Hi Ralph

I received my BT70 about two weeks ago, but the weather has been so horrible that I have only had a very brief outing one evening. We have had nothing but clouds and the very few nights it was clear, the temperature fell to -40C. I was therefore limited to viewing rooftops 250m away and a quick peak at the moon and Jupiter in between clouds one evening.

In short I like these very much for the grab and go need that I have. They are light, very easy to transport, very quick to setup and the tripod/head combo is perfect for this Binocular. The movement is very smooth with just a little shaking at high magnifications.

Now, I am a complete beginner so please take this brief review with a grain of salt. Also, I just want to note that I am fully aware that this binocular only has 63mm of clear aperture as opposed to 70mm. This did not stop me from getting these and I am very happy with my choice. This is what I have found so far with my limited tests.

I ordered the binoculars with a Manfrotto 055XDB tripod with an MVH500Ah head. I also ordered a multi reticle finder and a pair of 8mm EP (47X). The scope came with 24mm EP (16X) and I already had two 15mm Paradigms (25X). One evening I was able to view Jupiter and the moon in between clouds and used the three magnifications. I saw little to no false colour which made me very happy. Jupiter’s moons were very nice and the view was very crisp at both 16X and 25X. I find the 8mm EP more of a novelty. At that magnification I find one barrel to be slightly sharper than the other. The cloud belts on Jupiter were visible in the left barrel and less distinct in the right. With both eyes however they were very distinct. I much prefer the view in my 127Mak at 47X but I did not buy these binoculars for high power. The Moon however, is another story and the 8mm is very nice and it is very hard to notice any difference between barrels. To be fair I also have to note that the seeing was only 2/5 and that this is still a fast achromat. I really loved this binocular on the moon and seeing it with two eyes that close was a treat. I think I will now get a binoviewer for my Mak.

I had a quick peak at some stars in Orion and the colour rendition was beautiful, the only slight flaring that I could notice was caused by my eyes ( I see a little flaring in every single instrument I have tried). But I can’t wait to try this on the open skies, which is really what I bought it for. The colour of Betelgeuse was very striking and I see how I will love scanning the sky with this instrument. Last time I scanned the sky with my Newtonian, the star colours were uninspiring.

My roof top test confirmed that at 47X one barrel is slightly sharper (the grain in the roof shingles at 250 m away was a bit sharper in the left). I then tested different magnifications to see when the view was exactly the same on either side and found that figure to be around 35X. I also tested them side by side with my 15X70 Skymaster’s for kicks and interestingly enough I found the BT70 to be only a tad sharper on the roof tops, but the colour was much better. The BT70 produced a natural colour while the Skymaster’s gave a slight tint of yellow. The Skymasters have a wider FOV (4.5 degrees compared to 4 degrees for the BT70) and it is noticeable in the side by side test.

I have yet to check for sharpness at the edge of field or do any kind of star test on these, but I plan to do so when the weather improves.


Pros so far:
• smooth tripod and head.
• light grad and go setup.
• sharp on axis views (did not fully test off axis)
• comfortable viewing position with 45dgree angle.
• Beautiful colour rendition.
• Little to no false colour (noticed only on rooftops during daytime).

Cons so far
• Focuser a bit stiff in each barrel. This may be a problem in the cold. I have added a large clothespin to each knob when viewing to help with fine focusing.
• One barrel is slightly sharper than the other at high power.
• High power is more of a novelty. Sharper views in my Mak at low power.
• Need an Allen Key to take the finder on and off


Eric

Edited by Eric63 (12/21/13 11:57 AM)


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Rich56
member


Reged: 06/02/12

Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Eric63]
      #6265144 - 12/21/13 11:25 AM

Something tells me that using a pair of higher quality eyepieces Panoptics or Naglers might help.

Something else to add to your last second Christmas wish list??


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Eric63
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 06/16/12

Loc: Ottawa, Ontario
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Rich56]
      #6265159 - 12/21/13 11:43 AM

And I thought I could take a break from astro shopping

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JustaBoy
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 06/19/12

Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Eric63]
      #6265237 - 12/21/13 12:44 PM

Hi Eric,

When you say that one barrel is sharper than the other I assume that you are looking with only one eye - the same eye for both?

Thanks,


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Eric63
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 06/16/12

Loc: Ottawa, Ontario
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: JustaBoy]
      #6265329 - 12/21/13 01:47 PM

That's right. In fact same eye and same eyepiece to be sure. With both eyes it's all good.

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aa6ww
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 10/23/11

Loc: Sacramento, Calif.
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: Eric63]
      #6265371 - 12/21/13 02:10 PM

I took out my 100mm and my 15x70 ultra's out to check out comet Lovejoy this moring, getting out there about 3am. It was a spectacular site in my 15x70's, since the wide field of view really helped see the huge thin tail.

