camvan
Carpal Tunnel
   
Reged: 05/02/05
Posts: 2086
Loc: British Columbia
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it's a fairly new line of scope and I'm wondering how good it is. are there any reviews of it yet? I haven't seen any...
how big a difference is there bewteen the C130-MGT vs say the 150mm SVP from Orion? I have to say tho, the SVP only being the IntelliGuide is a bit of an annoyance compared to the C130's full motorized goto.
-------------------- Cameron
"Aperture can only be replaced by even more aperture. Dark transparent skies cannot be replaced by anything else." - Stathis Kafalis
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camvan
Carpal Tunnel
   
Reged: 05/02/05
Posts: 2086
Loc: British Columbia
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nobody has any thoughts on this scope?
-------------------- Cameron
"Aperture can only be replaced by even more aperture. Dark transparent skies cannot be replaced by anything else." - Stathis Kafalis
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marty
sage
Reged: 02/14/06
Posts: 284
Loc: Colorado, USA
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My name is Marty, and yes, I have a C130. Sounds like Alcoholics Anonymous. But seriously, I think the scope has gotten a bad reputation rather quickly, for various reasons.
The one I purchased cheap has a finder scope bracket that was so badly warped that there was no way to align it until I put it in a vise. Now its just fine. Optically, the scope is good! Clean, sharp images, no objectional color fringing on the moon, and planets, and decent on deep sky objects. The collimation was good from the factory, and stayed that way even after it took a HARD four foot tumble to the floor when it fell off a photo tripod while trying to thread it on the base. I'm happy with it as a semi-grab and go nighttime and daytime spotting scope. No problems with the flip mirror that everyone is worried about. It does have that weird clear lens that seals the scope that I wish I could remove, but I think the view is....satisfactory overall. Not WOW great, but pretty good. (I've previously owned an Intes MAK, Televue Genesis SDF, Pronto, Meade LX200 12", C5, C8, I think I know what a good image looks like). The C130-MGT with the go-to mount is a good package. I think it compares favorably against the Orion and many others. Chinese quality control is not that great yet. So be prepared for anything with any Chinese made scope, including a warped finder bracket. Would I buy another one for the price paid?????? Yeah........
p.s. If you get one, try to give the scope plenty of cool down time 1-2 hours to avoid disappointment. Hope this helps a little, just my opinion, I may be wrong.
Best Wishes,
Marty
Edited by marty (02/16/06 10:19 AM)
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marty
sage
Reged: 02/14/06
Posts: 284
Loc: Colorado, USA
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Addendum to my above post. I did not intend to disparage the quality of Chinese products with such a broad characterization. Undoubtedly there are many top quality products from China. Their scale of production has allowed many of us (myself included) to afford products that we could only previously dream about, IMHO.
Except maybe that sticky grease....
marty
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dougspeterson
professor emeritus
Reged: 09/01/04
Posts: 681
Loc: Murrieta, CA
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The primary is collimatable, which is a good thing because some of the earlier scopes were whacked out. Once collimated, the wavefront was suprisingly good. A lot of plastic, but the price is right compared to the C5.
-------------------- 18" Dob
12" SCT
8" TMB F6 + Chromacor
6" F6 APM/LZOS Fluorite triplet
2ea. 6mm singlets, one blind
"--Granted, that's a worse case scenario. The destruction might in fact be ... limited to our own galaxy."
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camvan
Carpal Tunnel
   
Reged: 05/02/05
Posts: 2086
Loc: British Columbia
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thanks for the thoughts guys, I'll keep them in mind when it's time to purcahse. this scopes combination fits into my price point
-------------------- Cameron
"Aperture can only be replaced by even more aperture. Dark transparent skies cannot be replaced by anything else." - Stathis Kafalis
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marty
sage
Reged: 02/14/06
Posts: 284
Loc: Colorado, USA
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Update on the C130: I managed to remove the "clear" lens that seals the back of the OTA, but severely diminishes its view. It wasn't easy, and I destroyed it in the process. The glass was so thick it was like looking through a double paned window. Now the scope has a clear unobstructed view. I'm waiting for clear skies to test it out. I know this scope has more potential than people think. I'll keep you posted...
