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Equipment Discussions >> Cats & Casses

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kkokkolisModerator
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Reged: 09/23/09

Loc: Piraeus, Greece
Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: jrbarnett]
      #6224017 - 11/29/13 06:55 PM

Show character gentlemen!
That's why there all these types of telescopes. To satisfy everyone. No need to get angry.
The op was humorous anyway, we should respect the spirit of this thread IMHO.


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ATM57
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Reged: 01/01/10

Loc: Tehachapi, CA
Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: Eddgie]
      #6224026 - 11/29/13 07:01 PM Attachment (37 downloads)

Quote:


Modders, please do not take offense. This is not directed at any individual. Rather it is just a rant about how so many people perceive so much wrong with a design that I have loved dearly over the decades, but now feel as if may be damaged by the perception that there is so much wrong with them.. So sad. Great telescopes.

At least one person loves them just the way they are...




Interesting rant As a modder, I agree that SCT's can be great instruments in standard form. When I mod one, that's what I start with: A GOOD ONE. I don't know about the other modders out there but some of my reasons for performing such things are:

1. If there is extra performance to be had I want it. (I do the same with OTHER TELESCOPE DESIGNS and computers)

2. I enjoy the challenge of making things perform better if possible. As an example, I once had a 80mm refractor that was an excellent performer but one simple tweak made it perform better. The retaining ring on the lens was too tight. Once loosened, I was able to see the companion to Rigel much easier than before under the same conditions.

3. I love the shock factor when I can clearly demonstrate that SCT's can be made to perform better for lunar, planetary, multiple star work than manufactured. As we all know, they are designed to satisfy many types of astronomical uses. You have to make some compromises if you are going to be a Jack-of-all-Trades. I turn them into speciality instruments.

4. I like having a unique telescope (like putting personal touches on your car) it sets your instrument apart from the crowd.

I could go on but...

The pic shows a basket case scope I once received. It had excellent optics but came with a lot of minor dents, scrapes and scratches. I modded this scope with passive cooling and eliminated the dents in the process. Custom covers were made for the vents. This scope is an excellent performer.

My mods are not performed to "put down" a design be it refractor, reflector or compound instrument. I just like making scopes perform better. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Scopejunkie


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Awesomelenny
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Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: ATM57]
      #6224044 - 11/29/13 07:14 PM

I have had all ... refractors, apo's, reflectors, SCT's and sorry, aperture rules! A really sweet scope like my Meade 14"ACF is awesome. Imagine having a 14" refractor, oh my goodness, I'd need a crane to haul THAT around!

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azure1961p
Postmaster
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Reged: 01/17/09

Loc: USA
Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: kkokkolis]
      #6224118 - 11/29/13 08:16 PM

Whose angry? I thought its been fairly good thread. Differing opinions here and there but nothing Id call anger. And the spirit of the OP was tongue n cheek anyway.

Pete


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Asbytec
Guy in a furry hat
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Reged: 08/08/07

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Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: ATM57]
      #6224140 - 11/29/13 08:28 PM

I agree totally with scopejunkie. If there is extra performance to be had, I want it. I love my own CAT as is, but if it can be better, "I want it." Its like owning a nice muscle car and taking time to tune it so it runs as good as it can run. Racing is all about those fine tuning tweaks and does not speak the quality of the underlying build, per se. When you're reaching for that additional photon, a fine tuning mod may give it to you. In fact, I liked my own so much (straight out of the box), I took the time and effort to study it and to fine tune it for maximum RPMs. We cruise the skies nightly. Even well built vintage US muscle cars can be faster than stock. So, really modding is not a detriment to the versatile SCT package, IMO. I've never been unhappy with any SCT I've owned and thoroughly enjoy my current 6" CAT...before and after modding it.

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ATM57
super member


Reged: 01/01/10

Loc: Tehachapi, CA
Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: Awesomelenny]
      #6224161 - 11/29/13 08:37 PM

Quote:

I have had all ... refractors, apo's, reflectors, SCT's and sorry, aperture rules! A really sweet scope like my Meade 14"ACF is awesome. Imagine having a 14" refractor, oh my goodness, I'd need a crane to haul THAT around!




Yeah, a 14" refractor would be a monster to be sure even if it was an APO. My C-9 is currently satisfying my large planetary scope needs. A 9" refractor could not be afforded even if I built my own hence my "modded" C-9. We all satisfy our needs in different ways.

