t.r.
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 02/14/08
Posts: 806
Loc: Upstate NY
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From what I gathered in the previous historical threads, it is safe to use a "rusted" PST. Is this correct? I looked through my rusted PST yesterday, same details visible with just a little clouding. I'm too afraid to send it off to Meade right now for refit with their problems...any advice appreciated. thanks
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Present Stable:
Kmart 40mm(first scope @ age 8)Jason60mm,C80SS,PST,C6XLT,AP130 "Gran Turismo" C-11XLT
EQ-2,CG-4,ASGT-5,DenkII's,TV(zoom,plossls,Ethos),Pentax XW's,(ordered)Brandon Anniversary sets, ZAOII 4mm,BaaderZoom and other un-notables
"For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring."
Carl Sagan
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Jim Rosenstock
Post Laureate
Reged: 07/14/05
Posts: 4196
Loc: MD, south of the DC Nebula
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Meade/Coronado has stated that there is no safety issue with using "rusted" PSTs.
But consider this: if you won't trust them with your PST, should you trust them with your eyesight? 
Jim
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t.r.
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 02/14/08
Posts: 806
Loc: Upstate NY
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No kidding!!! How have the latest repairs gone...
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Present Stable:
Kmart 40mm(first scope @ age 8)Jason60mm,C80SS,PST,C6XLT,AP130 "Gran Turismo" C-11XLT
EQ-2,CG-4,ASGT-5,DenkII's,TV(zoom,plossls,Ethos),Pentax XW's,(ordered)Brandon Anniversary sets, ZAOII 4mm,BaaderZoom and other un-notables
"For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring."
Carl Sagan
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George N
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 05/19/06
Posts: 778
Loc: Binghamton & Indian Lake NY
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Quote:
..How have the latest repairs gone...
They’ve had mine for 5 weeks. I called today and they acknowledge having it, but said that they have no idea when the repair will be completed. Oh, ya….. they did hit my credit card for the cost of evaluating my PST as soon as they received it – something they told me was part of the deal when I first called. They were still not able to tell me the total cost for repair as of yet.
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George N
Obsession 20
Optical Guidance Systems 10" F/9 R-C Cass
6" F/5 & 8" F/8 home-made Newts
MI-250 mount
SBIG STL-1301E CCD
Member, International Dark-Sky Association
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stars_in_my_eyes
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 03/24/08
Posts: 803
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I have yet to see ANYTHING that says a rusted scope is safe.
Use it at your own risk.
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CESDewar
GorillAstronomer
Reged: 01/16/05
Posts: 2075
Loc: Morganton, GA, USA
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Quote:
How have the latest repairs gone...
I know that several people have raised issues with Meade's service, but I have to say that my PST was handled just fine. Yes, it took a lot of work to find out just who/where to send it, but once that was out of the way, I sent it off, and it arrived back about 4 weeks later, completely fixed at no charge. I really can't complain at all - the service was beyond reproach. I know others had problem experiences, but I think more than a few people shared my experience too...
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KerryR
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 12/05/07
Posts: 1420
Loc: SW Michigan
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Where is it that Meade/Coronado or anyone else with authority explicitly states that a rusted PST is safe?
Does anyone have a link to an actual authoritative statement?
If the guys from Lunt understand the about the issue (it's their design, after all) maybe they could respond to this, maybe with actual data, and lay our fears to rest (or confirm them-- Though I know they wouldn't want to be liable for saying anything that could make Meade sue them for libel or slander).
This keeps coming up here, but I NEVER actually see anything other than heresay.
Let's get this settled and posted with a sticky, if we get an actual statement from anyone...
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Kerry
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Jim Rosenstock
Post Laureate
Reged: 07/14/05
Posts: 4196
Loc: MD, south of the DC Nebula
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Quote:
Quote:
How have the latest repairs gone...
I know that several people have raised issues with Meade's service, but I have to say that my PST was handled just fine. Yes, it took a lot of work to find out just who/where to send it, but once that was out of the way, I sent it off, and it arrived back about 4 weeks later, completely fixed at no charge. I really can't complain at all - the service was beyond reproach. I know others had problem experiences, but I think more than a few people shared my experience too...
That was pretty much my experience getting my rusted BF replaced. The end result was a perfectly functioning scope at no extra cost. I'd have been happier if it had taken two weeks' less time, and fewer phone calls involving being on hold for long periods, but Meade DID step up to the plate and took responsibility for getting it properly fixed. Meade deserves credit for this.