marty
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darylf96
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 08/28/04
Posts: 1246
Loc: Danville, California
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I have the C130. The optics are quite good. However, the concept of the "spotting scope" really limits, rather than enhances, the quality and capabilities of this scope. If the scope had been desinged with a standard SCT visual back, rather than the C90 type, the scope would be much more useful. I have used the C90/130 camera adapter to allow a makeshift means of using quality diagonals for planetary viewing and it worked so well that I now avoid the flip mirror altogether. I am thinking that an adapter that would allow the use of SCT accessories should not be a difficult project. This would allow the use of quality focusers, diagonals, and even focal reducers.
-------------------- Intes Micro MN66 - Meade 10" SCT
Skywatcher 150mm f8 Achro
CGE Mount - DiscMount DM-6 on Meade Field Tripod
with SkyCommander DSC
Lumicon 80mm Super Finder
ED80 w MoonLite focuser on CG5A-GT mount
WO ZenithStar ST 80mm/WO B-viewer
Astro-Tech AT80 Refractor f6.9 APO
On SV M1 mount & Grab-Go Tripod
Stellarvue 20x85 binos - Unimount
Kunming United Optics 7x50 binocs
Canon Rebel XT, Canon 20D, SB ST8XE
Orion DSCI, Meade DSI
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marty
sage
Reged: 02/14/06
Posts: 284
Loc: Colorado, USA
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Scopetronix has a Large Accessory Ring (LAR) for the C90/130 that allows the use of SCT accessories. its listed under accessories for the ETX 125. http://www.scopetronix.com/ The folks at Mercury systems also have this adapter, which I'm waiting on. http://www.finefocuser.com/mak102.html Its unfortunate that manufacturers don't think of these things ahead of time, but then we wouldn't have this much fun improving our scopes?
marty
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GeneDiG
sage
Reged: 05/31/05
Posts: 264
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I have the C-130 as well. Currently it's mounted on an AZ-3 mount. The OTA seems a little heavy for the mount. So far, I have been pleased with the 'scope. Like others that have posted, I had the misaligned finder problem too. I haven't used it much as I am waiting (saving the bucks) for a good GEM to mount it on. Last summer I observed Jupiter and was able to pick up four dark bands using the 32mm eyepiece at 63x. With a long f/l, the C130 won't have a wide field of view, so I plan on using it mostly for planetary observing.
Hope this helps, Gene
-------------------- Gene DiGennaro
Baltimore, Md.
Celestron C-130 5" Mak
Celestron Firstscope 80eq
Tasco/Vixen 999VR
Tasco 11t Vintage Newtonian
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marty
sage
Reged: 02/14/06
Posts: 284
Loc: Colorado, USA
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Hi Gene! You are right about the AZ-3 mount. I don't know why it is advertized as being suitable for the C130, since it won't hold its altitude position with the weight of the OTA on it. I have been able to modify my AZ-3 by adding a home made plastic washer to take the slip and slop out of the mechanism. I also fashioned some brackets that allow me to hang a counterweight to the tripod head. It looks ridiculous, but it seems to work.
I am currently working on instructions for removing the "weird clear lens" that handicaps the C130. I spent two hours last night writing a post, had it finished, then my computer froze up and it got deleted. Probably a good thing because it was way too long anyway. I'm striving to shorten my long winded posts... Not there yet, this one is a good example.
marty
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marty
sage
Reged: 02/14/06
Posts: 284
Loc: Colorado, USA
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Here is a link to another adapter for the C130:
http://www.finefocuser.com/maksct.html
marty
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camvan
Carpal Tunnel
   
Reged: 05/02/05
Posts: 2086
Loc: British Columbia
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well, I don't know how it compares, but I got to see thru an Orion 127mm MCT today. we were going to look at the sun via a homemade solar filter of mylar (from Baader) but just as we got everything setup, what do you think happened? clouds. well, the owner of the shop (Vancouver Telescope) wanted to show us some of the resolving power of the scope. he took the telephone pole across the street (4 lanes) and focused it on some metal bands that were wrapped around it. we had fun reading the stamped letting on the scope like we had our nose up against the banding! very impressive I must say!