Scopejunkie


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bremms
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Reged: 08/31/12

Loc: SC
Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: Jon Isaacs]
      #6224192 - 11/29/13 08:56 PM

I have two good SCTs. My 6" F8 Newtonian and 6" F10 achro outperform my C8 on most objects. The 6" Newtonian is a no contest..Hands down better at everything other than a little light gathering. I use my SCTs a bit. When take you into account so so optics (even good ones) field curvature, significant coma, limited FOV.... I like them for what they are. Portable aperature. Clever design. A friend and I tested three on an interferometer. Best one was just 1/2 wave p-v. Worst was about 1 wave. That was an SP C8. Another friend just bought. We managed to send it back and get another( that was the 1/2 wave). The C8s are very inexpensive for such a complex optic. They are just not going to be Zeiss quality.
I like my C8 and it has good optics for a C8. But it can't compete with a 6" newt with a 1/11wave PV mirror and small CO.


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ur7x
sage


Reged: 01/08/12

Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: Awesomelenny]
      #6224194 - 11/29/13 08:57 PM

Quote:

I have had all ... refractors, apo's, reflectors, SCT's and sorry, aperture rules! A really sweet scope like my Meade 14"ACF is awesome. Imagine having a 14" refractor, oh my goodness, I'd need a crane to haul THAT around!




I've had and still have them all. My 9.25 SCT kicks my F/5 6" Newts backside. So much so that the newt will likely soon be stored in a plastic box in the attic... And my newt came flocked from the factory

Put me down in the love my SCT and I have zero desire to take it apart and mess with it. It is already by far better than anything that I have tried to improve.


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ATM57
super member


Reged: 01/01/10

Loc: Tehachapi, CA
Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: Asbytec]
      #6224195 - 11/29/13 08:58 PM

Quote:

I agree totally with scopejunkie. If there is extra performance to be had, I want it. I love my own CAT as is, but if it can be better, "I want it." Its like owning a nice muscle car and taking time to tune it so it runs as good as it can run. Racing is all about those fine tuning tweaks and does not speak the quality of the underlying build, per se. When you're reaching for that additional photon, a fine tuning mod may give it to you. In fact, I liked my own so much (straight out of the box), I took the time and effort to study it and to fine tune it for maximum RPMs. We cruise the skies nightly. Even well built vintage US muscle cars can be faster than stock. So, really modding is not a detriment to the versatile SCT package, IMO. I've never been unhappy with any SCT I've owned and thoroughly enjoy my current 6" CAT...before and after modding it.




Excellent perspective

Scopejunkie


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JJK
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 04/28/08

Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: WesC]
      #6224199 - 11/29/13 08:58 PM

Quote:

And for every link you post showing a bad SCT. I can post an excellent one.

This proves NOTHING!!!!!




Is that true today? Less than a decade ago, there wasn't one C-11 I tested that I'd keep. If they're better now, perhaps it's time to pick up one or a C-14 and add a Hyperstar unit & camera on it.


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JJK
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 04/28/08

Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: Awesomelenny]
      #6224206 - 11/29/13 09:01 PM

Quote:

I have had all ... refractors, apo's, reflectors, SCT's and sorry, aperture rules! A really sweet scope like my Meade 14"ACF is awesome. Imagine having a 14" refractor, oh my goodness, I'd need a crane to haul THAT around!




If you want aperture, get a Dob-Newt.


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JJK
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 04/28/08

Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: ATM57]
      #6224209 - 11/29/13 09:03 PM

Quote:

Quote:

I have had all ... refractors, apo's, reflectors, SCT's and sorry, aperture rules! A really sweet scope like my Meade 14"ACF is awesome. Imagine having a 14" refractor, oh my goodness, I'd need a crane to haul THAT around!




Yeah, a 14" refractor would be a monster to be sure even if it was an APO. My C-9 is currently satisfying my large planetary scope needs. A 9" refractor could not be afforded even if I built my own hence my "modded" C-9. We all satisfy our needs in different ways.

Scopejunkie




While SCTs have their virtues, it would take much less than a 9" refractor to outperform a 9" SCT.


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ATM57
super member


Reged: 01/01/10

Loc: Tehachapi, CA
Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: JJK]
      #6224268 - 11/29/13 09:39 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

I have had all ... refractors, apo's, reflectors, SCT's and sorry, aperture rules! A really sweet scope like my Meade 14"ACF is awesome. Imagine having a 14" refractor, oh my goodness, I'd need a crane to haul THAT around!




Yeah, a 14" refractor would be a monster to be sure even if it was an APO. My C-9 is currently satisfying my large planetary scope needs. A 9" refractor could not be afforded even if I built my own hence my "modded" C-9. We all satisfy our needs in different ways.

Scopejunkie




While SCTs have their virtues, it would take much less than a 9" refractor to outperform a 9" SCT.




Not mine.