This repair was done some time ago, after the Meade takeover, but well before the move to Mexico. It seems that there have been some communication/shipping glitches between Irvine and the Mexico plant, that has sometimes "boogered up" the warranty repair process lately.
Hopefully Meade will work through these logistical glitches, and also hopefully there will be less need for warranty repairs of their products in the future. As I've stated before, none of us in the amateur astronomy community would be well served by Meade going under. I wish them well.
Jim
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KerryR
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 12/05/07
Posts: 1420
Loc: SW Michigan
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Let's get back to the OP's topic.
This isn't a thread about Meade's repair policies and procedures. That has been discussed extensively elsewhere.
It's about a potential safety issue, particularly important on the newer PST where the BF is interior and not examinable without violating the warranty or possible dammage to the PST.
On Topic: Are these things safe when "rusted"? Where can we read about it?
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Kerry
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stephenramsden
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 08/17/07
Posts: 1640
Loc: Atlanta, GA--USA
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Wow, that's cool. How long has your wife worked for Meade?
just kidding.
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Stephen W. Ramsden
Atlanta, GA--USA
NASA SOLAR SYSTEM AMBASSADOR
www.solarastrophotography.com
www.SolarScopeReviews.com
www.stephenramsden.com
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Jim Rosenstock
Post Laureate
Reged: 07/14/05
Posts: 4196
Loc: MD, south of the DC Nebula
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Quote:
Let's get back to the OP's topic.
This isn't a thread about Meade's repair policies and procedures. That has been discussed extensively elsewhere.
Excuse me, pal, but the original poster wrote:
Quote:
....I'm too afraid to send it off to Meade right now for refit with their problems...any advice appreciated. thanks
So I'd say that discussions of Meade's ability to do a timely repair to a PST are indeed on-topic.
If you don't think so, take it up with a moderator. Or, sign up to be one.
Jim
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colinsk
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 01/17/08
Posts: 2170
Loc: CA
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I personally feel it is safe, however this is the only official responce posted to Cloudy Nights and as far as I know the only official response. (Russ has since left Meade.)
Quote:
Here is the reply I got on 08/29:
Hello Thomas,
Thank you for your offer to post on Cloudy Nights.
The "breakdown" or rust colored appearance that has been seen on front objectives of some PSTs is a result of degradation of the ITF coating. Our ITF's are being supplied by an outside source. Upon arrival at Coronado they were cemented and assembled into the PST objective. Unfortunately, when improperly handled, meaning too much time before cementing whether at the vendor, Coronado or both degradation began. This degradation could not be seen during the assembly process or in our field testing prior to shipment. The coating started to visibly degrade a few months after assembly. Because this problem does not affect safety (only performance) and does not affect all PSTs, Coronado is repairing the affected units rather than issuing a general recall.
Our current procedure is to use another style of the ITF and locate it further down in the optical tube. These units will look different as the front objective will be clear, but neither safety nor performance are adversely affected by this change.
Best regards,
Russ Tanton
Coronado Instruments
(866) 786-9282
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Mahalo,
Colin Kaminski
Coulter 10.1" Dobsonian
TV-76/Baader Film White Light
LS60T/DS50/FT/BF1200
LDX-75
AT Voyager
Edited by colinsk (12/03/08 03:30 PM)
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KerryR
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 12/05/07
Posts: 1420
Loc: SW Michigan
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Sheesh, Jim, it wasn't a personal attack! Lighten up.
I thought the primary issue was safety, as indicated by the thread title, and I didn't want the safety issue to get lost in the glare if the topic shifted towards Meade's repair procedures-- always a hot debate.
The safety issue has taken a back seat multiple times before in rust threads, and I thought it'd be nice for everyone with a PST if we could get that issue resolved.
We can't quantify Meade's customer service as we just don't have enough data; this forum is too small a sample. So, the topic always goes into heated exchange.
We CAN, however (hopefully) quantify the risks of using a rusting PST.
I think the OP meant that he didn't want to try sending his PST in if the rust wasn't preventing him from seeing Ha detail, in light of Meade's current reputation, unless detail loss and/or safety was an issue. I think in his appeal for advice he was hoping to hear the degree to which he may or may not be losing Ha detail, and whether or not safety was a concern. Maybe he can clarify what his biggest concern really is, and we can discuss that...