-------------------- Cameron
"Aperture can only be replaced by even more aperture. Dark transparent skies cannot be replaced by anything else." - Stathis Kafalis
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Trekker 308
journeyman
Reged: 02/09/06
Posts: 6
Loc: Ringwood, Hampshire, UK
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.... and the Orion is not so bad when it's pointed skywards either! Mine has given me a great deal of enjoyment, to the point where the MN78 is in danger of feeling neglected ....
-------------------- Allan
_________
WO FLT110
WO Megrez90
Orion Starmax 127mm Mak-Cass
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camvan
Carpal Tunnel
   
Reged: 05/02/05
Posts: 2086
Loc: British Columbia
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Quote:
.... to the point where the MN78 is in danger of feeling neglected ....
GADZOOKS! surely there cannot be much of a cmoparison between the two? the MN78 would have s smaller secondary obstruction and all. the only reason I could fathom such a thing is the size/portability difference between the two!
-------------------- Cameron
"Aperture can only be replaced by even more aperture. Dark transparent skies cannot be replaced by anything else." - Stathis Kafalis
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darylf96
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 08/28/04
Posts: 1246
Loc: Danville, California
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Marty:
Thanks! I just ordered the Mercury Sysetms unit. Actually, I have Precice Parts making a threaded adapter right now that will allow me to use SCT accessories.
As far as mounts go, though I have both the CG5-A GT and the CGE mount, at home I use an Orion Astroview with the 130 Mak all the time. Works great. The slow motion controls are very smooth even at the zenith. No problems with focuser shakes, though I focus very gingerly! That little mount is just right for the C130 as well as the 80ED. I can't advise the AZ-3. Can't control the scope pointed near the zenith. It is just sooo much better to have a nicely balanced scope. The Astroview is kept in a corner of my garage and is easy to haul outside. The only work is the thumbscrews for the accessory tray, which is necessary for stiffening the tripod.
-------------------- Intes Micro MN66 - Meade 10" SCT
Skywatcher 150mm f8 Achro
CGE Mount - DiscMount DM-6 on Meade Field Tripod
with SkyCommander DSC
Lumicon 80mm Super Finder
ED80 w MoonLite focuser on CG5A-GT mount
WO ZenithStar ST 80mm/WO B-viewer
Astro-Tech AT80 Refractor f6.9 APO
On SV M1 mount & Grab-Go Tripod
Stellarvue 20x85 binos - Unimount
Kunming United Optics 7x50 binocs
Canon Rebel XT, Canon 20D, SB ST8XE
Orion DSCI, Meade DSI
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darylf96
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 08/28/04
Posts: 1246
Loc: Danville, California
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If anyone has removed the sealing glass from their C130 Mak, I would sure like some instructions.
My views of Saturn have been very good with this scope. I don't know how much detail might be lost due to the glass plate, but I do note that it causes scattered light reflections that are bothersome. I am convinced that the views would be improved with the removal of this plate.
-------------------- Intes Micro MN66 - Meade 10" SCT
Skywatcher 150mm f8 Achro
CGE Mount - DiscMount DM-6 on Meade Field Tripod
with SkyCommander DSC
Lumicon 80mm Super Finder
ED80 w MoonLite focuser on CG5A-GT mount
WO ZenithStar ST 80mm/WO B-viewer
Astro-Tech AT80 Refractor f6.9 APO
On SV M1 mount & Grab-Go Tripod
Stellarvue 20x85 binos - Unimount
Kunming United Optics 7x50 binocs
Canon Rebel XT, Canon 20D, SB ST8XE
Orion DSCI, Meade DSI
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Gendo
Post Laureate
   
Reged: 12/12/05
Posts: 3231
Loc: Rexburg, ID
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Hey guys,
I too own one of these, the Konus version. I think removing the glass would help decrease light scattering. Mine does that quite a bit when viewing Saturn. It appears to be 2 pieces of glass butted up side by side in mine as I see a vertical optical line through the 45 degree EP holder.