I use to use a pair of 11mm Naglers with my APM 100mm 45 deg bino's but they were too much magnification. I got sharper clearer star patterns using the 13 naglers. So I just kept the 13 Naglers and my 24 PanOptics for my binoculars. and really, 90 percent of the time, I 24 PanOptics are in them.
Regardless of the quality of your eyepieces, 47x may be pushing your bino's. My 11 Nagers were about that much magnification, and just didn't like how things looked.
I use the 11 Naglers with my denkmeiers though, so its all good.
Sounds like your going to be happy with them, especially the portability of them. Its just a mater of finding the right sets of eyepieces that make everything great.
Hopefully you can get in some comet hunting this time around before Lovejoy fades away.

Ralph

Quote:

Hi Ralph

I received my BT70 about two weeks ago, but the weather has been so horrible that I have only had a very brief outing one evening. We have had nothing but clouds and the very few nights it was clear, the temperature fell to -40C. I was therefore limited to viewing rooftops 250m away and a quick peak at the moon and Jupiter in between clouds one evening.

In short I like these very much for the grab and go need that I have. They are light, very easy to transport, very quick to setup and the tripod/head combo is perfect for this Binocular. The movement is very smooth with just a little shaking at high magnifications.

Now, I am a complete beginner so please take this brief review with a grain of salt. Also, I just want to note that I am fully aware that this binocular only has 63mm of clear aperture as opposed to 70mm. This did not stop me from getting these and I am very happy with my choice. This is what I have found so far with my limited tests.

I ordered the binoculars with a Manfrotto 055XDB tripod with an MVH500Ah head. I also ordered a multi reticle finder and a pair of 8mm EP (47X). The scope came with 24mm EP (16X) and I already had two 15mm Paradigms (25X). One evening I was able to view Jupiter and the moon in between clouds and used the three magnifications. I saw little to no false colour which made me very happy. Jupiter’s moons were very nice and the view was very crisp at both 16X and 25X. I find the 8mm EP more of a novelty. At that magnification I find one barrel to be slightly sharper than the other. The cloud belts on Jupiter were visible in the left barrel and less distinct in the right. With both eyes however they were very distinct. I much prefer the view in my 127Mak at 47X but I did not buy these binoculars for high power. The Moon however, is another story and the 8mm is very nice and it is very hard to notice any difference between barrels. To be fair I also have to note that the seeing was only 2/5 and that this is still a fast achromat. I really loved this binocular on the moon and seeing it with two eyes that close was a treat. I think I will now get a binoviewer for my Mak.

I had a quick peak at some stars in Orion and the colour rendition was beautiful, the only slight flaring that I could notice was caused by my eyes ( I see a little flaring in every single instrument I have tried). But I can’t wait to try this on the open skies, which is really what I bought it for. The colour of Betelgeuse was very striking and I see how I will love scanning the sky with this instrument. Last time I scanned the sky with my Newtonian, the star colours were uninspiring.

My roof top test confirmed that at 47X one barrel is slightly sharper (the grain in the roof shingles at 250 m away was a bit sharper in the left). I then tested different magnifications to see when the view was exactly the same on either side and found that figure to be around 35X. I also tested them side by side with my 15X70 Skymaster’s for kicks and interestingly enough I found the BT70 to be only a tad sharper on the roof tops, but the colour was much better. The BT70 produced a natural colour while the Skymaster’s gave a slight tint of yellow. The Skymasters have a wider FOV (4.5 degrees compared to 4 degrees for the BT70) and it is noticeable in the side by side test.

I have yet to check for sharpness at the edge of field or do any kind of star test on these, but I plan to do so when the weather improves.


Pros so far:
• smooth tripod and head.
• light grad and go setup.
• sharp on axis views (did not fully test off axis)
• comfortable viewing position with 45dgree angle.
• Beautiful colour rendition.
• Little to no false colour (noticed only on rooftops during daytime).

Cons so far
• Focuser a bit stiff in each barrel. This may be a problem in the cold. I have added a large clothespin to each knob when viewing to help with fine focusing.
• One barrel is slightly sharper than the other at high power.
• High power is more of a novelty. Sharper views in my Mak at low power.
• Need an Allen Key to take the finder on and off


Eric




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Eric63
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 06/16/12

Loc: Ottawa, Ontario
Re: Pulled the Trigger on Oberwerk BT-70-45 Binoculars new [Re: aa6ww]
      #6265536 - 12/21/13 03:48 PM

I plan on taking them with me to the cottage over Christmas. I have dark skies there and I'm sure they will not disappoint. I love the 45 degree angle, you cannot imagine the difference in comfort it makes. Also, being able to get into the 20x to 30x range will add a whole new dimension to binocular viewing. The cottage is at a small ski resort and luckily they have no night skiing.

I think I will also keep my eyes open for 24 Pans in the new year. Many have recommended them for a 127Mak and now they are recommended again for BT binoculars.

Eric


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