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Kerry
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Don W
Demi-God
Reged: 05/19/03
Posts: 15145
Loc: Wisconsin, USA
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To all. If you feel that a post is out of line or outside the Terms of Service, notify a moderator. That's what we get paid the big money for. Ok we don't get paid any money, but that's what we're here for. We don't mind if a thread goes off topic a bit as long as it remains civil. Now let's get this one back on that track.
The moderator team.
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Don Wyman
Obsession 18" f/4.5 #1166
W/Argo Navis DSC and Torus Primary
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Jim Rosenstock
Post Laureate
Reged: 07/14/05
Posts: 4196
Loc: MD, south of the DC Nebula
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Quote:
I personally feel it is safe, however this is the only official responce posted to Cloudy Nights and as far as I know the only official response. (Russ has since left Meade.)
What would it take to get a well-rusted PST independently safety-tested?
Jim
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Don W
Demi-God
Reged: 05/19/03
Posts: 15145
Loc: Wisconsin, USA
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Who is qualified to do such tests?
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Don Wyman
Obsession 18" f/4.5 #1166
W/Argo Navis DSC and Torus Primary
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colinsk
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 01/17/08
Posts: 2170
Loc: CA
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It would not be that hard. Figure it has to be OD6 from around 350nm to 2000nm and OD4 from 2000nm to 4000nm to meet the EU long term occupational exposure standards.
It would be easier to measure this than measuring the bandwidth of a filter. I think the sun as a source and a diffraction grating with a spectrum analyser would do the trick for a hobbyist. I have never tried so I am only guessing but I am sure the filter manufacturers that are coating the filters have the equipment to certify such things. I know when I read the specs on edge and notch filters they specify the off band blocking in OD.
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Mahalo,
Colin Kaminski
Coulter 10.1" Dobsonian
TV-76/Baader Film White Light
LS60T/DS50/FT/BF1200
LDX-75
AT Voyager
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nytecam
Postmaster
Reged: 08/20/05
Posts: 5996
Loc: London UK
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Quote:
were still not able to tell me the total cost for repair as of yet.
Had my 'rustie' swapped by the UK dealer 18 months ago but, if I recall, the PST has a 5 yr warrentee - right 
PS:I love the americanese of answering my own questions 
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Nytecam 51N 0.1W
Meade 30cm LX200+ETX-70+e-finder+C8+Ha+CaK PSTs SBIG SGS+homebuilt spectrographs
Starlight SXVF_M9+Lodestar CCDs/Canon 300D DSLR/Hitachi HD+Disgo Video Fun cams
My observatory build-ETX-70 imaging-my videos
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t.r.
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 02/14/08
Posts: 806
Loc: Upstate NY
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Quote:
I think the OP meant that he didn't want to try sending his PST in if the rust wasn't preventing him from seeing Ha detail, in light of Meade's current reputation, unless detail loss and/or safety was an issue. I think in his appeal for advice he was hoping to hear the degree to which he may or may not be losing Ha detail, and whether or not safety was a concern. Maybe he can clarify what his biggest concern really is, and we can discuss that...
You nailed it! I still see the detail I used to, with a slight haze now. Rather than go through the repair nightmare...IS IT SAFE. I understand that may be beyond anyone here, just want thoughts and ideas.
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Present Stable:
Kmart 40mm(first scope @ age 8)Jason60mm,C80SS,PST,C6XLT,AP130 "Gran Turismo" C-11XLT
EQ-2,CG-4,ASGT-5,DenkII's,TV(zoom,plossls,Ethos),Pentax XW's,(ordered)Brandon Anniversary sets, ZAOII 4mm,BaaderZoom and other un-notables
"For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring."
Carl Sagan
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Jim Rosenstock
Post Laureate
Reged: 07/14/05
Posts: 4196
Loc: MD, south of the DC Nebula
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Quote:
Who is qualified to do such tests?
Not me, certainly. But it seems like it shouldn't be that tough, for somebody with the proper skills & equipment (and access to a "rusty"). I would think we have that capability within our own little community here....
Because of liability issues, continuing to use a degraded Solar filter will always be a personal decision....but it would be nice to have some test data on a rusted PST, to help in that decision.
Cheers,
Jim
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