Does anyone know how best to collimate these scopes? There are 3 philips head screws and 3 nuts (not sure what size <10mm) all of which are sealed in position with an orange colored glue-like stuff. I don't know if a laser would help. Looking down the front of the scope I see one dark ring that is slightly off, but I thought it might be an off center baffle. Looking down the the back of the tube with the eyepiece holders removed, it seems something is a little off since the smallest reflection seen in the secondary mirror is off center.
I'm fairly certain it is a little out of collimation since CD on Saturn is hard to ever make out, and even when I can see it, it's fleeting. I can't recall if it was intra-focus or extra-focus, but on one side of focus the secondary shadow was a little off to one side. Stars don't come to a pinpoint, but rather they appear to have short, irregular almost diffraction looking spikes, some longer on one side of the star than the other. I haven't seen an airy disk, but the mediocre seeing I've been stuck withh all winter might be the culprit there.
I've also noticed that the flip mirror goes a bit too far when switching to the right angle EP holder, but a bit of glue where the mirror's foot rests against the plastic housing might fix that.
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marty
sage
Reged: 02/14/06
Posts: 284
Loc: Colorado, USA
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Thanks for the mount tip darylf96, and Gendo, look very carefully at your 45 degree ep holder, mine has a very thin vertical line on the prism, that is seen through the eyepiece, depending on focus. I can't wait to retire that thing permanently. Instructions on how I removed the lens that seals the OTA are in my next post.
marty
Edited by marty (02/25/06 12:41 AM)
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marty
sage
Reged: 02/14/06
Posts: 284
Loc: Colorado, USA
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*Warning: This post contains violent acts against a telescope and may not be suitable for all readers. This post tells how I removed the "weird clear lens" that "seals" the OTA of Chinese made C130 Maksutovs, and in my opinion handicaps and diminishes the view through the scope.
Tools needed: Eye protection, hammer, chisel, Dremel Tool w/cutoff disk, philips screwdriver, generic replacement focus knob or flexible focus cable. You also need a "Gonzo" "nothing risked, nothing gained" attitude. Additionally, you may damage your scope and void your warranty by doing this, so think about it carefully before proceeding. The Celestron C130 now comes with a "No Fault, No Questions Asked, Warranty" but I don't know if it would cover this... The reason I did it was that I was convinced I could get more out of this scope, and the fact that I only paid $175 new/demo, from a local camera shop that was desperate to get rid of it. The owner hated the scope, so I gave it a home. One of the few bargains I can remember in my life.
The first and hardest step for me was removing the focus knob. You can't just pry it off, it won't budge! If you remove the rubber knurling, you'll find a tiny hole that you think has a set screw. I tried every small allen wrench and micro screwdriver I had with no luck. The Dremel tool was then used to cut off the focus knob, without cutting the shaft, or your fingers. Now remove the three philips screws that hold the rear assembly to the OTA. You will now see...Collimation Screws!
But we won't talk too much about those screws in this post, the goal here is to remove the window pane glass that you now see Epoxy glued to the back of the housing. Too bad they didn't just put in a retaining ring, mine was glued solid. After contemplating what you are about to do, bring hammer and chisel to bear on the lens. WHACK! WHACK! WHACK! The glass is as thick as an old Coke bottle! Remove and be careful of broken shards of glass. If you want to, you can also unscrew the vertical eyepiece tube and remove the other "weird clear lens" that is hiding in there. Now is also the time to adjust flip mirror if necessary and fiddle with collimation, (but I don't know how you would do it accurately with the rear assembly off). To finish, put cover back on, tighten the three screws, attach new knob or flexi focus cable and you are done!
You now have a clear and unobstructed view straight into the OTA, the way it should have come from the factory. IMO. My first light with my "improved" C130 produced a remarkably noticeable improvement in light throughput and increased sharpness. I am still waiting on a new visual back, (so I can use a high quality diagonal) that will improve it even further. Final comments in a later post.
*Note to moderator, this post should probably be in the DIY Forum. I posted it here because this thread was still alive, and I was kind of embarrassed to start a new topic with the above information, i.e., (Hammer, chisel, etc...) Please move if necessary.
marty
Edited by marty (02/25/06 03:59 AM)
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