Scopejunkie


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Dwight J
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Reged: 05/14/09

Loc: Lethbridge, Alberta, Canada
Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: JJK]
      #6224272 - 11/29/13 09:40 PM

I wonder why then so many of the best planetary imagers and images use and are taken by C11's and 14's. Must be their low contrast, huge obstruction, and mushy optics. Oh, I almost forgot their eons long cooling time.

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dscarpa
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Reged: 03/15/08

Loc: San Diego Ca.
Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: Eddgie]
      #6224293 - 11/29/13 09:57 PM

The only issues my regular C9.25 has is a bit of image shift, a little coma and on a humid night it dews up before I can get it out the door. My scopes mount's a push to Unistar so no power but there's always a hair drier standing by! There's a lot less coma with the SCT than my new 11" F/5 newt without it's corrector. The newt has a high end mirror and should out perform the SCT with ease but what with viewing seated comfortably with the cat vs not sure yet with the newt that might not be the case for lunar-planetary in particular. On excellent nights I've used the C9.25 at 400X on Jupiter and 500X-550X on the Moon, Saturn and Mars with very detailed, crisp, bright high contrast images! David

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JJK
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 04/28/08

Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: Dwight J]
      #6224341 - 11/29/13 10:40 PM

Quote:

I wonder why then so many of the best planetary imagers and images use and are taken by C11's and 14's. Must be their low contrast, huge obstruction, and mushy optics. Oh, I almost forgot their eons long cooling time.




I didn't say decent SCTs don't exist. As I alluded to above, I've been looking to add one to my visual scope aresenal, but stopped a decade or so ago because none I critically tested (C-11s) could be pushed over 250 x on nights that my AP Mak-Cass was easily able to work well at 400 to 600 x. I'm thinking of looking again with the advent of Hyperstar. Looks like a lot of fun.


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JJK
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 04/28/08

Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: ATM57]
      #6224351 - 11/29/13 10:42 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

I have had all ... refractors, apo's, reflectors, SCT's and sorry, aperture rules! A really sweet scope like my Meade 14"ACF is awesome. Imagine having a 14" refractor, oh my goodness, I'd need a crane to haul THAT around!




Yeah, a 14" refractor would be a monster to be sure even if it was an APO. My C-9 is currently satisfying my large planetary scope needs. A 9" refractor could not be afforded even if I built my own hence my "modded" C-9. We all satisfy our needs in different ways.

Scopejunkie




While SCTs have their virtues, it would take much less than a 9" refractor to outperform a 9" SCT.




Not mine.

Scopejunkie




Which 9" refractors did you test your 9" SCT against, and on which targets?


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jgraham
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Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: JJK]
      #6224388 - 11/29/13 11:19 PM

I've got my 10" SCT outside right now taking images of Jupiter. Simply freek'n awesome.

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PowellAstro
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Reged: 10/14/09

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Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: JJK]
      #6224404 - 11/29/13 11:33 PM

TOP TEN REASONS WE LOVE OUR SCTs

1..Because they are great scopes!

2..As far as comfort goes, no other scope comes close!

3..They also are more steady per pound than a GEM of the same aperture! (for the same amount of money)

4..They are also lighter per aperture than most any other computer driven scope!

5..With a day or two of work, they can be as good as almost any other design could possibly be, with the same amount of CO that is! (A Good Unit)

6..They look great! Who wants to use an ugly scope? Not me.

7..They are the most convenient!

8..There are all kinds of accessories for them!

9..They do visual, they do photography!

10..They don't cost an arm and a leg and a child to own!

So, all things considered, what's not to like???


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ATM57
super member


Reged: 01/01/10

Loc: Tehachapi, CA
Re: Why do people even buy SCTs??? new [Re: JJK]
      #6224406 - 11/29/13 11:37 PM Attachment (15 downloads)

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

I have had all ... refractors, apo's, reflectors, SCT's and sorry, aperture rules! A really sweet scope like my Meade 14"ACF is awesome. Imagine having a 14" refractor, oh my goodness, I'd need a crane to haul THAT around!




Yeah, a 14" refractor would be a monster to be sure even if it was an APO. My C-9 is currently satisfying my large planetary scope needs. A 9" refractor could not be afforded even if I built my own hence my "modded" C-9. We all satisfy our needs in different ways.

Scopejunkie




While SCTs have their virtues, it would take much less than a 9" refractor to outperform a 9" SCT.




Not mine.

Scopejunkie




Which 9" refractors did you test your 9" SCT against, and on which targets?




I have built 3 8" refractors. Two at F/12 and 1 at F/9. I know how 8" refractors perform and would compare to my modified C-9.

Scopejunkie

Edited by ATM57 (11/29/13 11:43 PM)


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